Official ROH Discussion Thread

[edgecrusher]

11/4 in Philadelphia back at the National Guard Armory will see a first time ever match. It will be a battle of two of the top athletes going today. Philadelphia will witness KENTA vs. Matt Sydal. Will KENTA go out with a win or can Sydal get that breakout victory? This promises to be athletic wrestling at its best. Wow that sounds unwhelming. Are we going to get KENTA vs Joe anytime or did I miss it?I'm quite excited by the brewing Joe vs Morishima fued though.

I guess the thinking is to put KENTA against ROH's own resident light heavyweight. Sydal's not big enough of a star to be worthy of this match, though. Seriously, who in their right mind is going to expect Sydey to have a chance? And who would be happy if he actually won?

[WU LYF 4 LYF]

I actually think Sydal/KENTA could be a pretty sweet match.

 

There isn't exactly a bundle of opponents for KENTA to face anyway, and Sydal can be real good when he's game.

 

I assume they're holding off KENTA/Joe for a while, maybe they'll start the build from this match.

 

Joe/Morishima supposedly isn't going to happen until the tail end of next year.

[Philjax]

Does anyone have any info on that AmDrag/Kamala ROH Title match that happened last weekend??? It seemed to slip under the radar after all the initial excitement.

[alexander]

Does anyone have any info on that AmDrag/Kamala ROH Title match that happened last weekend??? It seemed to slip under the radar after all the initial excitement.

Kamala won by DQ. They set up a dream partner tag match for the next show. This really happened.

[Philjax]

If Kamala picks Repo Man I'll mark like crazy. Have you seen any of the match or heard if it was good (as good as a Kamala match can be anyway)?

[WU LYF 4 LYF]

Finished watching ROH Death Before Dishonor IV.

 

Delirious v Seth Daley opened things up, and quite frankly, it wasn't very good. I've quickly tired of Delirious since his move up the card- he's gone from being an entertaining midcarder to an overpushed main eventer. And 'Seth Daley', who I've never even heard of before, didn't exactly set the pulse racing either. I can understand why it was the opener, since Delirious is really over, but it did nothing for me. *1/4

 

Jimmy Rave/Sal Rinauro v Colt Cabana/Jay Lethal was good. Although the announcement of Rinauro as the new Embassy member was a let down, he did well here, with some nice exchanges with everybody, including his own partner. A nice series of near falls capped it off- it didn't hurt that you had clearly defined faces and heels who were comfortable in their roles. Good stuff. **1/2

 

Nigel McGuinness v Roderick Strong was another good bout. Strong has become rather underrated recently, with people bemoaning his lack of charisma, among other things. But he does bring intensity and fire, and he worked well with Nigel here. Nigel is excellent in his heel act, and a few more of his nice touches lit this match up, eventually leading to the count out finish. I liked how they built it up, from relatively small offence at the start, to the Apron Backdrops and DDT's on the floor by the finish. As Pure Title matches go, this was really enjoyable. ***

 

Briscoes v Irish Airborne was a strange match. It lacked any sort of cohesion, but was kind of entertaining in its own way. Nobody seemed to have any idea about their role, and everytime they tried to start something, like the Briscoes grounding the high flyers, it quickly stopped. There were also some terrible moments near the start, where Irish Airborne would hit a 'holy shit' move like a German onto the knees, and then follow it up with a chin lock or a wrestling sequence. But for all that, they were innovative and exciting at times, and while you couldn't call it a good match, it was better than it could have been. *3/4

 

Styles v Richards didn't appeal to me at all. Don't get me wrong, there were some cool moments, but on the whole I thought it looked very average. It gets a higher mark than the last bout, but I enjoyed it a lot less. The selling was awful at times, and psychology was zero. **

 

Danielson v Dutt was another highly entertaining contest. The crowd were brilliant in it, and both guys, especially Dutt, added a lot to the match with their reactions to the chants and general character work. The wrestling wasn't the best you'll see in Dragon's reign, but they seemed to mesh it up nicely, and even when it got a bit boring, the crowd kept you in the match. ***

