Mr Butternut Squash Posted July 5, 2013 Share Posted July 5, 2013 Punk, Bryan and Ambrose all showed star quality on the indies though. If they can turn him into a half decent wrestler like Cesaro or get a good promo out of him like Rollins I'd be up for it. Elgin's the only one of them I'm interested in them getting signed though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members IANdrewDiceClay Posted July 5, 2013 Paid Members Share Posted July 5, 2013 (edited) Ambrose all showed star quality on the indies though. Davey Richards is a far bigger star at this level than Ambrose was. Ambrose wasn't even seen as half of what he became in FCW when he was getting his back carved up by light tubes. I'd say Richards and Ambrose had the same level of doubters. Actually I bet more people think that Richards has a better chance at making it in WWE than there were people who believed in Ambrose when he first got signed. People can say what they want, but there's no way anyone thought Ambrose would be the star he is now before he got signed. And Cesaro was far more charismatic at indy level and in FCW than he is on the main roster. I dont see what star quality has to do with anything when it comes to getting signed to developmental. They dont sign people based on star quality. Edited July 5, 2013 by IANdrewDiceClay Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Butternut Squash Posted July 5, 2013 Share Posted July 5, 2013 Ambrose all showed star quality on the indies though. Davey Richards is a far bigger star at this level than Ambrose was. Ambrose wasn't even seen as half of what he became in FCW when he was getting his back carved up by light tubes. I'd say Richards and Ambrose had the same level of doubters. Actually I bet more people think that Richards has a better chance at making it in WWE than there were people who believed in Ambrose when he first got signed. People can say what they want, but there's no way anyone thought Ambrose would be the star he is now before he got signed. And Cesaro was far more charismatic at indy level and in FCW than he is on the main roster. I dont see what star quality has to do with anything when it comes to getting signed to developmental. They dont sign people based on star quality. Â I have no doubt that the WWE saw something in Ambrose and the promos he was cutting on the indies. They made a big deal out of him as soon as he stepped into FCW and put him with their champ Rollins. He was having matches with Punk and feuding with Regal not long after. I don't think Cesaro or Rollins had much going for them before they got signed, my point was that the WWE turned them into something good. I hope they can do the same with Richards. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members IANdrewDiceClay Posted July 5, 2013 Paid Members Share Posted July 5, 2013 (edited) You were talking about the indies. Not developmental. You were questioning why they would sign Richards based on what they were looking for with their previous signings. I'm saying Davey Richards right now has more upside than Jon Moxley had before he went to FCW in terms of what WWE is looking for. Â And Rollins was always going to be a star. He's one of the best wrestlers on their roster and he's a likable bloke. He was class before he got to FCW. He's going to be a big babyface for them. Cesaro they've done fuck all with, and he's been ready for the main roster since about 2008. Edited July 5, 2013 by IANdrewDiceClay Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daaaaaad! Posted July 5, 2013 Share Posted July 5, 2013 (edited) You were talking about the indies. Not developmental. You were questioning why they would sign Richards based on what they were looking for with their previous signings. I'm saying Davey Richards right now has more upside than Jon Moxley had before he went to FCW in terms of what WWE is looking for. Nah, I completely disagree. Jon Moxley always had an aura about his promos that made you think if someone taught him he'd go far. Richards has shown no such thing to me and he's also got a clear disregard for everything - authority, safety, ring psychology. Plus he's five foot seven or something. If you'd pointed to both of them at any stage of their respective careers and said 'which one of these could succeed in WWE?', I'd always have said Moxley over Richards. Edited July 5, 2013 by Dingbat Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Butternut Squash Posted July 5, 2013 Share Posted July 5, 2013 (edited) I'm saying Davey Richards right now has more upside than Jon Moxley had before he went to FCW in terms of what WWE is looking for. Â He has more name value no doubt but I'd be surprised if they saw him as anything more than a small, bland athletic guy who can put people over, unlike people who stand out a bit and could become something bigger (Ambrose, Punk etc.). Edited July 5, 2013 by Mr Butternut Squash Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members IANdrewDiceClay Posted July 5, 2013 Paid Members Share Posted July 5, 2013 (edited) You were talking about the indies. Not developmental. You were questioning why they would sign Richards based on what they were looking for with their previous signings. I'm saying Davey Richards right now has more upside than Jon Moxley had before he went to FCW in terms of what WWE is looking for. Nah, I completely disagree. Jon Moxley always had an aura about his