andrew "the ref" coyne

1 hour ago, Hannibal Scorch said:

Don’t know how many times this has to be debunked but they had stated many times over the years on BTE how they’d love to have Kansas as their entrance music. That’s just reading into nothing. You’ve also neglected all the jibes Punk has done on socials and promos before and after. 

Source: The Elite.

33 minutes ago, David said:

In fairness, none of the Elite have even glanced in Punk's direction since he came back. Not a whisper, not a comment. Absolutely nothing to set him off. The same can't be said in the other direction.

Yeah but before that...

Mocking the botch clothesline. Using his finisher. Biting an opponent. Coming out to a theme song that was a thinly veiled shot at the man. Vague tweets. Victory laps etc

Honestly none of this excuses Punk AT ALL. But The Elite are fucking children. Who knows what they were like out of the public eye. 

Then are no good guys here. Only dickheads.

37 minutes ago, BomberPat said:

Just in general I think CM Punk's approach to relationships is very transactional - Samoa Joe hinted at it in a cryptic Tweet after All In about people commodifying friendship. Every symbol of friendship you see from Punk is transactional -

Strangely ive begun to really notice this in the Aus wrestling scene. I've made a genuine effort to be supportive, encouraging and maintain genuine friendships.

But the minute you are not useful to someone people dissappear. It's been a genuine heart breaking realization this last year.

So it's not limited to Punk, I think it's sadly part and parcel of the modern wrestling scene.

8 hours ago, Supremo said:

The way that opening statement was scripted, and the way Tony delivered it like a hostage, I’m almost certain phrases like, “scared for my life,” were specifically chosen by lawyers for specific reasons I’m not clever enough to understand. Same with the way he kept saying, “…with cause.”

Not that there would be anything wrong with him actually fearing for his life, but everything in both the press release and the on-air statement felt like a gang of lawyers determining the exact thing to say to protect themselves from the inevitable lawsuits. They’re not fucking about here. This wasn’t, “Punk screwed Punk.”

I guess we’ll have to wait and see if CM Punk’s legal team use an animatronic T-Rex as Exhibit A in their case against him. “Look at his tiny arms! He couldn’t even choke Luke Perry’s kid!”

On the various court tv shows I watch, I notice people trying to shoe horn in "scared for my life / safety" as it effectively a key method to get a exemption from contract terms. Often cases tend to fail or succeed on if they can successfully argue this point.

Like, yeah you have a contract, but if your legitimately threatening someone's well being, then it's acceptable to break a contract / lease. 

Honestly though I don't even think it was necessary if what's come out is true. If he assaulted someone without being physically provoked, that should be enough. Add in him "lunging at his boss", and if filmed, you've got more than enough to fire a guy.

13 hours ago, LaGoosh said:

Couldn't agree more. Joe is the best, cooler than cool, can do everything and feud with everyone and it feels like a big deal. Joe vs Kingston would be an incredible feud that could easily carry a couple of months of TV.

This is why it annoys me when people think Collision is dead without Punk. If you look at the roster, there are loads of people who (due to lack of tv) arnt exposed or utilised enough.

The amount of top line matches we've not even seen yet are incredibly numerous. 

Not sure why but I want to see Jay White vs Samoa Joe with Joe as babyface.

Edit: Fuck it. Make it the Samoa Joe show. Then when your ready send him to dynamite to challenge whomever the champ is.

1 hour ago, Matthew said:

They explained it on tv, but I, along with those around me, also missed the he reference. Apparently it’s like an “extreme” version of Penta or something.

It's his version of Mankind turning into Cactus Jack, but it's poorly executed even for a reg like me.

10 hours ago, Big'Olympic_Hero'Pete said:

I would have kind of liked Omega and the Bucks to do a promo in the ring and saying 'Hey Punk, get out here' then do a whole 'we've all been idiots about everything, but look around us as to what we've built and are building. Shake hands with us, let bygones be bygones and let's be the best damn wrestling company in the business!' If Punk refused, he'd get massive heat, if he shook hands then there'd have been a huge roar and a big reset. 

They should have Hangman do that. The irony of him doing this whilst Punk had been kicked out of the building would of been fantastic.

On 8/21/2023 at 4:33 AM, Merzbow said:

 

Ah it's my mates Eeman Azman and Carlo Cannon. Frikkin great Australian based wrestlers (though this match is in Malaysia). 

