Boxing Thread

[HeavyT]

Okay sorry guys, the humble yet confident Khan was completely outclassing Garcia, until Garcia threw a lucky punch, could have happened to anyone (except it never had before, and it probably wont again). Khan deserves a rematch, he completely dominated those two rounds!!!

[Keith Houchen]

To be honest, Heavy, I'd rather you had pointed out how Froch and Khan have been going at each other in a war of words for years. Your capitulation after one good shot reminds me of a certain British fighter but I can't quite remember who.

[HeavyT]

here's a few quotes for you: -

 

Before Gomez fight: "I'm above fighting these domestic level boxers"

 

After shot Gomez takes him to hell and back:"Now I'm fighting world class fighters like Gomez"

 

"If I was white I would be a superstar" before being cheered to the rafters by the majority WHITE audience upon decking the mighty Salita

 

Sold a shitty 50 minute DVD of "his story so far"(highlights of fights against daniel thorpe and Baz Carey) for 20 quid a pop

 

"I'll retire after fighting(beating) Floyd and Pacquiao" how very presumptious of you Amir

 

He also called Oisin Fagan "a great fighter", and that stopping him was impressive because he went the distacnce with Chavez Jr (in a four rounder)

 

to name but a few.

 

My apologies, I went a bit offtrack with that Khan and Froch stuff, but Khan DID brag about selling more tickets, making more money and being more exciting. He said it on his facebook and deleted it.

Edited July 19, 2012 by HeavyT

[Keith Houchen]

I don't think anyone is disputing that Khan said things of that nature, as that link I posted shows. The issue is the way you presented those things being said in a manner befitting Shawn Michaels at the height of his heel days.

 

And to be fair, re Gomez, how often do you see fighters talk trash about one another only to hug and show respect at the end of the fight? Even Haye and Chisora did that! I can understand why Khan rubs people up the wrong way, but my initial point in all of this was that to put him in the same category of arrogance as Hamed (which you didn't) is, as I said, at best lazy, at worst racist.

[HeavyT]

ANyone who thinks Garcia got "lucky" against Khan oviously know nothing and should go back and study that fight, the pre-fight media quotes and Garcia's past fights. Khan can learn, and fight him again and maybe win, but that was no stroke of luck, Garcia knew what he was going for and it worked a treat.

 

Also the Gomez thing, NO ONE would have called that guy world class, even if they lost to him.

Edited July 19, 2012 by HeavyT

[David]

I dont exactly k ow what Khan said but it was along the lines of "I sell tickets, people want to see ME. I have a name, I have fans, blah fucking blah". He said it on his Facebook, I saw it with my own eyes.

Sorry T, but I'm not going to just take your word for it. I personally don't think your opinion of Khan is unbiased enough to do so.

 

A 100 year old Judah, the two times stopped powder puff Malignaggi, Mcloskey!!, the now exposed Maidana and Lamont Peterson are hardly a string of P4P opponents, and he lost to one of them.

Judah was 5-0 going into that fight with Khan, and was only 33 when they fought each other. Look at his record. He went the distance with Mayweather & Baldomir, and has lost to fighters such as Cotto and Tszyu. Sure, he's not a pound for pound great, but he's not a bum either.

 

Malignaggi was coming off a win over Juan Diaz coming into the Khan fight, and has only lost four fights. Those three losses besides the Khan defeat are Hatton, Diaz & Cotto. Not too shabby, eh? Sure, he's not a big puncher (something that I mentioned when the fight was signed), but he's no slouch either.

 

Maidana was a good win in my book. You say he's "now exposed"? How so? Since losing to Khan he's went 2-1 (including a win over Erik Morales), with that one loss coming to Devon Alexander in his first fight in a new weight class. He has since said that the move up was a mistake and that he didn't feel comfortable there and is moving back down in future.

 

I'm not quite sure why you mentioned McCloskey. He was ranked #10 in the world and had gone unbeaten for something like twenty odd fights had he not? He deserved a shot, and Khan dealt with him rather easily.

