General politics discussion thread

[Kiffy]

I think the point being made was this is one of various threads that discuss the current political climate, which allows hap to continue his special brand of bizarre incoherent paranoid tabloid ramblings in other areas, which is not as ideal as it should be.

[Devon Malcolm]

Ahem.

 

http://ukff.com/index.php?s=&showtopic...t&p=2351308

 

http://ukff.com/index.php?showtopic=124851...p;#entry2351302

Happ Hazzard is not allowed to post in this threaduntil 19th May 2011. If he posts in here before that date please report the post.

 

Why do I get the feeling that you've missed my pretty easy to understand point here? Are those not political discussions / threads now as well?

 

In other words, what's the point of suspending him from this one and not the plentiful other political discussion threads that spring up round here?

 

EDIT - Or, what Kiffy said.

Edited April 19, 2011 by Gladstone Small

[Ronnie]

Why do I get the feeling that you've missed my pretty easy to understand point here?

Because I did miss it!

 

Are those not political discussions / threads now as well?

 

In other words, what's the point of suspending him from this one and not the plentiful other political discussion threads that spring up round here?

Sure. Wouldn't it have been easier just to raise the point, though? It'd have stopped Johnny Rush-in getting the wrong end of the stick and making a pointless post. And now two.

[neil]

Always finds something to moan about does our Gladstone.

[WildSybianRider]

Noted oppressor of conservative views, the Guardian CiF, ran an article by Tory MP David Willetts, today.

 

They would have been doing him a favour censoring him, as it may be the worst thing I've ever read on that site. And I read the football section.

[JNLister]

To be fair, HappHazzard made a post in the AV thread of which about 90% was correct and the other 10% was a valid point for debate (if wrong IMO.)

 

Could be a fluke, or it could be that under AV his first preference is non-sequitor bullshit, his second preference is trolling, but his third preference is rational right-wing arguments.

[David]

Kinda quiet without Happ, isn't it?

 

[Loki]

I know it's vaguely sport-related, but how pathetic is it that some disgruntled Rangers fan has sent parcel bombs to the Celtic manager and 2 players? Football has the worst fans.

[David]

This issue goes far beyond football, Loki. It's the very worst of the sectarian bigotry that is rife in this country.

 

If this was skin colour racism the entire footballing world, and most of the UK would be up in arms. Because it's religious bigotry, it's just taken as "ah well, that's what happens in Scotland" by a lot of people.

[Yoghurt]

This issue goes far beyond football, Loki. It's the very worst of the sectarian bigotry that is rife in this country.

 

If this was skin colour racism the entire footballing world, and most of the UK would be up in arms. Because it's religious bigotry, it's just taken as "ah well, that's what happens in Scotland" by a lot of people.

 

Something we can agree on. A horrible reverence for religion allows it a much freer reign in doling out the hatred. Football does have the worst fans.

[Loki]

It may have its roots beyond football, David, but it revolves around and is nurtured by football. It's not just the Old Firm, although they appear to be the worst. It's the whole tribal warfare bullshit. You don't see F1 fans letterbombing Fernando Alonso (although....) or cricket fans giving each other a Chelsea smile.

[tiger_rick]

It may have its roots beyond football, David, but it revolves around and is nurtured by football. It's not just the Old Firm, although they appear to be the worst. It's the whole tribal warfare bullshit. You don't see F1 fans letterbombing Fernando Alonso (although....) or cricket fans giving each other a Chelsea smile.

You rarely see any other football fans letter bombing anyone either. There is certainly a tribal aspect to football fans and a line some people cross but you can't tar everyone with that shitty brush.

 

I'm not wholly convinced that football is the root of the problem either. I think in a lot of cases, it's just the outlet for the aggression. In Glasgow, it's something to hide behind.

[Kenny McBride]

This issue goes far beyond football, Loki. It's the very worst of the sectarian bigotry that is rife in this country.

 

If this was skin colour racism the entire footballing world, and most of the UK would be up in arms. Because it's religious bigotry, it's just taken as "ah well, that's what happens in Scotland" by a lot of people.

 

Something we can agree on. A horrible reverence for religion allows it a much freer reign in doling out the hatred. Football does have the worst fans.

 

Frankly, that's nonsense. I think it's more a complete lack of reverence for religion (and specifically Catholicism) that says "ach well, that's just how things go." Racism is actively opposed and would be challenged by most people who encountered it. Homophobia too. Misogyny is a little more of a grey area - you can still get away with some fairly awful anti-woman chat in plenty of places - but you'd still never get away with songs about being up to your knees in women's blood. But with religion, you're allowed to say almost anything and it's written off.

[Yoghurt]

This issue goes far beyond football, Loki. It's the very worst of the sectarian bigotry that is rife in this country.

 

If this was skin colour racism the entire footballing world, and most of the UK would be up in arms. Because it's religious bigotry, it's just taken as "ah well, that's what happens in Scotland" by a lot of people.

 

Something we can agree on. A horrible reverence for religion allows it a much freer reign in doling out the hatred. Football does have the worst fans.

 

Frankly, that's nonsense. I think it's more a complete lack of reverence for religion (and specifically Catholicism) that says "ach well, that's just how things go." Racism is actively opposed and would be challenged by most people who encountered it. Homophobia too. Misogyny is a little more of a grey area - you can still get away with some fairly awful anti-woman chat in plenty of places - but you'd still never get away with songs about being up to your knees in women's blood. But with religion, you're allowed to say almost anything and it's written off.

 

The respect unwarrantably afforded to all religions allows billions to suffer under the jackboots every single day. In this case I don't see how you could even argue that religion and the sports sectarian, hateful fans are at fault. The fact religion gets away with bloody minded hate speech on a constant basis is not befitting of even a twentieth century nation, let alone twenty first.

[Chris B]

This issue goes far beyond football, Loki. It's the very worst of the sectarian bigotry that is rife in this country.

 

If this was skin colour racism the entire footballing world, and most of the UK would be up in arms. Because it's religious bigotry, it's just taken as "ah well, that's what happens in Scotland" by a lot of people.

 

Something we can agree on. A horrible reverence for religion allows it a much freer reign in doling out the hatred. Football does have the worst fans.

 

Frankly, that's nonsense. I think it's more a complete lack of reverence for religion (and specifically Catholicism) that says "ach well, that's just how things go." Racism is actively opposed and would be challenged by most people who encountered it. Homophobia too. Misogyny is a little more of a grey area - you can still get away with some fairly awful anti-woman chat in plenty of places - but you'd still never get away with songs about being up to your knees in women's blood. But with religion, you're allowed to say almost anything and it's written off.

 

Oh, come on Kenny. It's not like Muslims aren't regularly made hate figures for exactly this kind of thing. It may be combining racism with religious elements, but imagine if this was likely done by Muslims rather than done by Protestants? I think a lot of people are unsure how to react because they don't know much about the situation. Shit, I didn't even know who Neil Lennon was - I don't know off the top of my head if this is a case of 'lone nutter', 'anti-catholic', or 'anti Glasgow Celtic'.

 

 

On a more general note, the story is obviously shocking, and disgraceful. It's honestly terrifying that something like this can be done. However, there is a slight difference to the link to the kind of 'terrorist cell stories' that this could be linked to in that nobody knows who's done it. 'Rangers fans' aren't exactly a terrorist cell, so it looks more likely to be a lone nutter.

 

Christ, you'd hope anyway, wouldn't you?