Jon Venables back in prison

[Ron Simmons]

Perhaps he turned to drugs as a method of coping with his guilt, as the Guardian article suggested was a possibility. It's ironic that his release was considered the safer prospect, yet its turned out this way. Without knowing the full history of what has brought him back behind bars its difficult to make any sort of judgement on him. This case on a whole is difficult to deal with, I find it hard to read about the actual murder, its so damn upsetting. But then you have to consider that these were two children who have potentially grown up into different people. Would it be fair to keep them behind bars for life? It's one of those cases that provokes an emotion based response from many people. The kind of case that requires sensible people to make difficult decisions, detached from their emotions.

 

We have the papers saying it's in the public interest to know what he's done. I'm not sure what good that would do. It could put other people in danger with people "suspecting" they know who Venables is.

 

Well, I'd be annoyed if I found out I'd voted for one of them on the X-Factor.

 

 

[King Pitcos]

How would the anonymity work with these two having a CBR check as part of a job application? I don't know how CBR checks work, so I'm wondering if any potential employers would find out that Francis Bobbington (or whatever the new name might be) once killed a toddler.

[DJ Kris]

How would the anonymity work with these two having a CBR check as part of a job application? I don't know how CBR checks work, so I'm wondering if any potential employers would find out that Francis Bobbington (or whatever the new name might be) once killed a toddler.

I maybe wrong, but I wouldn't think these checks bring up specifics, just vague information on suitability.

[tiger_rick]

It's CRB, criminal records bureau. Just FYI, not being anal.

[The King Of Swing]

We have the papers saying it's in the public interest to know what he's done. I'm not sure what good that would do. It could put other people in danger with people "suspecting" they know who Venables is.

 

Unless he has commited a genuingly nasty offence then I dont think it is in the public interest at all but the dirt rags love any chance they can get to bring the Bulger case back into the headlines.

 

Based on what I have read it was also pretty much the same with Mary Bell.

 

Nothing ever changes.

[Ron Simmons]

How would the anonymity work with these two having a CBR check as part of a job application? I don't know how CBR checks work, so I'm wondering if any potential employers would find out that Francis Bobbington (or whatever the new name might be) once killed a toddler.

I was wondering this too. Normally your criminal record wouldn't be hidden, but are employers savvy to the fact they earned their A Levels behind bars?

[tiger_rick]

The sort of job that requires a CRB check, I'd be amazed if it didn't have some details. There is no way these guys are going to be allowed to work in schools or the police or anything similar and they won't get one to work with children.

 

For a normal job, there's no reason for their employer to know anything. That sort of thing just encourages prejudice. You only need a CRB check for a specific reason.

[Glen Quagmire]

Hanging 10 year old boys is just as fucked up.

I would agree, but we're talking about 10 year old murder's here.

 

Hold on a fucking minute here.

 

These were children. Ten year old children. They weren't even old enough for secondary school. No child of ten has a full understanding of what he or she is doing, because they're so easily impressed. There are ten year old children who still believe in Santa Claus. Why should you expect ten year olds to have any more sophisticated a grasp of reality in other areas?

 

Never mind though, let's HANG THEM because the SUN says to.

I've met 13 year olds who still believed in Santa Claus. Do 13 year olds not have an understanding of murder?

 

And I don't read the Sun either - a nasty rag.

 

Two ten year olds killing a two year old = String 'em up.

Someone (probably) in their early to mid twenties executing two ten year olds = Justice

 

Delightful hypocrisy.

I don't see it myself.

 

You don't know the circumstances in which these children were raised. Just because you were taught the difference between right & wrong & had consciences parents that cared & took an interest in your upbringing doesn't mean they did. Can you remember being 10 years old? Fair enough we're talking about possibly the most extreme circumstances imaginable but to treat an (obviously highly troubled) 10 year old as an adult of sound mind is ridiculous.

It's presumptuous that you are telling me that I don't know the circumstances in which these two murderers were raised yet you make a presumption about my upbringing. And when I was 10 years old I do remember being at school with kids who had an upbringing as bad as what was reported about Venables and Thompson yet they didn't go out killing a toddler because they knew that you simply did not do that.

[InvertedSmiley]

Though I take what the tabloids say with a pinch of salt, the reports today suggest Venables is still a fucked-up individual with every chance of posing a danger to society. Even if they're wide of the mark, I think it's highly unlikely that he'd be summarily marched back to prison and the story leaked to the press for something as inconsequential as failing to report to his parole officer on time.

 

As you allude to yourself, it all depends on which newspaper you are reading. While The Sun (or any other tabloid) reports that Jon Venables is a danger to society, The Times suggested this morning that he is a born-again Christian and had served in the army. There are so many stories about what has become of Venables and his accomplice that it simply isn't possible for any of us to know what the truth is. All we can know for certain is what is in the public domain on record, such as that Venables' former solicitor expressed surprise that he had been sent back to prison as he was "by unaminous agreement the lesser evil."

 

While there are reports coming out today (from the Daily Mirror, it should be cautiously stressed) it is still not known why Venables has been returned to prison. It could be for something as minor as leaving the country without prior permission or failing to reside at an agreed address. He may not have reported to his supervising officer or taken on a job without approval from his supervising officer, though it's unlikely that either of those would have resulted in him being imprisoned.

 

But I would have liked him to live in fear of the fact that it might happen as a ten-year-old. And I would have liked him to be unshadowed by the cloak of anonymity when he was released from prison.

