General politics discussion thread

[David]

To state that it is all British (meaning White Working-Class British) people's fault that extremist Islamic groups have started is an absolute load of bollocks.

Whenever I've heard people refer to the problem being caused by "British people", I've always agreed simply because the root of the problem can almost always be traced back to wealthy, white British citizens.

 

The opposition to all immigration that you speak of was simply another instance of the working class population being too fucking stupid to see who was actually to blame. Instead of laying the blame on the immigrant who had come here in order to try and improve both his and his familys way of life, why not blame the owner of the business who sees fit to pay both British and immigrant worker a fucking pittance for a days work?

 

Nine times out of ten the owner of said business was a white, British male. The owners of these businesses must have been laughing all the way to the bank, becuase most of the time he had a situation that saw his British workforce blaming the immigrant workers for the decline in pay & conditions, and the immigrant workers responding to this hostile behaviour by segregating themselves in the workplace.

 

Not only had the business owner managed to save a small fortune on wages and the upkeep of working conditions, but the situation I mentioned above ensured that the immigrant workers would remain ignorant to any unionisation, which would have allowed the workforce, both British and otherwise, to join together and take the business owner to task.

 

We also have a situation today where one of the main causes of the racial tension we see in the UK is the wars in Iraq & Afghanistan. Who sanctioned these wars?

 

Wealthy, white British men in most cases.

 

Yet again, we have another situation where by and large the "white working class" are fed the bullshit about "wars on terror" and "Islamic fundamentalism" through our media, which they willingly buy into, giving them a reason to hate these nasty foreigners with their beards and bombs.

 

In turn, that kind of resentment brings about the extremist Islamic groups that you mention.

 

In short, white British people are to blame for the problem, but it's not the working class. They're only guilty of buying the bullshit that we get fed through the media.

[Yoghurt]

As long as they don't turn to Socialism, which they clearly aren't given how students have been attacking Socialist workers at their rallies then we aren't quite in the shitter yet.

 

Edit - Rightfully so. Every one in the hospital is a victory for democracy.

Edited February 7, 2011 by Yoghurt

[David]

Rightfully so. Every one in the hospital is a victory for democracy.

Such nonsense has never been spoken since George Bush said something similar about the Iraqi forces opposing US "help" in the early days of the war.

[Carbomb]

Oh, I missed that earlier point about "Britons". Not to argue it, but a disambiguation, because I'm not having anyone say that about me: I didn't mean "working-class white people", and it's both a stupid leap to make, and a blatant attempt to set up a straw man to say that.

 

Out. Final. Finally final.

Edited February 7, 2011 by Carbomb

[mikey]

I'm not a Labourite. I believe that, throughout the course of their entire existence, they've sold out the true left every step of the way. They've had chances to make things work, and chickened out at each one. I despise both Labour and the Conservatives.

 

Wholeheartedly agree.

[David]

As long as they don't turn to Socialism, which they clearly aren't given how students have been attacking Socialist workers at their rallies then we aren't quite in the shitter yet.

Just out of curiosity Yoggi, what exactly do you think Socialism is? How would you define it?

[Yoghurt]

Rightfully so. Every one in the hospital is a victory for democracy.

Such nonsense has never been spoken since George Bush said something similar about the Iraqi forces opposing US "help" in the early days of the war.

 

Wrong. But you're welcome to think however you want, it's a free country. Well hopefully not for your violent ilk.

[The King Of Swing]

As long as they don't turn to Socialism, which they clearly aren't given how students have been attacking Socialist workers at their rallies then we aren't quite in the shitter yet.

 

Edit - Rightfully so. Every one in the hospital is a victory for democracy.

[David]

As long as they don't turn to Socialism, which they clearly aren't given how students have been attacking Socialist workers at their rallies then we aren't quite in the shitter yet.

Just out of curiosity Yoggi, what exactly do you think Socialism is? How would you define it?

[David]

As long as they don't turn to Socialism, which they clearly aren't given how students have been attacking Socialist workers at their rallies then we aren't quite in the shitter yet.

Just out of curiosity Yoggi, what exactly do you think Socialism is? How would you define it?

[SpursRiot2012]

Enjoyed this from the Daily Mash:

 

Tories get 100% of funding from people who don't like socialism

09-02-11

 

THE Tories get all of their money from people who are not hellish keen on left-wing politics, it emerged today.

 

Research by the sinister sounding Bureau for Investigative Journalism revealed that in 2010 some people who suspected Gordon Brown was going to tax the shit out of them gave money to his opponent instead.

 

The figures have led to furious accusations that the Tory Party is now in thrall to people who believe in capitalism and free markets.

