Carbomb

That example was what I was asking you to clarify wasn't the case across the board - I was trying to ascertain you weren't making out that anyone who criticises Cena thinks like that. This is the answer I was looking for, so thanks for that. Didn't see the "some", so just wanted to make sure.

It's demonstrably not, though. Like I said earlier in the thread, one of the reasons why I never took to Cena was because of the standards set by people like Bret Hart, who weren't indie darlings. I was only very briefly an indie fan, and I soon fell out of love with them, or at least liked them less when I quickly realised that alternative =/= better. The reason I asked this specific question: is because it's lumping everyone together, with the seeming intention of trying to claim that any and all criticisms are invalid because they can only be the opinions of "dem wans", and it's just a bit wanky, is all - in the same way that smarks claim that the only reason why anyone likes Cena is because they must have been brainwashed by Vince.

Just to check: you guys aren't saying that anyone who's not particularly a fan of Cena automatically believes that some indie button-basher in pleather should be headlining WrestleMania, right? Because that was a really annoying thing that happened on here a lot, back in the day.

@PunkStep MANY HAPPY RETURNS PAAAAAAL, ENCORE UNE FOIS

So sorry, dude. That pain is one of the keenest you'll ever feel in your life, so I understand the reluctance to feel it again. Fingers crossed the chemo works for her, but if the worst does happen, I hope you're able to spend some good time with her until then.

I didn't catch his US title run - I'd pretty much stopped watching WWE at that point. Overall, I don't think he's bad - he's clearly one of the biggest main-event talents ever. He just rarely appealed to me style or character-wise, and at worst annoyed me a bit being constantly positioned at the top when I wanted to see other guys there. Even if I were still watching WWE, I wouldn't be invested enough in a last run. I'm sure he's sobbing into his wads of cash and fan mail knowing that.

He said TNA, not Hull FC

Pretty similar to Gaffer here. In truth, most of my dislike for Cena was his character rather than his in-ring work - more than the "JBL is poopy" shite, it's more the shameless clothes-horse merchandising and the twee, contrived likability (which he ditched for the superb promos on The Rock). Yes, we were always sold to, but with Cena it was like they'd just given up on even trying to hide it. To those of us of late Gen-X, that's the kiss of death - the generation that embraced Austin and rejected the old WWF hated being so obviously shilled at, and I think that was a big part of why the older sections of the audience turned on him. As to his actual wrestling, there was a period where I actually did like him as a face, just after he'd turned; he still had a bit of "bite", the FU was still a Death Valley Driver (not saying it had to stay that way, but it sort of spoke to the style he was working), and he sold a bit more. In terms of his main-event ring style, for the most part I had no issue, as I'd long accepted that any style will work, no matter how relaxed or sloppy, as long as someone sells for it - Hogan's WWF style demonstrated that - but I'd also accepted he wasn't intended for a fan like me; I was a Bret Hart fan, who liked a bit of variation, but also some realistic-looking offence (at least, what I considered to be that). None of this was enough to completely put me off him (I enjoyed his matches with Michaels, Batista, and Punk) - there was ONE thing, though, that was: his Smug Superman comeback. After taking a massive beating, he just no-sells the entire fucking lot like it hasn't affected him at all. Even Hulk had the decency to, ya know, HULK UP. Actually show he was digging deep to find something to fight back with. I find his style very frustrating, because there's a lot to like. But what's not to like is really noticeable, and annoying.

Just discovered the cooking channel I didn't know I needed - and definitely @wandshogun09 and @FLips will love it: (Mind you, I already have the Sopranos Cookbook, and I haven't done anything from that yet.)

He didn't have Rock-level skills as such, but he was pretty good on the mike, I thought - projected well, paced his delivery to let it all "breathe", and talked in a relatively naturalistic way while still conveying his gimmick of being a loudmouth. Could be quite funny as well - often varied up the name repeat for different effects.

Aw, he doesn't look like MMA's Walton Goggins any more

Only films of his I still enjoy are Dogma and Clerks. Pretty much everything else I either didn't like to begin with, or has aged badly for me.

I'm probably way off base, but I get a feeling like he's the CM Punk of films - he appeals to a certain demographic, seemingly a bunch of blokes who fancy themselves as fans of "alternative cinema", and has made the most out of that demographic by pushing himself as much as his films, bolstered by going into other "alternative" fields, i.e. writing comics, etc., while the kind of work he became famous for is now being done better by newer directors.

Just seen an advert for National Theatre Live (where they broadcast plays to cinemas) for Nye - Michael Sheen playing Aneurin Bevan. Seems a lot of my local cinemas are showing it from 23rd April, so going to try to get tickets (shouldn't be difficult, I imagine it'd be a bit niche for some). https://nye.ntlive.com/synopsis/

Yes and no. He definitely stood out in an era was there was a bit of a dearth of new talent, and one thing I particularly liked about him was that he had a bit of a Piper-esque ability to make things seem personal in a feud. Favourite example of that is in TNA, when Hogan is having a go at him, telling him he doesn't like him - and he responds with "Well then, why don't you do something about it, TERRY?!" There was an audible "Oooooh" from the audience. He was certainly quite naturalistic in his promo style, too. However, from a match perspective, he could be very hit-and-miss - and when he missed, he was outright rotten. Definitely needed the right opponent.

I'm similar, but with an opposite outcome - he doesn't affect me, and it's clearly six of one and half a dozen of the other with him, but, aside from that brief "Best In The World" run in WWE, I've never been particularly bothered about him; I don't like him, and I don't hate him. I'm just not emotionally invested in the guy, and never have been - he was in the first ever live wrestling show I went to, FWA New Frontiers 2004, facing Raven, and it was a fun match, but I wasn't overly bothered about it; was more interested in the British guys because I felt like I was discovering something new. Consequently, I'm finding this stuff a bit tiresome. I find people's discussion of the drama interesting, but not the drama itself, odd as that might sound.

It's amazing how he made such a small role so memorable. Every so often, my sister and I have a pattern where, if either of us does something stupid, the other will say "Ya djack'ass!" the way he did. Or, if we're trying to do something difficult, the other will say "You WILL NOT [insert action here]...ya djack'ass!"

Bloody hell, @wandshogun09 - my short-term memory has always been shit, but that's upsetting. Damn.

Yeh, that got him fired, but remember they were pushing him hard first, even planning to make him Vince's illegitimate son - then he got done and they gave that to Hornswoggle instead. After the scandal, he was essentially a midcard jobber.

Didn't know they'd let Taila Santos go either.

Yeh, it was what did for Kennedy's career - he'd gone all-in on slagging off everyone talking about it, defending WWE to the hilt. Then he got done, and looked ridiculous.

Also, with all the advancements in sports science, there's probably either a lot more expertise in treatment, whether it's in-house or simply the wrestlers having more self-knowledge about which injuries they can't afford to leave and how to address them.

Literally

The UFC marketing team have been working on the intricacies of matches that haven't even happened