 

Cage Of Death was very good, but not the classic people are making it out to be. The first 10 minutes were absolutely superb, and indeed they looked on their way to a truly amazing match. But once Dragon and Joe went, a lot of the interest was taken away. I don't care about Whitmer, Pearce or Steele, so I couldn't get behind them, and therefore was less bothered about the match. It picked up again when Homicide came in, and in fact the last 10 minutes were filled with awesome, chaotic brawling. But the fact remains that Homicide shouldn't have been in the match, and certainly shouldn't have got the pinfall. If WWE had done something like that people would be screaming about how it went against the rules of the match anbd how ridiculous it was. It was stupid here, and did affect my enjoyment somewhat. But mostly this was good, tight brawling, with good character work and some insane bumps, which unfortunately some of which were not caught on camera. I'd have rather seen Super Dragon that Eddie Kingston, but it didn't really bother me that much. Very good, but I'll be suprised if it makes my top 20 matches of this year. It'll be lucky to get in my Top 10 ROH matches, judging by what's to come. ***1/2

 

This was a pretty consistent show, and had some highlights, without having a really terrible match. I can't see myself going back for anything but COD and Dutt/Dragon, but a solid all round show, and one of the best ROH has put on this year.

 

One thing that does annoy me with all ROH shows though, is how the matches are getting too similar, and how everyone seems to have the same moveset. The Lariat, for example, is used as a nearfall in just about all matches. Similarly with other matches, the same moves crop up 6 or 7 times in a show. Yes, large movesets are generally good, but not if it means everyone is doing the same stuff.

 

Plus, you have minor matches with people kicking out of finishers, and people doing all these high impact moves. All it does is make me less bothered about the stuff when I see it in the main event, it doesn't make me like the Briscoes more because they do High Impact Move #6 2 minutes into their match. It just lessens the impact when Danielson tries to use it as a nearfall later on the card. Thgere should be a hierachy, and people should have different movesets and stick to them- not totally rigidly, but enough so that we don't have to see the same move 20 times.

[gadge]

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October 12th: We have a very surprising announcement. LAX will merge with The Rottweilers on 11/4 in Philadelphia as Homicide is bringing Konnan to ROH. The odds are against Homicide as the man in power, ROH Commissioner Jim Cornette, has been trying to make life hell for Homicide as he heads to his 12/23 World Title shot in Manhattan. Now the leader of the LAX revolution is coming to even the odds. This won't be like Konnan in 2002, this will be a militant powerhouse in Philadelphia. What will happen with Cornette and Konnan in the same building without the limitations of television? Get your tickets now at 215-781-2500 and www.ROHwrestling.com. For info on the bus trip from NYC to support Homicide email Agentclpt@aol.com. Homicide will have Konnan in Philadelphia to make sure everything goes down fair in the Fight Without Honor vs. Steve Corino.

 

[RCD]

If they keep him from wrestling (Wel a few punches when people run is fine) & only on the mic it'll be great. would be better if Hernandez was coming too tbh.

[The Mighty LC]

So I just got done watching Weekend of Champions Night Two...and I'm angry. The finish in the Bryan Danielson v Nigel McGuiness match just grates with me. Not the actual finish (though I somewhat saw the countout coming, I thought it was okay in itself) but the fans reaction to it. See, in general I don't think ROH fans are as bad as some make out. At the end of the day, they're respectful of good wrestling, and what I think is good wrestling and what they think is good wrestling is generally similar. Don't get me wrong, they overuse the chant that dare not be named as much as TNA/1PW fans (in this particular event, during a Chris Daniels v Matt Sydal match - considering the participents involved I thought it was painfully average, not even more than probably **1/4), but they're not quite as bad as people say. Until this event.When you see a world title changing hands, or an event of some significance and then get gipped out of it...DON'T FUCKING CLAP THE BOOKING YOU FUCKING NERDS. Seriously, this is what happened. They weren't booing because their man had just been screwed out of the world title (as was McGuiness) nor cheering because their man kept his belt (in the case of Danielson) but they were clapping because they were like "oh, yes, that's a good bit of booking". Just renders the whole thing frigging meaningless. They could at least pretend like it's not, you know, pretend.Really wasn't a big fan of this event, and they telegraphed a screwjob ending in this match by having it go on before the tag title match (which I thought was pretty good, but shouldn't have been last on)...

