(Super) Street Fighter IV

[JLM]

One thing I've always found incredibly frustrating about 2D fighters is cross-ups. People who talk about them talk as if they're a given, yet I for the life of me can't figure them out. They're supposed to be attacks that hit your opponent as you move past them and end up on the other side, behind them, right? How the fuck can you end up behind them? The game just turns them around automatically - is there some kind of magical micro-second you have to spot where they're facing away from you?

 

Basically a jump-kick has a "hit-box" that extends below and slightly behind your character, so imagine you're looking to hit them with yor trailing leg/knee/appendage rather than the kicking leg, and time your jump and kick to suit that.

 

Dee-jay is a great example in HD remix, and I actually used this very combo to get the very achievment described. It also shows you about charging during other moves, because that Calypso kick at the end is a charging one.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cYU_QcarBh8

 

See how the kick "misses", but his knee twats Zangief in the back of the head? That's a cross-up. Even if Zangief blocked as he jumped in, he'd get hit because he's blocking an attack from the left but gets hit from the right as Dee-jay travels past him. That's dee-jay's jumping medium kick. I use Blanka's jumping medium to similar effect, as mattshutter saw earlier.

[FLips]

My Blanka was too much at this stage (sorry about the double perfect ), but I could see potential when he had a chance to do keep-away against my weaker characters. He also bagged a win against my El Fuerte. Man I suck with El Fuerte.

 

 

Is anyone any good with El Fuerte i just cant get anything out of him bar doing a standard tactics i hate his "run off the ropes" type things and just find him useless.

 

I find him utterly useless too. He's too fast for me, I just end up running around. Both the people i've fought online that used him used similar tactics to The Flash on MK vs DC, in which they just run around and grab you repeatedly.

[mattshutter]

What can I say.....

 

JLM is amazing with Blanka. He handed me my ass on several occasions, even get a double perfect!

 

I've never been beaten so bad before.

 

My confidence dropped like tonne of shit after that. I'm gonna keep playing with Dhalsim. There are hardly any Dhalsim fighters on XBL. I enjoy going him. I really struggle with other characters. Especially Charge characters. I still can't understand the basic principles of it. I can only manage a couple of Chun Li moves!

 

Anyway, I'm gonna stick at it. I'm determined to get the 10 wins in a row achievement.

[JLM]

Sorry about knocking your confidence, I always play Blanka as if it's a ranked match because I hate losing as him. You seem to have some of the basic principles of Dhalsim's game, and he is indeed under-represented, so don't let it get to you that a match between a character you're just starting to learn and a character I've played hundreds of times in online matches accross HD remix and this game was a bit one sided.

 

"You're the best... aroouuund, nothin's ever gonna keep you down

 

Fuerte seems to be a move short of being useful to me.

 

He has an alright Dragon punch-esque command throw for anti air, plenty of different options and surprise throws, a good super and a fantastically hittable ultra, but there's something missing.

 

Although I'm sure he's designed to do lots of quick hits and throws whilst staying away, but he could still do with a move that gets him accross the screen quickly with a bit less risk than his "run straight into them" thing. I did the EX dash into the low kick to try and get at mattshutter's Dhalsim and just got knocked back over and over. I don't have the range down on his splash yet and keep missing it. I guess the idea is to mix it up, doing the low kick so they crouch guard next time, then using the splash or the running throw to catch them out of their crouch guard.

 

What I'd like is a move like Abel's spinning heel kick or Fei Long's flying kick or Vega's wall bounces that gets you around the screen with enough protection or speed for it to be safe. I guess you're supposed to bounce off the side of the screen with Fuerte, but it's a lot harder than simply using Abel's kick and EX-ing it for protection.

 

I know he has that body smash thing if you hold kick for a while, which I forgot to try against Dhalsim, so maybe that lets you bulldoze accross the screen a bit.

 

Couldn't do any cross-ups because he jumps too fast and too high for me.

 

Fuerte is tricky indeed.

[Chest Rockwell]

I haven't finished unlocking everyone yet, but I'm thinking I'm gonna go with Abel as my go to guy that I want to practice up and get good with... He has some mad skills for a dirty Frenchman.

 

I don't want to use someone who shoots fireballs and does dragon punches, so that rules out half the roster. And I can't quite get to grips with chargers just yet so that rules several more.

 

My housemate is pretty damn good with Balrog and Guile, so I think we're gonna have some good bouts.

 

I also had my first real foray into the world of online matches last night. Played a bunch of Player matches, mostly getting beat but had a few nice close fights. Good fun.

 

I think the best was some guy playing as Akuma (I was playing Abel) who had my number in the first round and really started taking the piss and toying with me. I lost that round, but came at him hard to take the second. By the end of that round he was showing me a bit more respect and we had a really close third round (which I narrowly lost)..

