General politics discussion thread

[Loki]

Unanimity on the UKFF! Quick, stick this in Gold.

 

In many respects, I think the Coalition are trying to enact this via the backdoor, as it were, dissuading people from going to University by upping the financial ante. I wish someone in some party would actually present this as a viable option though.

 

Did anyone read this?

 

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/polit...or-2159587.html

 

A Ttory councillor suggests that unemployed workers from the North of England could work in southern fruit farms instead of relying on immigrant labour. I know he said it in a stupid way (he IS a Tory after all) but, well... it's not that stupid an idea, is it?

[tiger_rick]

it's not that stupid an idea, is it?

Well they'd have to live in the South for a start so it's not an attractive proposition.

[Dynamite Duane]

Stepping back to look at the bigger picture I see the uni fees simply as a way to put pressure on people for more money. The squeeze is being put on governments by those who lend the money to the nations, so they put the squeeze on the people of the country.

 

By the way I do I agree we need more learning trades to become plumbers, electricians etc and less people learning stuff of little worth, but sadly I don't see much positive change coming, apprenticeships have become a thing of the past it seems. Hey why bother training those from your own country when it's easier to bring in someone from another country trained up who will do the job cheaper....

 

Changing the topic, anyone see ITV's The War You Don't See? A real eye opener about how the media portrays conflicts to it's people using 'embedded' journalism. In our mainstream media see a very different story to what is actually experienced by those affected by the acts of our and America's military in Iraq and Afghanistan.

 

The programme showed the history of the reporting on wars since World War 1 and also covered the atrocities of Vietnam.

Edited December 15, 2010 by Dynamite Duane

[Carbomb]

Changing the topic, anyone see ITV's The War You Don't See? A real eye opener about how the media portrays conflicts to it's people using 'embedded' journalism. In our mainstream media see a very different story to what is actually experienced by those affected by the acts of our and America's military in Iraq and Afghanistan.

 

The programme showed the history of the reporting on wars since World War 1 and also covered the atrocities of Vietnam.

 

That's really nothing new. Anyone who maintains any kind of critical outlook can tell you that that approach has been around for millennia - it's standard propaganda to daemonise your enemy and glorify your cause. Read "The Crusades Through Arab Eyes" - might be out of print, it's quite old, but it's a worthy read; provides a rarely-studied perspective of the Crusades, even to Westerners who look at them with cynicism.

 

Another good read: "The Tears Of The Indians", by Bartolom

[bobbins]

It was shocking and utterly unsurprising in equal measures. Well worth going out of your way to see, particularly for Pilger's attacks on the BBC and ITV news executives. Still on itvplayer.

[Loki]

I see such programmes as this as excellent proof that the media in this country are still relatively unsullied by the sort of partisanship that afflicts the media in places like the US. It's always encouraging to see someone given time to berate the broadcasters themselves. The Beeb are really good at this - for every reporter that presents one way, there's a show that critiques it or deconstructs it somewhere else on the network.

[David]

Without wishing to put words in anyones mouth, I suspect posts like the one below are the kind to which SSB refers.

 

That being said, if it were to turn out that this student *was* assaulted by a police officer, I would hope and expect that the officer be held accountable.

Just like the copper (who had previous before the event) who done in Ian Tomlinson?

 

The inference to be drawn from it is that because one police constable is suspected of using unreasonable force, that all police officers must use unreasonable levels of force when policing in public order situations, and be unfettered by legal due process as a result of their priveliged position.

Not at all.

 

I don't believe for a second that all police officers use unreasonable force when dealing with public order situations, but it can't be argued that some do, and that history tells us that those particular officers won't pay the penalty for it most of the time.

 

Incidents such as the De Menezes situation, coupled with the way the Ian Tomlinson situation has unfolded doesn't do anything to help change my opinion.

 

In both instances the police tried to cover up the crime, and in both instances none of the police officers involved faced serious charges. In fact, the officer who killed Tomlinson was brought up on charges of gross misconduct.

 

A total farce.

 

A Ttory councillor suggests that unemployed workers from the North of England could work in southern fruit farms instead of relying on immigrant labour. I know he said it in a stupid way (he IS a Tory after all) but, well... it's not that stupid an idea, is it?