[edgecrusher]

I never notice this kind of stuff. I guess I just watch the shows and don't bother too much with the crowd reactions unless they're especially noticeable. I seem to remember 'bullshit' chants with that ending?Isn't it more likely that they were clapping the effort of both men? Can you really prove they were clapping the booking?

[gadge]

That finish at Weekend of Champions night 2 was totally worth it, their later matches, especially the Liverpool one, are great. I've seen through to Time To Man Up on DVD now, though I havent reviewed anything since Throwdown. I also watched some matches from the Liverpool DVD and they are easily as good as they were live - Rchards vs Rave is better in fact.

[MoChatra]

I've got In Ya Face through to Anarchy in the UK to watch. That's ten events! I have a feeling my top ten matches of 2006 list will be very ROH-heavy once I'm done watching them.

[WU LYF 4 LYF]

Yeah, my MOTY list will likely be ROH heavy as well, but I haven't seen hardly any Puro at all this year, no TNA, and only some WWE, while catching nearly every ROH event.

 

I find it funny that on the website they're promoting Matt Sydal v Delirious as the 'next huge ROH feud'.

 

Anyway, watched ROH War Of The Wire II.

 

Jimmy Jacobs v Trik Davis was a really fun opener, as is anything with Jacoba in these days. I'd don't think I've ever seen Davis before, but he was serviceable at least, and Jacobs put in another great performance. Good match with some neat touches. **1/2

 

Davey Richards/Jerrelle Clark v The Embassy was decent enough. Just standad tag action really, but the Embassy are good at putting together this sort of thing, and Richards is usually pretty impressive. Clark was kind of just there. **1/4

 

McGuinness/Cabana was good while it lasted, and I'm glad they went with the finish they did. I was fearing a long, boring encounter from them, and was pleasently suprised by the finish, and found the reaction of the ROH fans once again hilarious. **1/2

 

Daniels/Sydal was actually enjoyable. I think Sydal is great, and he put in another god erfrmance, mixing his athletic stuff with great selling and timing. Daniels on the other hand, just gave in his standard displa-he didn't add anything different, maybe show disrespect or anything like that, he just did the same old ballet rubbish. But still, I liked this. For the sake of your sanity, skip the 5 minutes after match stuff. **

 

Danielson/Homicide/Aries/Delirious was once again solid. The fact that Delirious was in it was enough to make me hate it actually. The guy has become awful- I don't buy him one bit going against ROH's top talent, his gimmick is funny for a while in the undercard, but is exposed as repetetive and stupid when he moved to the main event. Seriously, this guy should be wrestling Ebessan in comedy matches. The action was nothing to write home about, but they didn't do much wrong either. **

 

Briscoes Strong/Evans was once again fairly good. I dig some things about the Briscoes right now; their good FIP sections, their gimmick, their double shoulder block. But they still suffer from the old problems, and even probably the best team in ROH history in Evans + Strong couldn't get them away from that. As with a lot of ROH stuff, it's really too long, but I've seen a lot worse, and, what's more, there were actually moments where the match seemed really good. Just not enough of them. **1/4

 

Whitmer/Necro was really good, in a brutal kind of way. They came up with some innovative spots involving the wire, there was some great bumping and it gave a sense of finality to the ROH/CZW feud. On the other hand, it could have been a lot better. the wrong man went over- Whitmer has improved slightly, but the last thing I want to see is him beating the awesome Necro in his own match. Plus, Whitmer's performance is nowhere near as god as Necro's- he's hitting forearms instead of punched, blatantly if understandably blocking weapon shots, and is completely outshined by Butcher the entire way through. With someone better than Whitmer, this could have been excellent- as it was, it was merely good. ***

 

Strange, strange ROH show. One of the best all rounded shows the've had all year. There was nothing on the card that was actively bad, and in fact most of it was pretty good. At the same time. there was nothing really that good, and I doubt I'll be revisiting any of the matches anytime soon, as they weren't really memorable. Still, I reccomend the show.