21 hours ago, Daddymagic said:

Gauntley & Edler the team up you never knew you needed. 
 

Edler has also bought all the 1PW video library according to an ex 1PW director. 

Wait, dosent Gauntley have a history of "selling" 1PW and it's assets... then later acting he still owns it when he relaunched?

Mjf vs Cole aside, so much of this seems so rushed and disorganized. Gonna be a hell of a show live, but if this was in any other arena, the ppv would be a B plus quality at best.

12 minutes ago, Hannibal Scorch said:

We have a main event guys

 

If this ends with Adam Cole turning on MJF with help from Strong, O'Reilly and Fish, what a bloody emotional journey it will be. 

Give this man the International Championship.

3 hours ago, RedRooster said:

Tony Khan is weirdly indecisive when it comes to elevating wrestlers. He’ll often go part-way there, and then not fully commit. He’s squandered so many wrestlers who could easily be knocking on the door of the main event scene - Rush, Daniel Garcia, Penta, Fenix, Hobbs, Miro, Ethan Page, Big Bill, Lance Archer, Swerve and Bandido to name a few. I’m not saying these wrestlers are unsalvageable, just that the Khan has missed more than a few opportunities.

Totally agree. I think Kahns eyes are too big for his stomach, as hell get in all this tremendous talent, then realize he dosent have enough resource to focus on all them.

Starks was in some ways a victim of having a great build but destined to fall to MJF. What next? 

On 7/19/2023 at 9:19 PM, Supremo said:

If you wanted to argue against LA Knight you could say there’s still every chance he ends up being the modern day Ken Kennedy. Being able to cut promos with a similar confidence, cadence and delivery as The Rock is always going to get you over to a certain degree, but what if that’s all you have? For example, can anyone name their favourite LA Knight match?

Fuck that racket though. Something no-one admits in pro-wrestling - particularly those who find success in it - is how a solid 75% of making it is a self-fulfilling prophecy. Most of those you give a fair chance to, with a proper push, get over. Most of those who you decide can’t make it, so give them a half-arsed push before grinding them down and burying them, don’t make it.

You decide Triple H is going to be a big star, so push him as such even when he’s shitting the bed throughout 1999, and eventually he makes it. You decide Rey Mysterio isn’t believable as Heavyweight Champion, so have him lose to everyone, then pat yourself on the back for being right all along when he bombs.

A good promoter should avoid all biases and give anything that’s clicking a fair shake regardless. And listening to the reactions LA Knight is already getting, when the most famous thing he’s ever done is lose to Bray Wyatt in the laser tag arena? I’d strap a fucking rocket to the man. Whether it ultimately works or not, imagine if his music hits when Roman Reigns is celebrating on the Smackdown after Summerslam? They’d have to measure it on the Richter scale.

Spot on. I've seen something similar in my marketing career. 

If someone has been hired by a manager, that manager will bend over backwards to ensure they succeed even if they are / were spotty previously.

Meanwhile if they inherent someone, they can subconscious bury that person regardless of actual ability and "I was right about them all along."

Self-fulfilling. Someone said "can you name a good LA Knight match... well no... because he hasn't been giving a match of any true significance or build.

1 hour ago, RedRooster said:

Oh I’m not disputing that - but I don’t think the top-10 best sellers are a good way to measure whether people care or not. I’d totally forgotten about Jaime Hayter until you made that post, and I’m kind of amazed at that. I also forgot about Serena Deeb, Taya Valkyrie, Layla Hirsch and even Tay Melo, who can have a solid match with the right opponent. The women’s roster in AEW has an embarrassment of riches these days. 

You asked for a measurements and I showed you merch sales and YouTube numbers. If merch sales isn't a measurement of popularity then what is?

Of course it is. Your just burying your head in the sand now. 

Now to follow up many are saying "well if they were presented as equal they'd be bigger draws."

Absolutely. Don't necessarily disagree with you, you COULD be right.

But its a gamble, and when its the alternative to shoving on a Chris Jericho vs Kormander match which is near enough a guarantee to attract more eye balls, that a tough decision to make when you have to appease stakeholders.

I don't want it to be the case, and we can argue "woulda shoulda coulda" all day, but historically women typically don't draw as well, regardless of the reasons and it's a shit reality.

Okay so here's your next stat; YouTube views.