 

People who big up the first few rounds of a fight that there fighter was winning till he got "caught" are just making excuses.

It's not an excuse, he was winning that fight until he got caught with a good (albeit lucky) punch that got him behind the ear. I have no doubt that if they rematch in December as has been suggested that Khan wins without too much trouble.

 

Could have happen to ANYONE? get a fucking grip, Khan ate Garcia's best(some say his only useful) shot, and he fucking telegraphs them! That would never have happened to a true "elite" fighter.

Has anyone on here actually described Khan as a bona fide elite fighter? I know I haven't. I certainly wouldn't pick him to beat Mayweather should they ever fight. He's a good, top level fighter, but he's not elite.

 

This debate didn't come about because people like me were saying Khan was an elite level fighter, it came about because there's a unusual amount of hatred for him in this country, which you claim is because of his cockyness and what he says.

 

When pressed to provide evidence of such talk all you've managed to provide is mutterings of deleted Facebook & Twitter comments. Even if these comments are true, how many people are actually seeing them in the brief timeframe they're on his pages before he deletes them?

 

I'd be willing to bet that the vast amount of people are seeing comments and quotes such as this;

 

"Well done to Danny Garcia on his performance, but I promise I'll bounce back stronger than ever as I look to regain my spot at the top of the 140lb division." - The Independent

 

So, to put it simply, I'm not buying your reasons for him being so hated. I believe there is a bit more to it than that.

 

Also, it appears Froch has moved to clear up the situation where he supposedly said that Khan should retire;

 

Carl Froch is furious with suggestions he encouraged Amir Khan to retire following his brutal fourth-round stoppage at the hands of Danny Garcia on Saturday.

 

Froch was interviewed by Radio 5 Live the morning after his British compatriot suffered the third professional defeat of his career.

 

Several media outlets reported the three-time super-middleweight world champion, who won the IBF crown with a stunning fifth-round stoppage of Lucian Bute in May, said Khan should think about retirement following the loss.

 

But the 35-year-old is determined to set the record straight after Khan said Froch 'should keep his opinions to himself'.

 

'I did an interview on Radio Five and my quote was taken out of context on the BBC website on their news pages,' Froch told Boxing News.

 

'I didn't say "If I was Amir I'd retire", I said, "If it was me, I'd retire". I'm 35 years old, I'm three times world champion, if I'd have lost like that, I would have retired.

'I don't think Amir Khan should retire! That's ludicrous. Why would I tell a 25-year-old to retire?

 

'Now Amir Khan has read a false quote and come back and said something silly. But I don't hold that against Amir at all. He was just reacting to a misquote.'

 

Froch, who is set to defend his title in November, has no ill feeling towards Khan and hopes he can bounce back from the upset defeat.

 

'Good luck to the kid, I'm behind him every time he steps in the ring,' Froch added. 'He's a British fighter and he does British boxing proud.

 

'The more world champions we've got it's better for our sport, it's better for the attention around what we do, around what I do for a living. We need Amir Khan to win titles, we need positivity around the sport. We don't need negativity and we don't need bad press.'

[Miamivenis]

ANyone who thinks Garcia got "lucky" against Khan oviously know nothing and should go back and study that fight, the pre-fight media quotes and Garcia's past fights. Khan can learn, and fight him again and maybe win, but that was no stroke of luck, Garcia knew what he was going for and it worked a treat.

 

Also the Gomez thing, NO ONE would have called that guy world class, even if they lost to him.

Who on here is saying that? Who are you trying to have this lucky argument/debate with? People have said Khan was caught, which he was, but I can't see anyone saying it was a lucky shot.

 

People wading into threads with premeditated responses to comments they've seen on the bottom of articles and/or facebook and/or anywhere but this forum seems to happen a lot. Probably doesn't but seems to (and now that I've posted this it's almost guaranteed that someone on here has said something that I've missed).

