Paid Members Egg Shen Posted June 13, 2012 Author Paid Members Share Posted June 13, 2012 Great little talking points brought up in the last page or so. I'll chime in with some thoughts later. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members wandshogun09 Posted June 13, 2012 Paid Members Share Posted June 13, 2012 Cheers Magnum. All I know about season four is that the Will Campuzano vs Coty Wheeler FOTN from WEC 46 was shown on one episode. I remember a video of that fight appearing online shortly after the event and it was a ton of fun. The video vanished when Megavideo went tits up though. Always wanted to see Anthony Pettis vs Bart Palaszewski (WEC 45) and Leonard Garcia vs George Roop (WEC 47) aswell. Both meant to be really good so I hope they got on Wrekcage at some point. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimufctna24 Posted June 13, 2012 Share Posted June 13, 2012 (edited) I will put some more out there. - Anderson vs GSP is 50/50 due to the quality of GSP's wrestling - Hendo is as good now as he ever was in his Pride days. Only him and Rampage have improved their game out of the main faces of Pride. - Hendo has added the most to his legacy out of the Pride mainstays since it folded, Shogun and Rampage also added, whilst Barnett, Wand and Big Nog legacy's are the same. Fedor and Gomi harmed theirs. - Fedor's armbars were the most impressive part of his game. - Rich Franklin beat Hendo on my scorecard in 2009. - Face the Pain is fucking annoying and has been since around 2007. - Dana White is not cool as hard as he tries to be. - TUF 3 and TUF 10 despite being not the best in terms of talent are still the two best TUF's both commercially and critically. - Arial Helwani is the Louis Therouz of MMA. In other words he plays the naive harmless fool to extract information. Edited June 13, 2012 by jimufctna24 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CurryAngel Posted June 13, 2012 Share Posted June 13, 2012 Sorry I have to totally disagree with Big Nogs legacy staying the same. He's looked old and slow in every fight in the UFC barring the Couture fight. Herring should have beaten him, Sylvia was winning the stand up for 2 rounds (The same Sylvia used to discredit Fedor I may add), Wanderlei knew he was on the way out so instead of acting like a lunatic, or "crazy man" as Cro Cop called him, like he did in Pride he's now mr. nice guy who gets embarrassed 3/4 of the time he fights now. Dan Henderson would have beaten Sylvia and Arlovski Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimufctna24 Posted June 13, 2012 Share Posted June 13, 2012 Sorry I have to totally disagree with Big Nogs legacy staying the same. He's looked old and slow in every fight in the UFC barring the Couture fight. Herring should have beaten him, Sylvia was winning the stand up for 2 rounds (The same Sylvia used to discredit Fedor I may add), I agree with what you are saying, I felt he looked like crap until the Couture fight. If it was not for that and the Scraub KO, I would say he would have damaged it. However winning counts for a lot, he did not actually lose to Sylvia and Herring so people discount it. I let him of for the Mir losses, because the first one he was fucked and the second one he should have won if he had not played the grappling game after knocking him down. Its a tough one thinking about it, maybe I am been a tad kind to Nog. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members chokeout Posted June 13, 2012 Paid Members Share Posted June 13, 2012 Its hard not to be biased when talking about Nog because hes so damn likeable. Hes made a career out of pulling out a win after taking a pasting (and has to be on the top of most peoples lists for 'most punishment taken in their career') so I can't say he looked crap in either the Herring or the Syvia fight. He just did what he always does. I think it was the Syvia fight when he said something along the lines of 'I fought his fight for 2 rounds and he fought mine for 2 minutes' (or something like that) Fuck it I love Big Nog Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members Egg Shen Posted June 13, 2012 Author Paid Members Share Posted June 13, 2012 - Hendo is as good now as he ever was in his Pride days. Only him and Rampage have improved their game out of the main faces of Pride. Agree about Hendo, i wouldn't necessarily say he's improved but he's just always stayed the same, the guy is always reliant on his punching power but he makes it work for him. Disagree about Rampage. Outside of a couple of sweet KO's Rampage in the UFC has been abit of a disappointment. I think the guy has improved in terms of skillset but i always say that the improvements led to Rampage losing an essential part of his game, and that being his raw aggression. I always feel he tried to become too technical a fighter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members Egg Shen Posted June 13, 2012 Author Paid Members Share Posted June 13, 2012 -Miguel Torres was one of the most overrated fighters in MMA history and had a padded record until his WEC title run. I agree with that but it's not anything to do with Torres. I liken his resume to Jens Pulver's, he became the face of a new division and was the first guy at 135lb to really gain recognition in MMA. The talk of Torres being a p4p fighter was ludicrous, in such an under-developed division it's a hard label to justify. Once the division started to grow and the talent quickly got better Torres has found it hard to keep up. Torres was made the face of the WEC (alongside Faber), and to be fair he took the ball and run with it. He had some great fights in the WEC and he's a big reason why the lighter division were brought into the UFC when they were. As for his record, it's without doubt one of the most padded in MMA. I dunno if it's a case of him taking easy fights or more again that the division was so under-developed. Torres biggest win is arguably against Mizugaki (although i did have him beating Mighty Mouse), and that tells you everything you need to know. He's definitly a pioneer of the division and i do think he can still make a mark, he's proven that he's got a skillset to compete with the top guys but he's nowhere near worthy of some of the praise laid on him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimufctna24 Posted June 13, 2012 Share Posted June 13, 2012 (edited) Agreed with Chokeout, he is just a nice guy is Big Nog. In regards to EBB about Rampage. I should have been more accurate, the