promos that made you think if someone taught him he'd go far. Richards has shown no such thing to me and he's also got a clear disregard for everything - authority, safety, ring psychology. Plus he's five foot seven or something. If you'd pointed to either of them at any stage of their careers and said 'which one of these could succeed in WWE?', I'd always have said Moxley over Richards. One bloke worked for New Japan and Ring of Honor, so some big name companies were already interested in having him work for them. The other had his back scared up with light tubes and other shite you get in death matches and wasn't that much of a name anyway. Moxley's pre-WWE career wasn't so glittering at all. It was a surprise he got signed, because he had no body (still doesn't) and he wasn't particularly great in the ring. And many (including me) questioned whether his Health Ledger tribute act would translate over into TV wrestling. Which it did. But few would have predicted that. Â I'm not talking about 2013, where Ambrose is on course to be one of their biggest names in the next 18 months. I'm talking about when he was Jon Moxley doing these disjointed brawls in his speedos in small halls. There's no fucking way anyone would have thought they'd have signed a Joker tribute act over a Chris Benoit tribute act. Richards probably would have been hired years ago if he wasn't on his period for most of his career. Same with the Briscoes. They'd have been signed if it wasn't for their backwards mentality. Edited July 5, 2013 by IANdrewDiceClay Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Butternut Squash Posted July 5, 2013 Share Posted July 5, 2013 One bloke worked for New Japan and Ring of Honor, so some big name companies were already interested in having him work for them. The other had his back scared up with light tubes and other shite you get in death matches and wasn't that much of a name anyway. Moxley's pre-WWE career wasn't so glittering at all. It was a surprise he got signed, because he had no body (still doesn't) and he wasn't particularly great in the ring. And many (including me) questioned whether his Health Ledger tribute act would translate over into TV wrestling. Which it did. But few would have predicted that. Â WWE don't give a shit about that though do they. Moxley - Heath Ledger or not - was engaging and different and always got over. He's taller and can be made to look like a star unlike the small boring bloke. That's probably more important to the E. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members air_raid Posted July 5, 2013 Paid Members Share Posted July 5, 2013 He has more name value no doubt but I'd be surprised if they saw him as anything more than a small, bland athletic guy who can put people over, unlike people who stand out a bit and could become something bigger (Ambrose, Punk etc.). Â Fine retconning. I never thought there was any bigger potential to Moxley/Ambrose, and that Gargano would have been the better signing out of that group. Davey has been Queen Of The Indys for years and had "that lot" thinking he's the best in the world, something nobody ever said about Moxley, even from the deranged Indy fan point of view. Â Richards executes well (although he does far too much and wants every match to last 30 minutes plus instead of making a small number of things matter) and he's not bland - he does intense/borderline psychotic rather well. If anything, TOO well. One day he's going to be a "beaten wife" story. But he's certainly not a cookie-cutter generic Indy CAW in terms of the way he carries himself like Edwards is. Â Punk was a fucking miracle when you think about it. For all his proficiency on the mic, he was sloppy and disjointed in his offence before he left the Murphy Rec centre behind. From a wrestling point of view, Davey probably represents less of a challenge than Punk did, if not from an entertainment point of view. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members IANdrewDiceClay Posted July 5, 2013 Paid Members Share Posted July 5, 2013 (edited) WWE don't give a shit about that though do they. Well yes. CM Punk was hired because of his work in Ring of Honor seen by Mick Foley. Daniel Bryan was fired in the early 2000s and rehired based off his work in Ring of Honor, Antonio Cesaro was fired from WWE years ago and rehired based off his worked in ROH. Chris Hero was hired because they liked what they saw of him in ROH. They are keeping tabs on Prince Devitt who they rate immensely. Its not 1992 anymore. WWE has their eye on the independent scene, because the people they have working in their developmental league pretty much are all well traveled and the head of talent relations wants the business to go back to what happens in the ring. Â Moxley - Heath Ledger or not - was engaging and different and always got over. Always got over where? I thought "WWE don't give a shit about that"? Â Also 'The E'? Urgh! Â Punk was a fucking miracle when you think about it. For all his proficiency on the mic, he was sloppy and disjointed in his offence before he left the Murphy Rec centre behind. From a wrestling point of view, Davey probably represents less of a challenge than Punk did, if not from an entertainment point of view. Yeah. Punk is like 50 times better now than he was on the indies. And for all the shit people give him about his beard and questionable haircuts now, those shorts and blonde hair were like WWE