 

Edit - yup, just seen David refer to Garcia getting lucky in that fight! Bloody typical. (though he doesn't refer to it as a lucky shot... anyone who says I'm clutching at straws is lying).

Edited July 19, 2012 by Miamivenis

[Egg Shen]

HeavyT just twists things to suit his argument. On the last page you quoted Khan, then when i questioned it you said you cant remeber exactly what he said. You can't claim to quote someone then make something up!

[jimufctna24]

I can understand why Khan rubs people up the wrong way, but my initial point in all of this was that to put him in the same category of arrogance as Hamed (which you didn't) is, as I said, at best lazy, at worst racist.

I can agree on that.

 

Naz had a much more open and flashy arrogance than Khan. It is one of the reasons I bloody loved Naz, he was a great showman.

 

The amount of buzz Khan and Garcia got from this fight, I think the rumored rematch may just happen after all. I am not sure he would win a rematch, Khan has a lot of holes to fill in his training and technique, he has more natural talent than Garcia and is a better boxer, but one shot and it may be curtains again.

[wandshogun09]

I'm not sure I buy the 'lucky punch' stuff to be fair. It's not like it was the 11th or 12th round with Khan battering him the whole time and then Garcia threw a Hail Mary and lucked out. Yeah Khan was winning the rounds but it was still early in the fight, a lot can change. Some guys are slow starters, some like to pace themselves.

 

Garcia would have known he wasn't likely to win the speed and combinations game with Khan and would likely be widely outlanded. So he'd have trained specifically on what openings Khan leaves and making sure he makes his shots count. It worked. Good for Garcia, it was his only real shot to win and he made it happen.

 

Really I've never believed in the lucky punch stuff in Boxing or MMA. You make your own luck in my opinion. If you trained to land that punch, you meant to land it, and it lands then where's the luck? It's a fight, it's not like Khan didn't know Garcia would be trying to punch him. He had the right to block or avoid it and he didn't. Garcia deserves full credit.

[David]

I'm not sure I buy the 'lucky punch' stuff to be fair.

It was lucky in regard to where it hit Khan, that's all. I really doubt he aimed for behind his ear to be honest. It was still a good punch though, and Garcia did what had to be done to win the fight, no doubt about that.

[wandshogun09]

It was lucky in regard to where it hit Khan, that's all. I really doubt he aimed for behind his ear to be honest. It was still a good punch though, and Garcia did what had to be done to win the fight, no doubt about that.

 

Fair enough, yeah it did land in the perfect spot. Well, the chin would've been better but that spot where the jaw meets the ear and neck is the next best thing. I got hit there once in sparring when I was about 16 and I was all over the shop for a good few minutes after.

 

Funnily enough though, last night I was listening to Bas Rutten's appearance on Joe Rogan's podcast from last year. And Bas was saying he used to always try to aim for that spot with his palm strikes in the Pancrase days. It is difficult to time that shot though so I guess there would be a bit of luck involved in that respect.

[Egg Shen]

Funnily enough, the boxing 'experts' i heard discussing the fights last week brought that up, i heard something along the lines of 'it didnt even hit him properly, it hit his neck, what a fucking pussy', haha

 

Anyone who watches enough combat sports knows that a shot there/behind the year can fuck with someone as much as anything.

[wandshogun09]

Haha yeah, if they got hit there they'd know. It's a weird feeling because in my case as I remember it, my head felt pretty clear but my legs were doing the Riverdance. So I can kind of see why Khan was saying he felt fine. It was a good stoppage though because he hadn't recovered and was clearly heading for a bad KO.

 

A good shot on the tip of the chin is obviously the sweet spot but getting a good whack on the temple or the neck/ear/jawline area like Khan did really fucks with your balance. Even if your chin is pretty solid there's no real answer for a shot like that.

[jimufctna24]

 

Amir on Ringside, you be the judge. I think he comes across well, he even says he should have not brawled after the knockdown and clinched instead, I agree with that.