The lowest YT views from battle of the belts 7 is Storm vs Valkyrie.

The lowest viewed match from Collision is Nightinggale vs Riot.

The lowest viewed match on Rampage is Athena vs Nightinggale.

The 2nd lowest viewed match on Dynamite is Soho vs Blue (lowest was the opening men's tag).

Previous weeks Collisions lowest viewed match was Julia Harts match.

Previous Rampage lowest was Hikaru Shida.

Previous Dynamite 2nd lowest viewed match was Baker vs Soho (lowest was trios match Acclaimed vs House of Black).

To answer Red Roosters multiple points... if I didn't have a three year old I could spend age pulling stuff up. 

But according to Wrestlenomics the top merch sellers in 2023 for AEW are as follows:

Overall for 2023:
1. The Acclaimed
2. The Elite
3. AEW generic
4. MJF
5. Danhausen & FTR
6. The Briscoes
7. Kenny Omega
8. Hangman Adam Page
9. Blackpool Combat Club
10. Sting

Wwe are similar in that most positions are male.dominated, but Rhea Ripley and Bianaca Belairs are in the top 10 (credit to wwe for that).

Was going to try and find more but my evening just got busy. Follow Wrestlenomics, they come up with tidbits like this all the time.

Credit to Kahn, at least he's pushing the women more visibly on the ROH show. Athena is having a great run as ROH Women's Champion.

Sadly as much as we may want, and it be righteous, for women to get even representation on these shows, the sad reality is that the larger fanbase do not get behind it as much as the male wrestlers. 

I also believe the more divisions you have the harder it's got to be to juggle all your long term programs. So even if you wanted to split it evenly 50/50, the reality is that it will impact the build for the other fueds.

It's a horrible no win situation.

22 hours ago, The King of Old School said:

Shotzi shaving her hair to no reaction at all was pretty funny.

Apparently the real world reason she shaved her head was because her sister is going through cancer treatment. So good on her.

Without that context... she came across as being a massively overreacting 13 year old whose rebelling over the injustice she can't have smiley potato faces at lunchtime, whilst playing Saw background music over the top of it. 

"I'm a little weird". Yep... just like every teenager I've met trying to figure themselves out.

So bad execution... might of been better if there had actually been sustained bullying from Bailey over several weeks, leading to her having her whole head shaved off by the heel faction.

6 hours ago, WyattSheepMask said:

Hasn’t that always been the point of them? Not meaning that as a dig at you, but I thought was always the case

Thay was my thought too. Hence "eliminator".

Mind you I'm sure you could still get title shots via other means. Rumble wins for example.

24 minutes ago, d-d-d-dAz said:

They have zero idea what to do with him. He’s more over than they want.

Man... all they have to do is steadily feed him low to mid card heels then pull the trigger on winning the US belt.

Got a real old school Attitude Era vibe from that. Love it.

3 hours ago, Hannibal Scorch said:

What about Frobidden Door? Most matches had very little in the way of feuds, certainly not weeks or months of build up.

Credit to AEW, but I felt they did a good job creating matches with relevance and stories to them.

MJF vs Tanahashi: Was really an extension of the Adam Cole storyline. Sad that Cole wasn't available to wrestle Lawlor which would of tied the whole thing together nicely.

International Title Match: They've established a relationship between him and Shibata, and to a extent, Sabre. Honestly the story here is more the "how long can Cassidy keep this up".

The Elite vs Blackpool Combat Club 10 man: Huge fued going into this. Plus with added Eddie Kingston who is fueding with Castagnoli).

Toni Storm vs Willow: A continuation of the Outcasts vs the rest of the women storyline.

Will Ospreay vs Omega: No explanation needed.

Sting / Darby / Naito vs Le Sezuki Sex Gods: A reasonable effort was made to build up tentions with Allin/Guevara and Sting/Jericho.


But yeah Im actually in agreement. With two big show mere weeks apart, you could easily make All In a show with dream matches and matches that feed into All Out.

Man, if they really wanted to feed the fires of social media, Pokemon Red / Blue thing and release a CM Punk version and a Kenny Omega version, and just watch it all burn to the ground.

Not sure if anyone noticed, but one tiny thing I loved on the Bloodline segment, is as Roman is walking backstage, he walks past and snears at the new world championship belt.

That belt is going to drive him crazy.