 

I'm also now 50:50 in Ranked matches. Yay! I played two... My Abel lost to Sagat (I'm just not good enough to beat people spamming moves with Sagat yet.. He's brutal), and my Sakura took out an El Fuerte. So that's another big L for Fuerte.

 

He is fun, but a bit cack... Although maybe people will figure out how to use him properly and he'll be awesome. Time will tell.

[JLM]

Yeah, on current form Fuerte looks to be the "Twelve" of this game (Streetfighter 3 character who was cool as hell, fun to play as but exceedingly difficult to actually win with), but it's extremely early days and people might yet unlock greatness in him.

 

Abel is a good call. I wish the replay mode was already there because I'd have saved that game against the Abel guy who beat me. Really impressive stuff. Also, yeah, remember that the range and speed of his ultra is absolutely mental. Blocked Blanka ball landing on his ultra was an eye-opener because a blocked ball bounces you about a third of the screen away and I was confident he'd have no hope of catching me.

 

Plus he's a man's man. Him and Balrog. They want to destroy you and they want to look you in the eye while they do it. None of your fancy pyrotechnic wizardry, just punching, kicking and slamming you into the floor until you can't stand up again. It's a beautiful thing. I like Blanka for similar reasons. Electricity aside, his main plan is to headbutt, knee, bite, claw, kick and hurl his entire body at you with a view to inflicting pain. Won't catch him jumping backwards and putting fireballs out for protection, because they don't do that in the jungle. Because of forest fires. I digress..

 

Oh yeah Abel. I'm curious to see how he stacks up against Zangief and Honda. They seem to be absolute nightmare matches for him, so I'm curious to see how people get around that. With almost everyone else he can constrict you and give you no room at all to breathe, but with Zangief that's exactly where he wants you to be, and his throwing range and priority must surely crush Abel's.

 

Also, yay, fight stories. I really have to resist the urge to toy with bad opponents online. If it's a player match against someone on my friends' list then I'll play to win because it's a bit rude not to, but against a total stranger picking Ken for your tenth match on the bounce, it's hard not to take the piss from time to time. Blanka's new duck move is wonderful against persistent fireballers. A better option is to jump over it or block or work your way out of the fireball trap in an effort to counter. Hitting the deck is funnier though. I still haven't won a match by time limit judgment, simply because most rounds are very much done inside 99 seconds, but the temptation is there to land a few hits and then ACTIVATE NINJA STEALTH on a bad opponent. Akuma's teleport is fun for doing this, especially if you get them into the routine and then suddenly do the raging demon instead of the teleport. lolz.

 

Unfortunately my instinct is to hit back if they start attacking wildly, so I haven't managed to wait a round out until the time limit yet. Frustrating because it's the only medal I haven't got, but I refuse to set up a a match and have someone let me do it.

[mattshutter]

Hehe cheers JLM.

 

For some reason I kinda shat myself when i was playing you. I kept doing stupid backwards jumps when I should have just double tapped.

 

I've beaten loads of El Fuerte's. The trick for me is to do loads of Yoga Flames and just time them so he lands on them. or do an upward Yoga Flame. I didn't do it much against you JLM because I was constantly shitting myself.

 

I can't wait to get my 200/500 matches on XBL. I'm an achievement junkie. I doubt i'll be able to unlock all characters

[Carbomb]

Thanks for the help, JLM - things suddenly now make a lot more sense.

 

That El Fuerte guy sounds a lot like Ramon from KOF. Someone mentioned a "running ropes" move - sounds a lot like Ramon's Tiger Load.

[Chest Rockwell]

Oh yeah Abel. I'm curious to see how he stacks up against Zangief and Honda. They seem to be absolute nightmare matches for him, so I'm curious to see how people get around that. With almost everyone else he can constrict you and give you no room at all to breathe, but with Zangief that's exactly where he wants you to be, and his throwing range and priority must surely crush Abel's.

 

Yeah I can see why he might be quite limited in some ways against them. But he's got the little forward roll which handily goes through stuff and can get you behind someone. I use that a fair bit when I want to stay mobile but not make myself vulnerable... His EX heel kick is good for mobility, too.

 

 

I can't wait to get my 200/500 matches on XBL. I'm an achievement junkie. I doubt i'll be able to unlock all characters

 

 

You definitely will if you knock it down to easiest and 1 round matches. I've fought people that suck who have more characters unlocked than I do..

[JLM]

Seth's a big pussy-cat really. I beat him with El Fuerte, and you saw my El Fuerte.

 

Practice, learn his quirks, recognise that he HATES hard sweeps and you'll beat him with persistence and unlock everyone over time. Then, for Akuma and Gouken unlocking, use Sagat and beat the stuffing out of him. Jumping hard kick into standing hard kick with Sagat absolutely ruins Seth. He can't handle it at all.

