Paid Members JNLister Posted July 17, 2007 Paid Members Share Posted July 17, 2007 The 'no anabolic steroids were found' explanation is misleading. Benoit was getting medical grade pure testosterone in large quantities, so there would be no need to use 'artificial' steroids.The chemical/biological definitions are:Steroid - a particular type of chemical structure in the body. Anabolic steroid - a type of steroid that produces cellular growth.Testosterone - A particular anabolic steroid which is responsible for most of the physical effects that classify men as different to women (eg facial hair, larger heart, adams apple etc)So everyone has both steroids and anabolic steroids in their body naturally.However, in drug terms (and in most common reference), "anabolic steroid" refers to any artifical substance that synthesises natural steroids such as testosterone. You use the "anabolic steroids" drugs to simulate the effects of natural anabolic steroids such as testosterone. Benoit was injecting actual testosterone rather than the "drug", but in such high quantities that he had far more testosterone than any body could naturally produce or would naturally need.In short, he wasn't on "anabolic steroids" in the sense that most people understand. But he was being given a medical substance in far higher quantities than was medically justified, which is pretty much the definition of drug abuse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Crystal Maze Posted July 17, 2007 Share Posted July 17, 2007 That explains why Benoit was balding then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members Chris B Posted July 17, 2007 Paid Members Share Posted July 17, 2007 (edited) Out of curiosity, where are people getting the 59/1 ratio from? I've seen 10/1 reported.Oh, and Lister - awesome posts so far, dude. Edited July 17, 2007 by Darque Edge Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GIB Posted July 17, 2007 Share Posted July 17, 2007 Out of curiosity, where are people getting the 59/1 ratio from? I've seen 10/1 reported.Oh, and Lister - awesome posts so far, dude.I read it on Meltzer's website. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJ Stevie C Posted July 17, 2007 Share Posted July 17, 2007 (edited) The 'no anabolic steroids were found' explanation is misleading. Benoit was getting medical grade pure testosterone in large quantities, so there would be no need to use 'artificial' steroids.The chemical/biological definitions are:Steroid - a particular type of chemical structure in the body. Anabolic steroid - a type of steroid that produces cellular growth.Testosterone - A particular anabolic steroid which is responsible for most of the physical effects that classify men as different to women (eg facial hair, larger heart, adams apple etc)So everyone has both steroids and anabolic steroids in their body naturally.However, in drug terms (and in most common reference), "anabolic steroid" refers to any artifical substance that synthesises natural steroids such as testosterone. You use the "anabolic steroids" drugs to simulate the effects of natural anabolic steroids such as testosterone. Benoit was injecting actual testosterone rather than the "drug", but in such high quantities that he had far more testosterone than any body could naturally produce or would naturally need.In short, he wasn't on "anabolic steroids" in the sense that most people understand. But he was being given a medical substance in far higher quantities than was medically justified, which is pretty much the definition of drug abuse.Absolutely I wasn't arguing that point, the point I was making was that the term "Anabolic Steroids" is a lot more glamorous for the press than "testosterone abuse". Of course they are pretty much one in the same thing. But you know how more blown up this could have been if he was completely pumped full of those Anabolics. And a lot of people aren't going to be 'as offended/shocked/stunned' as the press would like them to be as there's a lot of reasons someone would be prescribed testosterone.Edit: That's why I was thinking the WWE might have 'dodged a bullet' before the sheer ammounts of how much was there was known. Edited July 17, 2007 by DJ Stevie C Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members JNLister Posted July 17, 2007 Paid Members Share Posted July 17, 2007 Out of curiosity, where are people getting the 59/1 ratio from? I've seen 10/1 reported.The examiner mentioned the 59:1 ratio and suggested this was ten times higher than would be plausible as natural. (In other words, 59:1 compared to a natural level of around 6:1). Some people wrote "ten times higher" as "a 10:1 ratio", confusing the issue.On a legal point, WWE's drug policy and statement distinguishes testosterone from "anabolic steroids". However, US law considers testosterone to come under the class of "anabolic steroid" in terms of what is and isn't legal to use/prescribe without medical justification. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kenny McBride Posted July 18, 2007 Share Posted July 18, 2007 Out of curiosity, where are people getting the 59/1 ratio from? I've seen 10/1 reported.The examiner mentioned the 59:1 ratio and suggested this was ten times higher than would be plausible as natural. (In other words, 59:1 compared to a natural level of around 6:1). Some people wrote "ten times higher" as "a 10:1 ratio", confusing the issue.On a legal point, WWE's drug policy and statement distinguishes testosterone from "anabolic steroids". However, US law considers testosterone to come under the class of "anabolic steroid" in terms of what is and isn't legal to use/prescribe without medical justification. Which is pretty neat when lowering your testosterone level to get a prescription is amazingly easy and prescription testosterone is the holy grail for steroid users. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members JNLister Posted July 18, 2007 Paid Members Share Posted July 18, 2007 (edited) Something else to clarify from the press conference. From what I understand, your T/E ratio will shoot up to a certain point when you, well, shoot up. It will then gradually drop as your body 'uses' the excess testosterone and your levels will return to 'normal' fairly quickly if you don't take another dose. So any quoted ratio is merely a snapshot rather than evidence to prove or disprove a pattern of use.If they knew when Benoit had last taken a dose they could have figured out roughly how much he'd taken. Alternatively if they knew how much he had taken, they could have figured out when he took it. But with only one piece of the equation (the levels), you can't work out the other two.What is clear is that the levels found in Benoit's body are certainly in the region that backs up the DEA's original estimate that the amounts being regularly prescribed were around 10 times what would be medically justified. That means that, although you can't come up with precise figures for what Benoit had taken before his death, it's a pretty safe bet that Benoit was taking the entire (over)prescribed dose rather than dealing/distributing to anyone else. It's also, at the very least, logical and likely that he was taking a consistent amount over the past year rather than being 'clean' until recently and suddenly taking a shedload of stuff since his last test as WWE are implying.***Edit - another clarification. It wasn't technically accurate when I said Benoit was taking 'pure testosterone'. He was taking 'testosterone cypionate' which is a drug that simply contains testosterone plus a chemical that means your body absorbs it gradually rather than all in one go. Testosterone cypionate is pretty much the closest thing a lab can make to naturally-produced testosterone. Edited July 18, 2007 by JNLister Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BurningHammer Posted July 18, 2007 Share Posted July 18, 2007 One morbid thought hit me when watching a replay of the press conference on FOX just now. Was Chris attempting to poison his son with a high dose of Xanax (doctor just claimed the level found in Daniel's body was a dangerous level even for an adult)?It may just explain the time lapse between Nancy and Daniel if you theorize that Chris gave his son a high dose of Xanax Friday night with the intention to put him asleep and not wake up. When Daniel is still breathing Saturday morning, Chris chokes him while Daniel is still drugged. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members Rob Lowe Posted July 18, 2007 Paid Members Share Posted July 18, 2007 One morbid thought hit me when watching a replay of the press conference on FOX just now. Was Chris attempting to poison his son with a high dose of Xanax (doctor just claimed the level found in Daniel's body was a dangerous level even for an adult)?It may just explain the time lapse between Nancy and Daniel if you theorize that Chris gave his son a high dose of Xanax Friday night with the intention to put him asleep and not wake up. When Daniel is still breathing Saturday morning, Chris chokes him while Daniel is still drugged.That seems like a much 'nicer' way to go than the original story.Benoit creeping into his kids room on a saturday morning and choking him to death is awful. Giving him a high dose of Xanex to zonk him out, then to choke him is more merciful. Daniel wouldnt feel anything and it would be quick and less stressful for Benoit.Yes, I still realise how mega fucked up this situation is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members DJ Kris Posted July 18, 2007 Paid Members Share Posted July 18, 2007 One morbid thought hit me when watching a replay of the press conference on FOX just now. Was Chris attempting to poison his son with a high dose of Xanax (doctor just claimed the level found in Daniel's body was a dangerous level even for an adult)?It may just explain the time lapse between Nancy and Daniel if you theorize that Chris gave his son a high dose of Xanax Friday night with the intention to put him asleep and not wake up. When Daniel is still breathing Saturday morning, Chris chokes him while Daniel is still drugged.There's a report that says Benoit and Daniel were seen playing in the Pool on Saturday. That may not be true, but if it is, he's unlikely to have drugged his son Friday night. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members JNLister Posted July 18, 2007 Paid Members Share Posted July 18, 2007 The doctor who tests for WWE has confirmed Benoit had high enough testosterone levels to fail on his first three tests (but had a prescription) but had acceptable levels on his April 10 test. According to Bryan Alvarez that ties in with rumours that he had been trying to get off completely around that time but the side effects were too strong so he got back on recently. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dart Posted July 18, 2007 Share Posted July 18, 2007 That explains why Benoit was balding then.He was 40 ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loki Posted July 18, 2007 Share Posted July 18, 2007 Does this actually get us any closer to why he did what he did though? All it rules out is that he was hugely hopped up or high at the time, unless the suggestion is that he'd just injected a massive amount of testosterone and therefore went stir crazy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members Au Posted July 18, 2007 Paid Members Share Posted July 18, 2007 unless the suggestion is that he'd just injected a massive amount of testosterone and therefore went stir crazy.Do you know what stir crazy means? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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