Other MMA Shows

[Dai]

Luckily Spike and Bellator have recognized this and produced a show with a new dynamic and plenty of potentially beneficial features.

Didnt feel this way at all when I finished watching it, to be honest. The fighters picking their team was a nice twist, but everything else was essentially TUF.

Firstly, the fights are shown in bite sized chunks, which in this case helps the show flow better. Full fight unless short were on-existent and that is a good thing with the oversaturated nature of MMA in 2013

This is the exact same as TUF when they are showing the qualifying matches.

Secondly, it seems like despite Spike being the forefather of in-house antics and crash TV, it seems this show will be more like The Contender rather than TUF. It is not only welcome on a freshness level but also on a professional level, as I feel the crash TV element of MMA has soundly run its course.

Not sure how you made this assumption based on the first episode, as absolutley nothing was previewed about what the 'normal', non-qualifying episodes will be like. Also, TUF has (to its detriment, in a lot of peoples opinion) moved far away from the in-house antics. I wont be sticking with this show if its going to be focused on training and just the fights, ie, exactly what TUF is like now. Id rather not burn out before the new TUF season.

Thirdly, the new dynamic gives the show added freshness, with the fighters choosing their camp offering a new scenario never done before on TUF. Watching the coaches sell their camp or try and lead a fighter away from it makes for cracking viewing.

This was a decent twist, especially when a trainer doesnt want a fighter, and tries to manipilate their decision. That said, seeing the trainers blow hot air for the next few weeks when theyve been asked "Where are my weaknesses?"/"What can your camp do for me?" for the tenth time may not be so interesting.It was still a decent watch, but is almost identical to TUF, and will be even more similar once they get to the normal episodes. Hopefully there will be a good dynamic with the four coaches, which will hopefully lead to something unique about this show.

[Egg Shen]

yeh, i liked what i saw. The picking the coaches thing is a nice touch, as is the more consistent commentary the coaches add (rather than Dana's sporadic comment 'holy shit'), definitely had an element of The Voice about it.The show looks great though, very sleek and the fighters looked great too...nice to see Chris Lozano win, been a fan of his for awhile as he's already a Bellator fighter.I wonder how much of the picking element is fixed though, it was quite conveniant how each coach got 1 pick each out of the first 4, maybe it's shown out of order? guess we'll know more in the next 4 weeks. The coaches were all decent if not a little hammy, but i guess their told to bicker and act like they are against each other.Joe Warren did come across well, he's always been a love/hate character but he always makes for good TV, nice to see people changing their opinion on his original inclusion.Nice start.

[jimufctna24]

Not sure how you made this assumption based on the first episode, as absolutley nothing was previewed about what the 'normal', non-qualifying episodes will be like. Also, TUF has (to its detriment, in a lot of peoples opinion) moved far away from the in-house antics. I wont be sticking with this show if its going to be focused on training and just the fights, ie, exactly what TUF is like now. Id rather not burn out before the new TUF season.

Tuf had a habit on those qualifying episodes of showing non-stop fights for the full hour, there was nothing to break up the stream of fighting. Fightmaster kept the long fights short and offered a break to see what camp the fighters would pick, sure TUF would do that on occasion but they would still cram a good 8 fights into a episode which was far too much.The show was presented in a way that makes me think the in-house antics will be kept clean, it felt a lot more sophisticated than the early season of TUF where in-house antics were common. Plus, the emphasis seems to be much more on the coaches and battle between camps more than anything. It felt more like the Boxing Show The Contender rather than TUF Edited June 22, 2013 by jimufctna24

[Egg Shen]

unfortunately ratings in the US were down 40% for the fights on Wednesday from the usual Thursday slot, then they dipped again for Fight Master

[jimufctna24]

MMA will not flourish sadly in the ratings game anytime soon. The new timeslot was not a wise choice by that evidence, but they could just need to condition their viewers that Wednesday is the night for Bellator, it takes time to establish a day change for viewers.That said, I do not expect Bellator to be a run away success on Spike and I am being realistic in hoping for a decent number 2 promotion to have a healthy business, produce a decent product and a regain a regular timeslot. MMA is too oversaturated in 2013 to expect big ratings, like I said the novelty of free fights died a long time ago.