Unfortunately that would never work.

 

The majority of those fruit farms rely on cheap immigrant labour that can be paid below the NMW and employed "off the books". Employing UK workers would require them to disclose all employee details and bump up pay, which I doubt they would be willing to do.

[Dynamite Duane]

See what you think of this youtube video:

 

(10mins) Edited December 19, 2010 by Dynamite Duane

[Loki]

It started ok, with some high-school level political explanations, and then descended quickly into rampant nonsense, as always with your videos. The number of factual errors was pretty scary actually, particularly in relation to what constitutes revenue!

 

 

Could you at least keep the tinfoil to the appropriate thread?

[Yoghurt]

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2010/12/20/edl_hack/

 

The EDL have had a large portion of their donation membership database stolen. Also people who have bought from their shop. I shall be giving the list a going over when it is released through the usual channels.

[Psygnosis]

Vince Cable has resigned according to the Beeb, other places say he hasn't - Apparently this is over the Murdoch BSkyB thing.

[patiirc]

Vince Cable has resigned according to the Beeb, other places say he hasn't - Apparently this is over the Murdoch BSkyB thing.

 

Whats all the brouhaha Ive been out

 

Vince Cable has declared war on an unjust share acquisition/take over? and labour have spazzed out?

 

 

Or have I missed something

[Psygnosis]

No idea what so ever, this has come out of nowhere.

 

He's also saying he could 'bring the government down'.

[patiirc]

No idea what so ever, this has come out of nowhere.

 

He's also saying he could 'bring the government down'.

 

Ooh will me eye on that could be fun

 

Also

 

RIP Brian Hanrahan- Much loved BBC Journalist and Anthony Howard Politcal Commentator..

[InvertedSmiley]

Vince Cable was caught out by two undercover reporters from the Daily Telegraph posing as constituents.

 

Vince Cable told undercover reporters he had "declared war on Rupert Murdoch" and planned to block his efforts to take full control of BSkyB, according to the BBC's Robert Peston.

 

The business secretary's admission came in conversation with Daily Telegraph reporters posing as constituents.

 

Robert Peston said the Telegraph chose not to publish the "most explosive" part of its investigaton.

 

But a transcript was passed to him by a whistleblower.

 

According to the transcript seen by the BBC's business editor, Mr Cable said: "I am picking my fights, some of which you may have seen, some of which you may haven't seen.

 

"And I don't know if you have been following what has been happening with the Murdoch press, where I have declared war on Mr Murdoch and I think we are going to win."

 

News Corporation, which is run by Rupert Murdoch, already owns 39% of BSkyB but wants to buy up the remaining 61%.

 

The group also owns News International - whose publications The Sun, News of the World, The Times and The Sunday Times account for a third of the UK's national newspaper circulation.

 

Mr Cable ordered Ofcom to investigate the proposal over concerns about press freedom and consumer choice - but he will have the final say and has stressed the need to be politically impartial.

 

The BBC News Channel's chief political correspondent Laura Kuenssberg said the revelation would be "uncomfortable" for Mr Cable and could lead to questions about his future.

 

BSkyB has declined to comment on Mr Cable's remarks.

 

In the transcript, Mr Cable tells the undercover reporter:

 

"Well I did not politicise it, because it is a legal question..but he (Mr Murdoch) is trying to take over BSkyB - you probably know that."

 

The reporter says: "I know vaguely".

 

Cable: "With considerably enhanced..."

 

Reporter: "I always thought that he had BSkyB with Sky anyway?"

 

Cable: "No, he has minority shares and he wants a majority - and a majority control would give them a massive stake."

 

"I have blocked it using the powers that I have got and they are legal powers that I have got. I can't politicise it but from the people that know what is happening this is a big, big thing.

 

His whole empire is now under attack...So there are things like that we do in government, that we can't do...all we can do in opposition is protest".

 

BBC Link

 

EDIT to add: Personnally I think Cable is a little too smart for that and was perhaps fully aware that he was being recorded (maybe he was tipped off?) and has chosen to boldly undermine the Coalition. He has always been the least 'on message' member of the government.

Edited December 21, 2010 by InvertedSmiley