Rampage in 2007 is the best version of Rampage we have had or likely to get. It is forgotten for a good 2 years in the latter days of Pride he was a right lazy fucker, I know before that he was a beast, but the more disiplined technical Rampage under Iberra was the best version in my opinion. He did not do much other than box very well and wrestle, but in the 2 fights he had under Iberra being Hendo and Liddel he for me was one of the best ever LHW,s that existed. Its a shame it did not last, the split after the Griffin fight (a fight he should and would have won if he had trained harder) and then the move to Wolflslair made him fall back into old habits, these days he is as lame as he was the last 2 years of Pride. I agree on the agression point, he seems to lose that though when he gets lazy, which he has been for about half of his career sadly. Edited June 13, 2012 by jimufctna24 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members wandshogun09 Posted June 13, 2012 Paid Members Share Posted June 13, 2012 (edited) Yeah Ebb, I agree on Torres. I didn't mean it as a knock on Torres himself. He was fighting at them lower weights back when there wasn't as much quality depth as there is now. He could only fight who was around at the time. It's more that, like you say, people built him up into some top pound for pound fighter on the level of an Anderson Silva or GSP which is way out of whack. I know it's easy to say this with hindsight but it's not a hindsight thing for me, even back then I didn't get that vibe off him like I do with Anderson, GSP, Aldo and co. Like he's head and shoulders above everyone in his division. Guys like Mizugaki gave him really tough fights as I recall. I also had him winning the Mighty Mouse fight. It was one of them where they scored for the guy on top even though the guy on bottom was doing more imo. Torres is a good fighter no doubt but now the division is much deeper and full of serious talent he's being left behind a bit. Wanderlei knew he was on the way out so instead of acting like a lunatic, or "crazy man" as Cro Cop called him, like he did in Pride he's now mr. nice guy who gets embarrassed 3/4 of the time he fights now. Nah I just think Wand's mellowed out as he's got older. I'm yet to hear a bad word about Wand outside the ring or with fans or whatever. If the 'Mr Nice Guy' stuff is an act then he's wasted on MMA and should go into acting cos no-one can keep that much of an act going 24/7. Either that or people's moaning about him in Pride was bollocks from them, jealous of his position in Pride and the money he was on. I don't think the embarrassing himself bit's really fair either to be honest. How is he embarrassing himself? His KO losses have been to some of the most devestating hitters in MMA. It's not like he's losing to scrubs. He's always fought the same risky style so losses will come with the territory. The fact he's had those kind of losses yet still remained one of the most popular fighters in the sport and makes top coin for it in the biggest MMA company in the world tells you all you need to know. And at 185 he's 2-1 with a win over Bisping who is been a top contender now. If he'd fought smarter against Leben he could be unbeaten at Middleweight now. The man's a fucking legend and he can still go, he might not win them all but he'll give it 100% every time. There will always be a following for a guy like that. He's the Arturo Gatti of MMA. Edited June 13, 2012 by wandshogun09 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CurryAngel Posted June 13, 2012 Share Posted June 13, 2012 (edited) Ah you're probably right. However, was Wanderlei more popular and on more money than Cro Cop? Of course they did have the greatest staredown in MMA history in their first fight. Edited June 13, 2012 by CurryAngel Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members wandshogun09 Posted June 13, 2012 Paid Members Share Posted June 13, 2012 Yeah you're right Cro Cop was probably on the same kind of money as Wand actually, bad example I loved the staredown in the first fight too. Brilliant. I wonder how they are now with each other. There was some real bad blood there, most of it coming from Wand to be fair. They've been on the same cards together a couple of times in the UFC since (UFC 99/110). I wonder how they got on at the media stuff at them events. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members Egg Shen Posted June 14, 2012 Author Paid Members Share Posted June 14, 2012 Agreed with Chokeout, he is just a nice guy is Big Nog. In regards to EBB about Rampage. I should have been more accurate, the Rampage in 2007 is the best version of Rampage we have had or likely to get. It is forgotten for a good 2 years in the latter days of Pride he was a right lazy fucker, I know before that he was a beast, but the more disiplined technical Rampage under Iberra was the best version in my opinion. He did not do much other than box very well and wrestle, but in the 2 fights he had under Iberra being Hendo and Liddel he for me was one of the best ever LHW,s that existed. Its a shame it did not last, the split after the Griffin fight (a fight he should and would have won if he had trained harder) and then the move to Wolflslair made him fall back into old habits, these days he is as lame as he was the last 2 years of Pride. I agree on the agression point, he seems to lose that though when he gets lazy, which he has been for about half of his career sadly. yeh, i'll give you that one then i think i perhaps associate the UFC too much with the one we've had the last couple of years. The lazy Pride Rampage was around the time he had spiritual awakening, that was a weird fucking time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimufctna24 Posted June 14, 2012 Share Posted June 14, 2012 It was indeed weird, I only learnt about the whole breakdown in the middle of the night stuff years after it happened, with him finding GOD and that. It does seem he tries to distance himself from that a bit more now. I can understand why most would remember the Rampage of the past few years though, he has been crap/diluted in the UFC for much longer than he was good. Sadly the more he goes on like this the more he will be remembered for that and not the KO of Chuck and the well rounded performance against Hendo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members wandshogun09 Posted June 20, 2012 Paid Members Share Posted June 20, 2012 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.