Edited June 23, 2013 by jimufctna24

[David]

Jesus Christ Dai, it's only been one episode. Every quote you posted there will be impossible to verify until we've seen at least three or four episodes.As for the in-house antics, I think the problem is the fighters who are now applying for the show. In the past the level of fighter was generally lower, and perhaps were more flamboyant characters.Nowadays MMA is considered a lucrative and legit sport. It attracts serious athletes now as opposed to fucking idiots who like to "throw leather", so we're seeing contestants who realise the opportunity they have, and who are doing all they can to ensure they win, which means they're not doing much more than training, eating & sleeping.

[wandshogun09]

Yeah it's actually kind of a catch 22 situation in some ways with MMA reality shows. I haven't even seen this yet but it's a balance that seems to have been lost on TUF in recent years, bar a few exceptions. On the one hand they want to find guys who are serious about making MMA their career and being fully focused etc. Of course they do, when you get down to it, that's what these shows are for. On the other hand, it is a reality TV show. You don't just want 35 minutes of guys being dead serious, doing sit ups, eating their spinach and spouting the same old cliches about 'this is my life', 'I'm doing this for my family', 'insert God squad speech'. And then a tacking a fight on the end between two of these Lance Storm types. That gets old quick. I'm all for serious fighters and great fights but let's be honest, we're seeing a ton of that anyway. There's no shortage of quality MMA to watch these days. If I want great fights I'll watch one of the many, almost weekly shows that are on.The reality shows should ideally have some spice, I think. Again, I'm not criticising this Bellator show because I haven't even seen it yet. But when you look at all the seasons of TUF people remember fondly, it's not the seasons where the house was full of super serious fighters that get brought up. You need characters and personalities to keep a wide variety of people interested. MMA fans like us will likely watch regardless, but the reality shows won't reach the numbers the most successful seasons of TUF did unless they have interesting characters and personalities as well as talented fighters. You need that balance I think.The early seasons of TUF had shit like Jason Thacker (TUF 1), Wayne Weems and Andy Wang (TUF 5) - weak links who couldn't cut it. You also had the likes of Noah Inhofer (TUF 3), Kenny Stevens and Eli Joslin (TUF 2) - the quitters who were never heard from again. You don't really get these types on the shows anymore because they're usually weeded out in the evaluations/elimination fights. That's great in one way but watching those twats early in the season was usually a highlight for me. I don't watch X-Factor but there's a reason they always let a few dickheads/ridiculously awful acts on the early episodes.I'm not saying fill the house with these scrubs, or stick a bunch of cunts in, but a house full of straight laced, pure athlete, serious fighter types makes for dull as fuck viewing in a reality TV setting. You need a couple of villains or idiots. TUF 1 had the Leben/Koscheck/Southworth stuff, TUF 3 had the Tito-Ken feud and Bisping, TUF 5 had the Penn-Pulver rivalry and twats at the house, TUF 10 had Rampage-Rashad, Kimbo, Nelson, the Titties stuff. Then TUF went shit. It's no coincidence that the best seasons in the last few years have been 12 (GSP vs Koscheck), 14 (Bisping vs Mayhem) and The Smashes (Pearson vs Sotiropoulos - plus Freakshow). All had a grudge, all had someone you'd root against and all had good fights as well as all the other trimmings.Jesus fuck, I've rambled.

Edited June 23, 2013 by wandshogun09

[David]

The problem we have is that in this day & age of guys like Mike Ricci, Uriah Hall etc the guys who are loose cannon types, such as Julian Lane, usually get a beating early and are out of things before they even really start. They really don't get taken seriously by their fellow contestants either.In short, guys like Lane only add to the stereotype of what an MMA fighter is. Some people may enjoy seeing an idiot like him act like a dick every week, but personally I don't. Look at him, he's the exact image of what anti-MMA people imagine when they hear the phrase MMA. We don't need guys like him in the sport.

[jimufctna24]

Wand nails it by saying "balance" and for years MMA has been trying to get that balance, when it has it has produced a fine product.I agree with David above, the days of Julie Browning should be left in the past as MMA has evolved. Maybe at some stage they were a necessary evil in the days were MMA was appealing to the pro wrestling audience, now they are trying to appeal to the masses as a sport it maybe best to leave them in the past. Spike TV is pretty much trash TV, they support shows like TNA, Man vs Food or whatever that are not going to challenge Boardwalk Empire for awards anytime soon. I was worried and still slightly still am that Spike would turn Bellator into something resembling a tribute to the UFC's 2005/2006 business model , coupled with the "Mohawk" fighters and TUF castaways. Like I said though there can be a balance as was shown with The Contender series, that presented a exciting combat reality TV show with class and drew in the viewers by offering enough clean drama. Like I said I only expect Fightmaster to be a critical hit, not a commercial one, and for my personal tastes at this stage I would rather say MMA's version of the contender than MMA's version of Geordie Shore. We will see how Fightmaster pans out, but from the 1st episode it did seem that it was going in the direction I wanted it to.