 

Shadow chancellor Ed Balls said: "This is a clear attempt by people who do not like socialism to try and stop it from happening.

 

"This is precisely why we need legislation to end the undue influence on our political system of people who do not want to pay huge amounts of tax and have their businesses run by the likes of me."

 

But the row has also led to renewed claims that Labour is being 100% funded by people who believe the government should own everything and that everyone should be exactly the same.

 

Mr Balls added: "But left wing people are nicer than right wing people. Even a child understands that."

 

Meanwhile, despite repeated warnings from experts, the Tory funding revelation has plunged Britain into its latest pathetic, undergraduate debate.

 

Across the country thousands of dreary morons pointed their fingers and used a series of grating cliches that makes you want to push them in front of a privatised train.

 

Helen Archer, some screechy fucking woman from North London, said: "Fat cats, same old Tories, scratching each others backs, social justice, won't extend my overdraft or let me remortgage so I can buy a new Golf."

 

But Tom Logan, professor of politics at Reading University said: "The thing about the Tory donors is that they think socialism is shit. And it is. Have you tried being Cuban? It's just awful.

 

"And anyway, I'm pretty sure Britain was asked to choose between bankers and trade unions last May and it chose bankers. At least those bastards know how to make money."

 

A Tory spokesman said: "It's true, we really like capitalism and free markets and so in that sense yes, we have been bought lock stock and barrel by the people who donate money to us.

 

"Will I have to go to prison now? I do hope so."

[David]

It appears that certain prisoners will be allowed to vote, much to the disgust of the Dail Mail i'm willing to bet;

 

Justice Secretary Ken Clarke has said the Government cannot "defy the law" and will have to allow at least some prisoners to vote in future.

 

It comes as the Commons' Political and Constitutional Reform Committee found the current blanket ban was "illegal under international law founded on the UK's treaty obligations".

 

MPs will debate the ban and the UK's position in Parliament on Thursday ahead of a vote on the issue.

 

"We have to fulfil our obligations but we are not going to give the vote to any more prisoners than was necessary to comply with the law," Mr Clarke told BBC Radio 4's Today. "What we can't do is just defy the law and pretend we are going to go wandering off."

 

Mr Clarke added: "The idea that we are going to give the vote to murderers and rapists and some of the more alarmist reports is complete nonsense.

 

"Of course, the most serious people can't possibly be given the vote - they should lose their civil rights. Probably the least serious ones will obviously get the vote and there will be a cut-off somewhere."

 

Meanwhile, the Archbishop of Canterbury has backed calls for prisoners to be given the right to vote. Dr Rowan Williams said prisoners' civic status should not be put in "cold storage" while they are behind bars and the UK needed to move beyond a "situation where the victimising of the prisoner by the denial of those basic civic issues is perpetuated".

 

The Government is currently proposing to allow the vote to all inmates serving less than four years, in response to a European Court of Human Rights ruling which could otherwise open up the floodgates to compensation claims totalling millions of pounds.

 

But the move - which Prime Minister David Cameron said made him feel "physically ill" - has been met by stiff opposition from some MPs, and there have been indications that the vote may be restricted to those serving a year or less.

 

Thursday's motion, tabled by Tory former shadow home secretary David Davis and Labour's former Justice Secretary Jack Straw, states that the decision on prisoners' votes should be one for democratically elected lawmakers and states that "no sentenced prisoner" should be granted the vote except those jailed for debt default or contempt of court.

Source: MSN.com

[Loki]

Here's something for you political warriors to get really angry about:

 

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/20...eist-of-century

 

It's complicated, but essentially Cameron is sneaking through a change to the taxation system that will allow large corporations (mainly the banks) to pay millions upon millions LESS in tax than they currently do by eliminating the need to pay corporation tax on overseas earnings. The only other country that does this is Switzerland.

 

So much for "we're all in this together"...

[mikey]

I'd have no problem with it if it applied to all so a small company could be based in England and not be taxed on overseas earnings. However, it's being able to claim against the expenses of running an overseas branch which rankles.

[Kenny McBride]

No. It's insane. It's plumbing the very depths of sucking the capitalist monster off for no reward other than the taste of its poisonous spunk settling in your stomach and the overwhelming sense of shame and self-loathing. Switzerland has stayed off the map in a lot of ways because it's always been neutral and independent and everything. Wee countries like the Cayman Islands get away with being tax havens because having banks and shell companies and whatnot based there is their only meaningful industry. A country like this starts becoming a tax haven and we start a race to the bottom. As the article notes, we're not just stealing money from ourselves, but damaging the tax base of every other country in the world. It's vile and insane in equal measure.