David Posted June 7, 2021 Share Posted June 7, 2021 7 minutes ago, jimufctna24 said: Eh? Mayweather clearly ducked Winky Wright. He called Wright out in 2005. Wright agreed to his demands, and then Mayweather and Arum pulled out. Well, apart from him then. Winky fucking Wright is the exception to the long and storied career Mayweather had of comfortably beating the best for the most part. What could have been for ol' Winky, eh? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimufctna24 Posted June 7, 2021 Share Posted June 7, 2021 3 minutes ago, David said: Well, apart from him then. Winky fucking Wright is the exception to the long and storied career Mayweather had of comfortably beating the best for the most part. What could have been for ol' Winky, eh? Winky would have probably beaten the prick actually đ  Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cousin Jim Bob Posted June 7, 2021 Share Posted June 7, 2021 16 minutes ago, David said: Risk averse? Look at the names he's faced over his career. Corrales, Castillo, Gatti, Judah, De La Hoya, Hatton, Marquez, Mosley, Manny Pacquiao, and an admittedly young Canelo. He's ducked no one during his career. He's been smart in when he's fought some of them, but that's a list of opponents the likes of which you rarely see a modern fighter face.  I called him risk averse not a ducker. He forced every fighter to jump through hoops to get him post DLH. Floyd wrote the book on prefight bullshit. His choice of ring size, his judges, his ref, his venue, his gloves. Everything. Oh and you are only allowed to put x weight back on. Total BS that should have no place if your not risk averse. I think it would be fucking hilarious if he dips on fighting Jake Paul. When that whole charade last night was to set it up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Posted June 7, 2021 Share Posted June 7, 2021 10 minutes ago, jimufctna24 said: Winky would have probably beaten the prick actually đ  Alas, we'll never know. Poor Winky, the twat. 9 minutes ago, Cousin Jim Bob said:  I called him risk averse not a ducker. He forced every fighter to jump through hoops to get him post DLH. Floyd wrote the book on prefight bullshit. His choice of ring size, his judges, his ref, his venue, his gloves. Everything. Oh and you are only allowed to put x weight back on. Total BS that should have no place if your not risk averse. I think it would be fucking hilarious if he dips on fighting Jake Paul. When that whole charade last night was to set it up. That's just smart. He still fought them all, and beat them all. never dropped, never even really hit clean. Guy is easily one of the greatest to ever do it. Not only that, but he walked away with millions in the bank and his faculties still intact. An absolute arse of a person, mind you, but not many escape boxing like he has. Now he's making coin by sparring with fools. If the money is right he'll do the same with Jake Paul. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimufctna24 Posted June 7, 2021 Share Posted June 7, 2021 (edited) 15 minutes ago, Cousin Jim Bob said: His choice of ring size, his judges, his ref, his venue, his gloves. He took the piss with drug testing too. - https://www.sbnation.com/longform/2015/9/9/9271811/can-boxing-trust-usada - https://web.archive.org/web/20160412123515/https://www.boxnation.com/boxing-news/was-floyd-mayweather-really-dehydrated-the-fallout-from-can-boxing-trust-usada/ As for his most notable wins, David is right when he says that Mayweather fought a lot of them at the right time. Pacquiao - Had slowed down considerably by 2015. Also entered the fight with an injured shoulder. Cotto - Had been involved in wars with Clottey, Margarito and Pacquiao. Canelo - Nowhere near the fighter he later became. He doesn't have a single win on his record that is as impressive as say Duran's win over Leonard, Leonard's win over Hearns, or Hearns' win over Duran. Which is partially why I don't rank him as highly as any of the Fab 4 all-time. I also think that Duran, Hearns and Leonard would all have given Mayweather fits head to head, albeit for different reasons. Edited June 7, 2021 by jimufctna24 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cousin Jim Bob Posted June 7, 2021 Share Posted June 7, 2021 2 minutes ago, jimufctna24 said:  He doesn't have a single win on his record that is as impressive as say Duran's win over Leonard, Leonard's win over Hearns, or Hearns' win over Duran. Which is partially why I don't rank him as highly as the Fab 4 all-time. I also think that Duran, Hearns and Leonard would all have given Mayweather fits head to head, albeit for different reasons.  Which is the funniest thing with him tbh. He can bang on about how much money he makes all day but what really rankles him and always pisses him off in interviews is when people say he isn't the greatest he claims to be. So when the youtubers run out and the attention goes away. There is going to be no one other than himself that considers him "TBE" or the "GOAT". He will just be a moaning little shit still claiming he was the best. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Posted June 7, 2021 Share Posted June 7, 2021 17 minutes ago, jimufctna24 said: As for his most notable wins, David is right when he says that Mayweather fought a lot of them at the right time. Pacquiao - Had slowed down considerably by 2015. Also entered the fight with an injured shoulder. Cotto - Had been involved in wars with Clottey, Margarito and Pacquiao. Canelo - Nowhere near the fighter he later became. It should also be pointed out that a lot of those timing issues weren't due to his actions. He often fought guys when the opportunity came up and the circumstances were right. And let's be honest, at least he fought them. How many fighters now simply don't fight the top guys? Especially over a period of what? Nearly 20 years. It's also worth noting that a "slowed down" Pacquiao has went 5-1 since he lost to Mayweather, and that one loss was a controversial decision to Jeff Horn. He's due to face Errol Spence this summer for the welterweight title, over six years since he lost to Floyd. Would anyone be really shocked if he won that fight? My opinion? No version of Pacquiao beats Floyd. Fuck, even a slower version you'd expect to have some semblance of success, but he got handily beaten. 23 minutes ago, jimufctna24 said: He doesn't have a single win on his record that is as impressive as say Duran's win over Leonard, Leonard's win over Hearns, or Hearns' win over Duran. Which is partially why I don't rank him as highly as any of the Fab 4 all-time. I also think that Duran, Hearns and Leonard would all have given Mayweather fits head to head, albeit for different reasons. See, that's the thing about boxing. Someone like Floyd will see their greatness count against them. In boxing, fans favour the fighter who goes in there and engages in all-out wars, gets knocked down, loses, comes back, wins, loses again, gets their brain rattled around. I would have loved to see Leonard face Mayweather, but I would have picked Floyd to beat him, and think he'd have made a mockery of Hearns, Hagler and certainly Duran. Considering Duran lost the plot and walked away when Leonard boxed him to bits, imagine if he'd fought Floyd? Not being able to connect? Being made to look slow? It would have been "no mas" all over the shop. 15 minutes ago, Cousin Jim Bob said: Which is the funniest thing with him tbh. He can bang on about how much money he makes all day but what really rankles him and always pisses him off in interviews is when people say he isn't the greatest he claims to be. So when the youtubers run out and the attention goes away. There is going to be no one other than himself that considers him "TBE" or the "GOAT". He will just be a moaning little shit still claiming he was the best. It rankles him because it's ridiculous. He fought all the big names of his era and never mind coming close to beating him, not one of them managed to land a real glove on him. He's never been shaken, never mind knocked down. Floyd Mayweather is the living epitome of boxing. The art of hitting and not getting hit. His reflexes and footwork is probably the best the sport has ever seen. No one will ever compare to not just his record and his financial accomplishments, but to how he fought. It's okay for fans to say they don't like him. I've seen it said that he "Ran" during his fights, which is moronic, but okay, fans can be fans. Let's not be silly and try to pretend he's not most likely the best pure skilled boxer the sport has ever seen. Not the most exciting, not the most likeable. That much is evident by the excuses we see trotted out to try and dilute his accomplishments. But by fuck could the lad box. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members wandshogun09 Posted June 7, 2021 Paid Members Share Posted June 7, 2021 (edited) I loathe the prick but Mayweatherâs gonna go down as one of the best of all time. Whether me, you or the British Bulldog wants it or not. And in years to come, all most people will remember is who he beat. The names on the record. Not the bullshit and pre-fight shenanigans surrounding those fights. That goes on all the time. Floyd exploited it when he got the power to do so. But even back in the Four Kings era, you had Leonardâs team deliberately pushing for the immediate rematch with Duran because they knew Duran had been on the piss and eating himself stupid for months celebrating the win the first time. Then you had Leonard showing little interest in fighting Hagler until he saw Hagler go to war with John Mugabi and suddenly fancied the job. Then before Leonard vs Hagler there was all kinds of back and forth about the size of the ring, the judges, the number of rounds (Hagler wanted 15) etc. Going back even further, wasnât there something about Muhammad Ali having the ropes loosened before the Foreman fight because he planned to use the old rope-a-dope tactics? I might be misremembering that one though. And while Floyd always got shit for choosing when to fight guys and stacking the odds in his favour, loveable