 

Also, yeah, I hate it when I lose my composure when playing online. Losing because you failed a move or accidentally twitched in a moment of panic is the most frustrating thing ever. If you did something and the opponent countered or just played better then it's cool, but losing because the perfect move that you know will counter him doesn't come out due to your frenzied cack-handedness is infuriating.

 

This is why I'm all for the recent capcom trend of making the inputs easier. I don't think they should have specials assigned to one button like those horrible "EASY OPERATION" set-ups, but things like making Honda's Oicho throw a half rotation rather than a 360 are perfectly reasonable, because it should be knowing when, where and how to use the moves that wins you games more than simply being able to do them in the first place. I think this is the mistake a lot of these Ken players make. "I can do a dragon punch, I can do a fireball, I AM READY". A totally missed dragon punch is a very bad thing, and by god I've seen a lot of them.

[scotboy15]

Man, JLM's posts have been a joy to read, so much so that i am pretty tempted to get this game.

 

Some quick questions, is it worth me gettign this game if I (a) Haven't played Street Fighter since I was about 8 , (b) Not usually a beat em up fan and © Don't have that many friends on my friends list who have the game to play against.

 

Also how easy is it for a beginner to pick up and get into?

[JLM]

Abel's heel kick is indeed awesome. It's pretty close to Sean's from Streetfighter 3, and that was the only good

thing Sean brought to the table so I'm glad it's been transferred to a worthwhile character.

 

I have a query! I have everyone unlocked, so when people play against me and I'm hosting, do they have access to my gloriously full character select screen or can they only pick what they have already? I'd imagine it has to at least show them the full screen because my cursor would disappear into the blank spots otherwise, but are they barred from picking people they haven't unlocked? It's hard to tell because people on ranked would be unlikely to pick someone they haven't unlocked yet anyway.

 

Fuerte is quite Ramon-esque yes, and I always found Ramon to be exceedingly painful to use too. Methinks Lucha Libre suits 3D fighters better than 2D. El Blaze in Virtua Fighter is tremendous, plus he has DragonGate references.

[Chest Rockwell]

Man, JLM's posts have been a joy to read, so much so that i am pretty tempted to get this game.

 

Some quick questions, is it worth me gettign this game if I (a) Haven't played Street Fighter since I was about 8 , (b) Not usually a beat em up fan and

[Carbomb]

Fuerte is quite Ramon-esque yes, and I always found Ramon to be exceedingly painful to use too.

 

I'm pretty good with Ramon - I find his diving crossbody command move to be the key to getting into position for most things. Also, make good use of his rolling sobat -> splash -> pick-up combo, as you can transition into his Tiger Neck Chancery, or Tiger Spin~ super.

 

One of my mates is amazing with him - apparently the diving crossbody is a good cross-up (hence why I was getting so frustrated at not being able to figure out how to do them).

[JLM]

Cheers for clearing up the select screen thing Hage. Ruahahaha, marvel at my access to the darkest reaches of the select screen

you peasants. Ruahahaha. Watch as I pick Gen, who you don't have yet, and get absolutely murdered because I'm still not very good with Gen. Ruahahahahaaaaaaa.

 

Also how easy is it for a beginner to pick up and get into?

 

If I'm being totally truthful (which is hard because I want more players! MORE!), then I'd have to say it's not that easy at all. If you pick one character and learn them to death then you will get somewhere, but you will have to put some time in. Are you on PS3 or 360? I find the 360 d-pad to be a bit of an obstacle to playing the game, but others are working around this fairly well.

 

If you're not a beat'em up fan then it's hard to recommend because, despite being more accessible than some of the uber-hardcore games, it's still a fighting game for fighting game fans primarily. Some of the inputs are tricky, there's a lot to learn about the fighting system and the final boss will make you break your pad if you don't have the fighting game love to make you keep going.

 

You absolutely need people to play against though, and multiplayer makes most of the above issues irrelevant because 2 player fighting games tend to be a blast unless you absolutely hate the genre. You don't learn that much playing against the computer, you just learn how to beat their routines. Other UKFF members are just picking up and learning the game though, and it seems like a friendly bunch so I'm sure they'll be happy to pound on the n00b! help you practice. If not online then get one of your real life friends to play you if you have anyone willing to give it a bash. If they're reluctant then load up Ryu vs Ken and try and get the nostalgia glands* pumping.

 

Not playing SF since you were eight will mean you'll be re-learning the game almost from scratch. However! The fact that this game has the entire Super Streetfighter 2 roster aside from two characters means that there will be some comforting familiarity there. Ryu, Ken, Chun Li, Blanka... etc. The classic line up is largely accounted for.

 

Errrm. To summarise.... rent it first?

 

*not actual glands.