Dirty Eddie Posted August 3, 2011 Share Posted August 3, 2011 Well he already "Outed" petey as being shit on here, then kinda took it back when petey spoke to him and took his advice on board. Danny rod doesn't need a huge amount more outing, as a business man it's reasonably well known at this point that has a number of areas he could improve in. A situation which will either drastically improve come october when he puts on shawn michaels and the 1PW goodbye show, or stay roughly the same if as expected everything falls through. I'd like to see anyone like the first one get it though, but I dunno how many of them there are out there? That'd be quite a good crusade for people on here to get all excited about, shitarse's come and go but dangerous training schools really do need wiped out. Â Â Yeah, I agree that the focus on training schools would make most sense. The thing is, half of the shitarse wrestlers/promotions that he might have shit-upon also run training schools on the side. Half of the useless promotions in this country also run training sessions and it's probably where they get their small bit of money from to actually run money-losing shows. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dirty Eddie Posted August 3, 2011 Share Posted August 3, 2011 Who is this Gangsta? I've never heard of him. Â Â Â Gangster and the American Allstar run weekly training sessions right now! Get in there kids! Â I realize using a near ten year old clip is pretty cheap on my part, but searching for UCW wrestling and Ganster on youtube seems to lead to lots of gay bedroom wrestling clips?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fye Posted August 3, 2011 Share Posted August 3, 2011 Possibly, stuff like dodgy trainers I'd say should definately get it, cos that's just dangerous and could up end hurting kids and shit. People working for free just seems like picking on people at the very bottom of the pile though, little uncomfortable. Â i think its a case of those working for free are preventing the true pros from getting jobs as promoters use unpaid lads instead Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members Kaz Hayashi Posted August 3, 2011 Paid Members Share Posted August 3, 2011 I like the look of his wrist tape Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kiffy Posted August 3, 2011 Share Posted August 3, 2011 I'm obviously missing something, I just don't see how someone working a hardcore match is better, worse or the same as someone working for expenses, I don't see the link. Are you suggesting hardcore matches are bad for wrestling? Â I'm saying there's certainly a train of thought within wrestling, and amongst alot of wrestlers, that they are yes. Especially when you get into stuff with lightbulbs and the like. From guys working all star all the way up to Jim Cornette there is a view that it's not real wrestling, is basically mutilating yourself in front of crowds and by doing it you're conditioning fans to want more than wrestlers are prepared to give, ruining whole territories. I don't subscribe to the theory meself, but then I don't subscribe to the theory that there's anything inherantly wrong with working for ex's either. But it's certainly out there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kiffy Posted August 3, 2011 Share Posted August 3, 2011 i think its a case of those working for free are preventing the true pros from getting jobs as promoters use unpaid lads instead  Oh I realise that's the theory. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators PowerButchi Posted August 3, 2011 Moderators Share Posted August 3, 2011 Â Â Gangster and the American Allstar run weekly training sessions right now! Get in there kids! Â I realize using a near ten year old clip is pretty cheap on my part, but searching for UCW wrestling and Ganster on youtube seems to lead to lots of gay bedroom wrestling clips?? Â Against Alex Shane with Mick Foley as ref - Â Gangster has BILL APTER as his valet there as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ant Posted August 3, 2011 Share Posted August 3, 2011 I've not read the full thread as I'm at work, but am I right in saying that essentially Iceman is calling randoms up that he deems to be shit/backyarders and harrassing them then putting footage/sound on a public medium? Â If so I'm absolutely astounded. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members Kaz Hayashi Posted August 3, 2011 Paid Members Share Posted August 3, 2011 I'm saying there's certainly a train of thought within wrestling, and amongst alot of wrestlers, that they are yes. Especially when you get into stuff with lightbulbs and the like. From guys working all star all the way up to Jim Cornette there is a view that it's not real wrestling, is basically mutilating yourself in front of crowds and by doing it you're conditioning fans to want more than wrestlers are prepared to give, ruining whole territories. I don't subscribe to the theory meself, but then I don't subscribe to the theory that there's anything inherantly wrong with working for ex's either. But it's certainly out there. Â Â I do 100% see what your getting at, although i cant say i fully agree either Kiff (like you, i dont fully subscribe). The one main reason being, the hardcore death match style is/was popularised before the likes of iceman did his thing. I think that fans of that style who saw it on tapes/internet etc, wanted to see it anyway. This way its a case of 'giving the fans what they want', not a case of 'lets make money from not paying for crap wrestlers'. (just to point out, im not a fan of death match styles). Â I do see the avenue your going down though, 'would it hurt the bookings of non garbage wrestlers?'... but when does that idea stop? Would hiring flipy flopy top ropers stop the bookings of technical mat wrestlers? Does brining over talent from the USA stop the booking of UK guys? The answer is Yes, i suppose it would, if thats what the fans wanted to see and paid money to see. I dont think fans pay money to see the lad who doesnt want paid and isnt very good. I can only go from a fans point of view! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members DJ Kris Posted August 3, 2011 Paid Members Share Posted August 3, 2011 I'm saying there's certainly a train of thought within wrestling, and amongst alot of wrestlers, that they are yes. Especially when you get into stuff with lightbulbs and the like. From guys working all star all the way up to Jim Cornette there is a view that it's not real wrestling, is basically mutilating yourself in front of crowds and by doing it you're conditioning fans to want more than wrestlers are prepared to give, ruining whole territories. I don't subscribe to the theory meself, but then I don't subscribe to the theory that there's anything inherantly wrong with working for ex's either. But it's certainly out there. Now I get where you're coming from I can disagree with the view. Whilst I understand why guys like Cornette would have the view that it's not proper wrestling, I wouldn't agree that it doesn't have it's place. I spent 11 years working with a more extreme promotion and seeing guys with the wrestling abilities of Phil Bedwell and Ashe batter the shit out of each other to the point where Phil was literally spurting blood really got the crowd excited. But here's the thing, it didn't matter that they used tables, chairs and god knows what else those boys got their hands on, they still told their story and they told it maybe better than someone stepping in the ring with a mat classic. Â Hardcore wrestling isn't bad for the business, bad execution is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kiffy Posted August 3, 2011 Share Posted August 3, 2011 That's my view as well, but then I don't think working for ex's to get seen in a promotion is necesarrily bad for wrestling either. Hell I love deathmatch working, my view is that wrestling has and does evolve and death match wrestlings out there now, and it's fun so more power to it. I'd love to watch a czw tourny of death or something of that ilk live. But my view is also that wrestling has so little money in it that ya may need to work for expenses, no harm no foul, if it stops the experienced guy getting on the show he needs to raise his game and be indispensable to it. There's arguments against both, but if you're approaching a business from a purely old school frame of mind then ya kinda need to be old school yourself, and getting faceplanted through lighttubes isn't, at all. Plus, ya know, iceman's a paedo, so he needs someone to be giving him shit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dirty Eddie Posted August 3, 2011 Share Posted August 3, 2011 I do see the avenue your going down though, 'would it hurt the bookings of non garbage wrestlers?'... but when does that idea stop? Would hiring flipy flopy top ropers stop the bookings of technical mat wrestlers? Does brining over talent from the USA stop the booking of UK guys? The answer is Yes, i suppose it would, if thats what the fans wanted to see and paid money to see. I dont think fans pay money to see the lad who doesnt want paid and isnt very good. Â Â That's exactly right, and the key difference. Â It's not a matter of stylistic choice, it's a case of being good enough to actually go out and perform for a paying crowd. There is little wrong with working for expenses for your first few shows (working with new people in new companies) but when you are still doing that years down the line then perhaps you are just not good enough to demand a wage. If that's the case, please stop doing it, and allow someone to take your place who may have a change of genuine improvement and who may one day make a living from it. Â The more paid work that genuine talents can get, the more they can spend on ring attire, training, gym time, tanning etc... The more of that we have, the better the UK shows will become. Promoters that book shows with one 'name' getting paid and everyone else working for free is doing damage in various ways to the UK scene. It may seem like a small thing, but when it happens everywhere, every month it all adds up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Cum Doctor Posted August 3, 2011 Share Posted August 3, 2011 If a type of wrestling has a fan, then it has a place in wrestling. It's about giving the fans what they want. That goes for deathmatch wrestling. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members Kaz Hayashi Posted August 3, 2011 Paid Members Share Posted August 3, 2011 That's my view as well, but then I don't think working for ex's to get seen in a promotion is necesarrily bad for wrestling either. Hell I love deathmatch working, my view is that wrestling has and does evolve and death match wrestlings out there now, and it's fun so more power to it. I'd love to watch a czw tourny of death or something of that ilk live. But my view is also that wrestling has so little money in it that ya may need to work for expenses, no harm no foul, if it stops the experienced guy getting on the show he needs to raise his game and be indispensable to it. There's arguments against both, but if you're approaching a business from a purely old school frame of mind then ya kinda need to be old school yourself, and getting faceplanted through lighttubes isn't, at all. Plus, ya know, iceman's a paedo, so he needs someone to be giving him shit. Â Â In terms of wrestling for free... a foot in the door.. yes. 10 years later, its clearly not something your good at, find a new trade and stop spoiling the soup for the proper soup eaters/drinkers. (i dont know, sorry). Â Â At 14 years old, your school asks you to do work experience for a week in a profession of interest (or what actually happens is you have no choice and end up in greggs). If you learn a trade or study a trade at college, you may do some work experience for a business that the college have links with. My Mrs just went back to uni and completed a Masters Degree, 1/2 of that course saw her creating and collating specific info and statistics for a company, they fed back to the Uni, which added points to her final marks. Â Point is, the only work experience you get in wrestling (from what i understand) is wrestling at a training school, once every month or 2, performing in an academy live show, (in my opinion) it makes sense that this is done for free, as i would class it as work experience. Now, if you happen to progress at wrestling, put on some good academy matches, have tapes to prove this, and on top of this have a sound character and a decent gimmick and create a little buzz online with a webpage or whatever, then maybe you should send those tapes off to other promotions in the hope that one or more will say 'Yes, you seem good, we will pay you to wrestle for us'. Â If no one is willing to pay you at all, then maybe, just maybe, your not a good wrestler, you dont have a good look, you have no persona or character.. and if that is the case, then fuck off, because i as a fan dont want to pay for a ticket to watch you. Â Edit - I know the above point isnt always the case, you maybe a good wrestler, but unless your willing to promote yourself as one.. whos going to know? Â Of course, the promoters are just as much to blame, they need to stop hiring shit free wrestlers. They should go out and scout at local shows, i know some do, and i really do applaud that. If the above happens and good wrestlers from academy/training schools shine (as some clearly do and have managed to do well) then its all magic. The good wrestlers get a pay day, the bad ones fuck off and the fans even get to watch a good show (to the point id be willing to pay a little extra for my ticket). Â Follow your dreams i hear? No dont, not if you are shit at what your dreams consist of and are expecting me to pay and watch you look shite. Â Â Started to ramble there, sorry and that Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kamicazze Posted August 3, 2011 Share Posted August 3, 2011 As much as i love coming on this forum it has to be one of the most hypocritical ones I've ever accounted. At the start of the thread you were all urging Iceman to do it but as soon as he spoke to a lady you turned on him. Then you accuse him of cyber bullying. Well correct me if im wrong but isn't all of you ganging up on him also a form of cyber bullying? I'm guilty of cyber bullying myself. I only know one instance where i was completely disgusted with Boydy and his stories when he told me. However i don't know whether you could call that Cyber bullying or Me giving him my opinion of him. This is political correctness gone mad. And i totally agree with the WHITE KNIGHTS phrase. They seem to go absolutely nuts when their is a female involved. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.