Manny was no angel himself in that regard having last legs De La Hoya and a Cotto not far removed from the Margarito hand wrap battering come down in weight to fight him. And smashing up a near blind Margarito. Itâs always gone on. Itâs just more instantly known now because of the constant stream of internet journalists and social media updating us every time one of the fighters so much as farts during camp. You can poke holes in anyoneâs record if you really want to. And like I said, I canât stand him. Iâd love to shit on his legacy. But some people would have you believe heâs just scammed his way through his career. To have the longevity heâs had, against the names heâs beat, and to only really be able to point to a couple of examples of him ever being in any kind of bother in a fight and maybe one or two examples of him almost losing a decision. To put together a career like his over such a long period easily puts him in the all time best convo for me. And most of his well known wins were after his hands were damaged as well. You go back earlier in his career and watch his destructions of guys like Diego Corrales and Arturo Gatti (see now youâve made me open up that old wound), heâs been a ridiculously great fighter for a ridiculously long time. Canât believe Iâm defending this cretin. Heâs definitely been shaken though @David Shane Mosley had him on right Bambi legs early in their fight. He recovered and won comfortably so it means nothing in the end. But it definitely had him wobbly for a spell. Edited June 7, 2021 by wandshogun09 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Posted June 7, 2021 Share Posted June 7, 2021 1 minute ago, wandshogun09 said: Canât believe Iâm defending this cretin. You're not. You're defending his sporting accomplishments. There's a difference. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members wandshogun09 Posted June 7, 2021 Paid Members Share Posted June 7, 2021 Yeah, I can separate that. But it still feels wrong. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimufctna24 Posted June 7, 2021 Share Posted June 7, 2021 7 minutes ago, David said: My opinion? No version of Pacquiao beats Floyd. Fuck, even a slower version you'd expect to have some semblance of success, but he got handily beaten. I actually agree with this.  7 minutes ago, David said: See, that's the thing about boxing. Someone like Floyd will see their greatness count against them. In boxing, fans favour the fighter who goes in there and engages in all-out wars, gets knocked down, loses, comes back, wins, loses again, gets their brain rattled around. I would have loved to see Leonard face Mayweather, but I would have picked Floyd to beat him, and think he'd have made a mockery of Hearns, Hagler and certainly Duran. Considering Duran lost the plot and walked away when Leonard boxed him to bits, imagine if he'd fought Floyd? Not being able to connect? Being made to look slow? It would have been "no mas" all over the shop. Mayweather would have very little for Leonard imo. Leonard could jab with him, batter him on the inside, and most of all would drown him with his powerful combination punching. Sure, Mayweather's defence was superb, but Leonard was no strange to figuring out defensive wizards (see his fight with Benitez) Hearns would destroy him! The way to beat Hearns at the lower weights was to out punch him as Leonard did. He was near enough impossible to out-box at that weight as Leonard, Benitez and Duran found out. Mayweather would not have the power or combo punching to get Hearns's respect. Duran? Well considering that Mayweather backed up in straight lines, it's easy to imagine a prime version of Duran backing him up and drowning him against the ropes. Duran was one of the best inside fighters of all-time and would have no issue taking Mayweather apart at that range. As this excellent article argues, Mayweather came closest to defeat in his career due to being backed up in a straight line by two boxers who were by no means in the same league as Duran - https://www.thefight-site.com/home/floyd-mayweather-solving-the-riddle?rq=floyd 16 minutes ago, David said: He's never been shaken, never mind knocked down. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Posted June 7, 2021 Share Posted June 7, 2021 1 minute ago, jimufctna24 said: Mayweather would have very little for Leonard imo. Leonard could jab with him, batter him on the inside, and most of all would drown him with his powerful combination punching. Sure, Mayweather's defence was superb, but Leonard was no strange to figuring out defensive wizards (see his fight with Benitez) Mayweather vs Leonard would have a been a great fight to see. Possibly the one fight I'd ask for if given the old "what fight would you choose if you could pick two fighters in their prime" nonsense. Not as sure about Floyd winning that one, but I'm still reasonably sure he'd get the job done. How many fights did he go into where we'd hear that this was the time he's getting beaten? Or at least dropped? And he changed shit up and won. I think he'd do the same with Leonard. 