 

Do you honestly think that, as a ten year-old, the boy didn't live practically every day in fear? He was reportedly paranoid that his secure unit would be broken into by people seeking to harm him, and feared being seen as "the new Myra Hindley". I can't imagine how it must feel to wake up every morning wondering if this is going to be the day the guy I work with finds out who I really am and what I did seventeen years ago. While that absolutely pales in comparison to the emotions Denise Fergus wakes up with every morning, it's something that I don't think the "string 'em up" brigade really consider.

 

To all you do gooders, that are saying he should not be harmed, and they where only 10

 

I do hope you never ever have kids

 

Why? Not everyone who loses a loved one - particularly a son or daughter at such a young age - suddenly turns into Charles Bronson, seeking vengeance on everyone involved.

 

A 10 year old knows better than to take a small child and cave its head in with a iron bar.

 

Does a ten year-old growing up in an abusive household know anything but violence? If a child is so neglected at home that he or she cannot empathise with any other kind of emotion, how can they judge something to be cruel if cruelty is all they know?

 

Those who are saying that Venables is back where he belongs are stupid.

 

He and Thompson should have been hung after being found guilty.

 

Yup, because the answer to a child killing is to murder two more...

 

This is not as black and white as simply stating that murder = evil bastard = death penalty. There are so many varying factors which have to be considered when those involved are so incredibly young. It is said that tortured children frequently grow up to carry out deranged acts, though here Venables and Thompson didn't even make it to the 'grow up' point. It's a headfuck just thinking about it.

[Mandingo's Donger]

[

 

Two ten year olds killing a two year old = String 'em up.

Someone (probably) in their early to mid twenties executing two ten year olds = Justice

 

Delightful hypocrisy.

I don't see it myself.

 

 

 

What do you see then? By on one hand condemning 2 human beings for the murder of a child, then on the other hand advocating the murder of a child by full grown adults.

 

Either you've got youe eyse closed or don't want to see the hypocrisy cause i fail to see how you could say there isn't any there.

[Glen Quagmire]

Two ten year olds killing a two year old = String 'em up.

Someone (probably) in their early to mid twenties executing two ten year olds = Justice

 

Delightful hypocrisy.

I don't see it myself.

 

 

 

What do you see then? By on one hand condemning 2 human beings for the murder of a child, then on the other hand advocating the murder of a child by full grown adults.

 

Either you've got youe eyse closed or don't want to see the hypocrisy cause i fail to see how you could say there isn't any there.

 

But I am not advocating the murder of a child by full grown adults. I am advocating the death penalty to be applied to the two murderers because I believe that anyone who is convicted of murder should receive the death penalty. If you set out to kill another human being then you lose the right to your own life no matter how old you are. Calling it as I see it.

[JNLister]

Apparantly whatever caused him to be put back inside has to be reviewed within 28 days. Him getting out again would be a fun way to kick off the election campaign.

[Dead Mike]

It's presumptuous that you are telling me that I don't know the circumstances in which these two murderers were raised yet you make a presumption about my upbringing.

 

I made the presumption that you had parents that cared about you! That's the presumption I'd make about anyone as it's what I believe is (and should be) the norm.

 

And when I was 10 years old I do remember being at school with kids who had an upbringing as bad as what was reported about Venables and Thompson yet they didn't go out killing a toddler because they knew that you simply did not do that.

And that's the difference right there.

[Mandingo's Donger]

Two ten year olds killing a two year old = String 'em up.

Someone (probably) in their early to mid twenties executing two ten year olds = Justice

 

Delightful hypocrisy.

I don't see it myself.

 

 

 

What do you see then? By on one hand condemning 2 human beings for the murder of a child, then on the other hand advocating the murder of a child by full grown adults.

 

Either you've got youe eyse closed or don't want to see the hypocrisy cause i fail to see how you could say there isn't any there.

 

But I am not advocating the murder of a child by full grown adults. I am advocating the death penalty to be applied to the two murderers because I believe that anyone who is convicted of murder should receive the death penalty. If you set out to kill another human being then you lose the right to your own life no matter how old you are. Calling it as I see it.

 

Oh come on. Please tell me why the guy who puts the noose round the neck and pulls the lever hasn't just done the very thing you are against.

[Glen Quagmire]

And when I was 10 years old I do remember being at school with kids who had an upbringing as bad as what was reported about Venables and Thompson yet they didn't go out killing a toddler because they knew that you simply did not do that.

And that's the difference right there.

Are you presuming, again, that Venables and Thompson were not aware of what they were doing? Making their killing look like a train accident tells me they knew what they were trying to do. Even back then, children were growing up fairly quickly.

 

Two ten year olds killing a two year old = String 'em up.

Someone (probably) in their early to mid twenties executing two ten year olds = Justice

 

Delightful hypocrisy.

I don't see it myself.

 

 

 

What do you see then? By on one hand condemning 2 human beings for the murder of a child, then on the other hand advocating the murder of a child by full grown adults.

 

Either you've got youe eyse closed or don't want to see the hypocrisy cause i fail to see how you could say there isn't any there.

 

But I am not advocating the murder of a child by full grown adults. I am advocating the death penalty to be applied to the two murderers because I believe that anyone who is convicted of murder should receive the death penalty. If you set out to kill another human being then you lose the right to your own life no matter how old you are. Calling it as I see it.

 

Oh come on. Please tell me why the guy who puts the noose round the neck and pulls the lever hasn't just done the very thing you are against.

 

No, because he has been given the legal sanction to do just that.

 

Would you suggest that, for example, the execution of Timothy McVeigh was murder?

Edited March 4, 2010 by Glen Quagmire