Edited June 23, 2013 by jimufctna24

[wandshogun09]

Oh yeah, I hated that little red fuck as much as anyone. But that season was dire, as big a cock as he was there wasn't much else going on. Except for that prick with the blond hair (name escapes me) who wouldn't wear a shirt under any circumstances, getting all emotional because his bumchum Ricci asked to fight him. Nearly all of my favourite TUF moments have involved the big characters, the twats and no-hopers. Stuff like BJ Penn mocking Andy Wang, Gabe Ruediger failing to make weight, Rampage vs Titties, Shonie Carter and his bottle raft, Noah leaving because he missed his girlfriend he'd been with a couple of months, Serra vs Laimon - that's the stuff that made TUF great. Rarely is it the actual fights you remember. I've said this before but one of the best episodes of reality TV ever was on TUF 8 when Junie Browning finally got his comeuppance after being a monumental bellend all season. Seeing Efrain put a beating on that bleached penis was one of the most satisfying story endings ever. It was perfect.

Dana: "This isn't Survivor. 'Let's vote him off'. No. You don't vote guys off here. You have to beat 'em off...that didn't sound good, did it?"

Edited June 23, 2013 by wandshogun09

[Dai]

Jesus Christ Dai, it's only been one episode. Every quote you posted there will be impossible to verify until we've seen at least three or four episodes.

What parts cant be verified? I essentially said that this episode was almost identical to TUF, with the exception of the picking coaches element. I dont think its a too wild assumption to say that the normal episodes will be very similar to TUF also.These are the days when you can pretty much watch 8+ UFC fights every few weeks, so for me personally, watching this if it becomes too "clean" will become too much of a chore.

[jimufctna24]

These are the days when you can pretty much watch 8+ UFC fights every few weeks, so for me personally, watching this if it becomes too "clean" will become too much of a chore.

Whilst I agree with there being too much UFC about for Bellator to really shine. The not wanting it too become "clean" is just your personal taste, one of the reasons I will continue to watch if it offers a change of pace from TUF.I think it will grow into be being a show a bit different from TUF, the coaches dynamic and presentation signals that for me. I could be wrong and will admit if in 4 or 5 episodes it does become a complete TUF clone, but we shall see.

[Supremo]

Look at him, he's the exact image of what anti-MMA people imagine when they hear the phrase MMA. We don't need guys like him in the sport.

I don't think image matters at all (anti-MMA people are going to be anti-MMA regardless of what fighters look like), but if it does, then the same point would have to apply to Dan Hardy too.And personally, I think I think we do need guys like him in the sport. He's ace. Edited June 23, 2013 by Supremo

[David]

That same point about image would have to apply to Dan Hardy too, then.

Funnily enough Hardy has ditched the mohawk and had this to say about it a while back;

"That's who I was. I'm not that person anymore. The mohawk's gone and just the whole arrogance that came with it that I showed those first few fights in the UFC. That played its role, you know? It was an important phase in my life and I learned a lot from it. The way I acted led to the right fights and the right situation at the time arose from those fights and I got a title fight in four fights, which is early for anybody in the UFC, you know? As some point, we all have to evolve a little and I have changed. I feel much better about myself and I don't feel like I'm putting out a bad impression on my species for acting the way that I did and the way some people do on The Ultimate Fighter and stuff. There's a lot of tie-ins with that for the reason I changed my haircut as well because it seems that the UFC tries to find one guy with a red or a pink mohawk for every season and that was the guy that was drinking too much and throwing stuff into the pool. I'm not that guy, but I guess my brand kind of got ahead of me and became something I didn't want it to be and I had to step away from it."

[Supremo]

You get my point though, don't you? It really doesn't matter what fighters look like. It's insignificant. Dan had tattoos and a mohawk, yet went on to become one of the most popular fighters in the company and a huge asset to the UFC, particularly in this country. A ridiculously likeable guy who was great with the press, a proper character, and really fun to watch fight. Perfect. Fighters can look however the fuck they want. It doesn't matter. It's not as if some anti-MMA campaigner is going to change their mind on, "cage fighting," because one guy has shaved his colourful hair off. To them, it's still cage fighting.Plus, without tattoos or red hair we may never have had Chris Leben. And he's pretty much the reason the UFC boomed.

Edited June 23, 2013 by Supremo