3 minutes ago, jimufctna24 said: Hearns would destroy him! Nope. 3 minutes ago, jimufctna24 said: Duran? Well considering that Mayweather backed up in straight lines, it's easy to imagine a prime version of Duran backing him up and drowning him against the ropes. Duran was one of the best inside fighters of all-time and would have no issue taking Mayweather apart at that range. As this excellent article argues, Mayweather came closest to defeat in his career due to being backed up in a straight line by two boxers who were by no means in the same league as Duran - https://www.thefight-site.com/home/floyd-mayweather-solving-the-riddle?rq=floyd Duran would have been too slow. Simple as that. We also have to take into account that Floyd, being the more modern fighter, would have had the advantage in athleticism and he'd have been far smarter than Duran in there. A few rounds of shoulder rolls and Duran would be losing his temper. Another good fight to think about though. I also have to ask the question, are we talking about Floyd pre or post glass hands? Because if we're talking pre, that sways me even more in his favour.  Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimufctna24 Posted June 7, 2021 Share Posted June 7, 2021 Just now, David said: How many fights did he go into where we'd hear that this was the time he's getting beaten? Or at least dropped? And he changed shit up and won. I think he'd do the same with Leonard. Leonard was just as good at adapting. Watch his bouts with Hearns and Kalule. 1 minute ago, David said: Duran would have been too slow. Simple as that. We also have to take into account that Floyd, being the more modern fighter, would have had the advantage in athleticism and he'd have been far smarter than Duran in there. A few rounds of shoulder rolls and Duran would be losing his temper. Another good fight to think about though. I also have to ask the question, are we talking about Floyd pre or post glass hands? Because if we're talking pre, that sways me even more in his favour. You seriously underrate Duran as a boxer. Both versions. The route to victory I described gave both versions of Mayweather serious problems. Genuine question, do you rate Maidana and Castillo as better boxers than Duran? 20 minutes ago, wandshogun09 said: And smashing up a near blind Margarito. It was Pac-man that smashed up Margarito's eye. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Posted June 7, 2021 Share Posted June 7, 2021 1 minute ago, jimufctna24 said: Leonard was just as good at adapting. Watch his bouts with Hearns and Kalule. Oh, absolutely. That's why it's the fight I'd love to see. It would be as close as any Mayweather fight I think. Would still give Floyd the advantage though, personally. 2 minutes ago, jimufctna24 said: You seriously underrate Duran as a boxer. Both versions. The route to victory I described gave both versions of Mayweather serious problems. Genuine question, do you rate Maidana and Castillo as better boxers than Duran? I think Duran was excellent if the styles were right for him. Leonard was all wrong for him. Mayweather would be all wrong for him. Winky Wright would be all wrong for him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members wandshogun09 Posted June 7, 2021 Paid Members Share Posted June 7, 2021 (edited) 16 minutes ago, David said: I also have to ask the question, are we talking about Floyd pre or post glass hands? Because if we're talking pre, that sways me even more in his favour. In a weird way I think âglass handsâ Floyd mightâve actually fared better. I think earlier in his career, as good as he was technically, he mightâve been more up for getting into more exchanges with Duran and it couldâve cost him. As shit as his damaged hands wouldâve been, I think it probably wouldâve forced him to really choose his openings more carefully and try to frustrate Duran like Leonard did the second time. âHands Of Glassâ vs âHands Of Stoneâ wouldâve been interesting. But âPretty Boyâ era Floyd wouldâve probably made for a more exciting fight. On the Leonard point, I get your bit about there being a few times with people predicting âthis is the time Floyd might loseâ and him adapting and winning. But if weâre talking Leonard in his prime, he was a different class to the guys Floyd was beating for me. And thatâs not a knock on those guys. I love Hatton and Cotto is one of my favourite boxers ever. But Leonard was something really special. Floyd couldâve adjusted but I think Leonard was intelligent and slick enough to adjust to those adjustments. I genuinely donât know who Iâd pick if we somehow got Leonard vs Mayweather both at their best. Thatâs a proper dream fight right there. @jimufctna24 yeah I meant Pacquiao on the Margarito bit. I was using that as an example of Mannyâs list of wins not exactly being without flaws itself. Was just pointing out that you can find issues with anyoneâs record if you look long enough. Edited June 7, 2021 by wandshogun09 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.