contract repellent. The business has changed so much in the last 6 or 7 years. Â You're spot on about Richards. He reminds me of Vinnie Vincent (I hope someone understands this reference). He pisses on Ace Frehley when it comes technical ability and knowing all the chords. But Ace has charm even though he's a piss head who can't remember his parts. Vinnie Vincent knew it all but couldn't put it all together like Ace did. Like Richards. He has a good base to be something good. But he's so stuck in his ways. Developmental has always been the best place for him. Hopefully he drops the Billy Big Bollocks act as well. Edited July 5, 2013 by IANdrewDiceClay Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Butternut Squash Posted July 5, 2013 Share Posted July 5, 2013 'Don't give a shit' about their other work and achievements was strong yeah , but I still think THE E would take a tallish athletic guy that oozes personality over a small, dull athletic bloke. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators PowerButchi Posted July 5, 2013 Moderators Share Posted July 5, 2013 (edited) Eddie Edwards is worth a punt, to be honest. A bit of time in Orlando and he'll be cracking. He already seems to get pacing when he's not wrestling Richards. Â Davey Bellend, not so much. Â Â WWE don't give a shit about that though do they. Well yes. CM Punk was hired because of his work in Ring of Honor seen by Mick Foley. Daniel Bryan was fired in the early 2000s and rehired based off his work in Ring of Honor, Â Â Gotta disagree there, brother. Bryan could have strutted into the WWE from 2005 or so and been pushed. That's why he was treated like Devon Storm on Veloicity. Daniel Bryan's had a job there whenever he's wanted one. Nothing to do with Ring of Honor, that's why he got away with effing and jeffing at HHH the other week. He's always going to do well because he's respected. But Ring of Honor has nothing to do with him getting hired. Edited July 5, 2013 by PowerButchi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members air_raid Posted July 5, 2013 Paid Members Share Posted July 5, 2013 (edited) "Shawn says he's good, Regal says he's good, so he must be good" kind of situation, I'd imagine. Â Another reason why Punk was a miracle. "Arn says he doesn't know how to work." Then again, if I were in the room I'd have simply said "Arn drinks." Edited July 5, 2013 by air_raid Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daaaaaad! Posted July 5, 2013 Share Posted July 5, 2013 One bloke worked for New Japan and Ring of Honor, so some big name companies were already interested in having him work for them. The other had his back scared up with light tubes and other shite you get in death matches and wasn't that much of a name anyway. Moxley's pre-WWE career wasn't so glittering at all. It was a surprise he got signed, because he had no body (still doesn't) and he wasn't particularly great in the ring. And many (including me) questioned whether his Health Ledger tribute act would translate over into TV wrestling. Which it did. But few would have predicted that. I'm not talking about 2013, where Ambrose is on course to be one of their biggest names in the next 18 months. I'm talking about when he was Jon Moxley doing these disjointed brawls in his speedos in small halls. There's no fucking way anyone would have thought they'd have signed a Joker tribute act over a Chris Benoit tribute act. Richards probably would have been hired years ago if he wasn't on his period for most of his career. Same with the Briscoes. They'd have been signed if it wasn't for their backwards mentality. I knew you'd bring up the garbage wrestling, but in doing so you missed my entire post. I didn't say his career was glittering and I definitely didn't go into how much of a 'name' they were. WWE don't give a shit about how much of a name you are otherwise all these guys would be coming in under their indie identities. I still unequivocally believe that Moxley, regardless of what stage of his career he was at, was always more likely to hit WWE than Richards, because he knows how wrestling works. DR doesn't. I appreciate all this can be fixed in developmental, but despite Wesley being more 'complete' at this point, I actually think there's more to be done with him than there was with Moxley/Ambrose. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members IANdrewDiceClay Posted July 5, 2013 Paid Members Share Posted July 5, 2013 (edited) WWE don't give a shit about how much of a name you are otherwise all these guys would be coming in under their indie identities. And with this you completely miss my point. That has nothing to do with anything. My point was he had a better base for what they are looking for in terms of molding a wrestler in their form. Nothing to do with the success he had. Marketability and reputation as a worker are two different things altogether. Â Anyway I'm talking about in broad terms. If you thought that Ambrose was more likely than Richards to gain employment, well done. But that wasn't the general consensus at all. Nobody expected them to pick him up. A chubby ginger who worked small time indies wasn't the first on my list of people I expected them to hire. Whereas when Ambrose was hired everyone was banging on about him. Edited July 5, 2013 by IANdrewDiceClay Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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