[The Mighty LC]

Isn't it more likely that they were clapping the effort of both men? Can you really prove they were clapping the booking?

Nah, there was just something about it. Sure, certainly some will have been showing their appreciation, but...hard to explain really, but that was what it came over like to me...

[gadge]

Yeah, my MOTY list will likely be ROH heavy as well, but I haven't seen hardly any Puro at all this year, no TNA, and only some WWE, while catching nearly every ROH event.I find it funny that on the website they're promoting Matt Sydal v Delirious as the 'next huge ROH feud'.Anyway, watched ROH War Of The Wire II.Jimmy Jacobs v Trik Davis was a really fun opener, as is anything with Jacoba in these days. I'd don't think I've ever seen Davis before, but he was serviceable at least, and Jacobs put in another great performance. Good match with some neat touches. **1/2Davey Richards/Jerrelle Clark v The Embassy was decent enough. Just standad tag action really, but the Embassy are good at putting together this sort of thing, and Richards is usually pretty impressive. Clark was kind of just there. **1/4McGuinness/Cabana was good while it lasted, and I'm glad they went with the finish they did. I was fearing a long, boring encounter from them, and was pleasently suprised by the finish, and found the reaction of the ROH fans once again hilarious. **1/2Daniels/Sydal was actually enjoyable. I think Sydal is great, and he put in another god erfrmance, mixing his athletic stuff with great selling and timing. Daniels on the other hand, just gave in his standard displa-he didn't add anything different, maybe show disrespect or anything like that, he just did the same old ballet rubbish. But still, I liked this. For the sake of your sanity, skip the 5 minutes after match stuff. **Danielson/Homicide/Aries/Delirious was once again solid. The fact that Delirious was in it was enough to make me hate it actually. The guy has become awful- I don't buy him one bit going against ROH's top talent, his gimmick is funny for a while in the undercard, but is exposed as repetetive and stupid when he moved to the main event. Seriously, this guy should be wrestling Ebessan in comedy matches. The action was nothing to write home about, but they didn't do much wrong either. **Briscoes Strong/Evans was once again fairly good. I dig some things about the Briscoes right now; their good FIP sections, their gimmick, their double shoulder block. But they still suffer from the old problems, and even probably the best team in ROH history in Evans + Strong couldn't get them away from that. As with a lot of ROH stuff, it's really too long, but I've seen a lot worse, and, what's more, there were actually moments where the match seemed really good. Just not enough of them. **1/4Whitmer/Necro was really good, in a brutal kind of way. They came up with some innovative spots involving the wire, there was some great bumping and it gave a sense of finality to the ROH/CZW feud. On the other hand, it could have been a lot better. the wrong man went over- Whitmer has improved slightly, but the last thing I want to see is him beating the awesome Necro in his own match. Plus, Whitmer's performance is nowhere near as god as Necro's- he's hitting forearms instead of punched, blatantly if understandably blocking weapon shots, and is completely outshined by Butcher the entire way through. With someone better than Whitmer, this could have been excellent- as it was, it was merely good. ***Strange, strange ROH show. One of the best all rounded shows the've had all year. There was nothing on the card that was actively bad, and in fact most of it was pretty good. At the same time. there was nothing really that good, and I doubt I'll be revisiting any of the matches anytime soon, as they weren't really memorable. Still, I reccomend the show.

Jacobs vs Davis is joint second best match of the show according to those ratings. Meanwhile the Four Corner Survival is joint worst. Is that really your opinion? Good review, snowflakes aside, as they just make no sense to me.