Michael_3165

18 hours ago, TimmyB said:

Does anyone know of anyone accused having any charges pressed against them?

I'd be surprised. Its near impossible to get a conviction on a s/he said basis. 

Haven't watched aew in a long time. Do the buckas always act this goofy?

1 hour ago, jazzygeofferz said:

NXT Japan not working out, eh? 

Are they concerned about how Nagata was on Dynamite the other week, and Kojima will be at Against All Odds for Impact Wrestling in a few weeks. FinJuice's run as Impact tag champions?

What would it mean for their US title if this happened? Would they have to strip Moxley of it, or try and pull Moxley off of AEW TV? 

I doubt it's going to happen as I can't imagine anybody at New Japan would see something like this as a good idea. 

I doubt they would be worried about Nagata et al showing up. Nobody knows them, barring a niche audience in the UK. 

Whilst any injury is sad, I do believe that his reckless style has contributed to this. Its hardly surprising given all the stupid head bumps etc that he has taken over the years. Tone it the fuck down!

2 hours ago, Hoptimus said:

I really am so upset and frustrated with the business about this and looking like not much of a care has happened.

 

It's almost like the promotions look at and see someone so talented with a bright future. They have been identified as a future big name in the industry. Already a lot of hard work and effort has gone in to invest in this individual time in training, outfit, character development, graphic work, gym time including supplements (at good financial cost).

 

Let's brush it under the carpet that they were an abuser and that they have mentally damaged the victims. Let's not give the victims closure and not have the guilty parties held to account. 

There is zero accountability and there is no precedent set that someone loses that privilege of being a public figure and no longer has part of any events anywhere. They lose everything that comes from it. The name value the celebrity status. The money earned. They lose it all.

It would take us too long to spend that time and effort plus more money to invest in someone else who is totally innocent and not been involved in such acts.

The wrestling business sucks. Morally bankrupt business. 

It's shit isn't it. I don't believe, however, that wrestling is any different to any other industry, especially entertainment. These professions seem to be a magnet for sleazy people especially Hollywood. That said, I was sexuall harassed whilst working in the NHS and was told to be quiet, not make a fuss etc. It was gently hinted my career and rep would be adversely affected. It's rife everywhere it seems. 

Take some comfort that the likes of Joey Ryan has been driven from wrestling. Though it'll always be profit over people. 

59 minutes ago, SuperBacon said:

These days?

That's been the aim since Vince took over the company. Its nothing new.

The would be crazy not to want mainstream audiences surely? It's about making money and getting as many eyeballs as possible. 

Two Qs 

I am considering watching aew and wonder what the key 'good' parts are? Gimmicks, stories etc. 

Also why was the war games cage match on free TV? Is this normal? 

16 minutes ago, wordsfromlee said:

I thought it was quite obvious they were going to go on the roof as there were a loads of solid panels instead of mesh ones for them to walk around on. 
 

These days, with big cell matches, audiences have been conditioned with what to expect . It’s now like Chekhov’s Gun. You can’t climb onto the roof and not have someone jump or be thrown off. Nerds would go mental online that they teased a spot like that but never went through with it. 

Surely the answer there is don't climb on the roof? 

6 hours ago, Jimmyjokerz said:

I can’t get over how yellow Shawn michaels teeth are on the dudes with attitude untold 

Doesn't he chew tobacco? 

1 hour ago, John Matrix said:

I realise this is in poor taste and will gladly take any deserved flack as a result, but after seeing this photo of Lex Luger yesterday I couldn't bring myself to agree with Missy and recognise what a significant feat this is, as I was far too distracted by the fact that Lex Luger appears to have morphed into Bradley Walsh.

 

Poor lex looks about 1000 years old. He is only 62. Terrible to see but by all accounts sounds happier now than ever. On the other hand Hyatt looks like a wax work in some museum. 

5 hours ago, BomberPat said:

Suzuki has done more outright comedy and silliness than anyone mentioned in this thread.

Oh don't tell me that! I'll avoid that. I love Suzuki in all his badass-ness 

@ChrisB

Whilst I agree that there has always been an element of nonsense in wrestling I feel that it has massively overwhelmed the current product to the point of ridiculousness. 

I'll take your points in turn: 

This is one of the few where you have a point. I hated it then and I hate it now. That said, Undertaker took 8 MONTHS off from the angle, rather than a month or so. Also he generally kept up the gimmick in and outside the ring.

Undertaker versus Undertaker wasn't ridiculous though the match was fuckin horrible. An imposter trying to make money and take the stardom from the Undertaker was a reasonable storyline if not a little far fetched. They never said they were both the Undertaker, that one was an imposter and the match was there to prove which was the genuine one. 

Not sure your point re: Goldust and Warrior - I didn't like it particularly but it was treated as a feud and not "wink wink, nudge nudge". Though homophobic Warrior was the shits in it. 

You could JUST about suspend disbelief with Shane and Kane, it wasn't cinematic or nonsensical, even though a tad goofy.

You cite WCW, a company that went out of business is hardly a model to hold up of what is successful in wrestling. 

My point is not that things weren't half as hokey back in the day and that there was a certain conviction that the company and the wrestlers had in doing it. Barring the WCW nonsense (hey, they folded for many reasons) and the Undertaker's resurrection, most other moments were at least treated seriously and/or with a degree of realism if not totally do-able in real life . I also don't even mind goofy gimmicks, as long as they are trying to be and look like actual wrestlers and taking it seriously. All of Wyatt's nonsense relies on a whole team of people backstage to get it off the ground (stunt suits for fire angles, audio/visual for that bloody projector thing one WM etc). Orton pinned by Bliss? WTF was that? One of the times I can really cite as being demonstrably ridiculous was Kane in 1997, with the whole fireworks exploding from his hands etc. 

The viewership tends to give credence to the fact wrestling is at its lowest point in history. I am well aware that my nostalgia clouds my judgment and I probably would have felt the same in 1994 if I were my age then. Thing is, I don't believe in the characters anymore. Bret Hart looked like a serious wrestler. Austin looked like a badass and acted the part even up until today where he still has an aura of believability. Vader looked like a fuckin beast. The only person I would feel remotely intimidated by in 2021 is Brock Lesnar, Samoa Joe and maybe Reigns. Even Strowman (who is a fuckin giant and should be intimidating) doesn't hold much in that sense. Thankfully NJPW still have people who look badass and take things seriously - I wouldn't fuck with Suzuki, the history is generally respected and they don't do anything outright nonsensical. 

You may have a point that wrestling has always been goofy and had stupid shit happen in it and my becoming an adult has exposed it to me in a more "in your face" kind of way. All I want is wrestling to be serious, a struggle and a contest by good guys and bad guys who hate each other's guts. I want the bad guy to get the advantage and the good guy to eventually win out and there be a feel good moment (even if it takes a year). I don't see why that is so difficult for companies to grasp and book. And I also acknowledge that my nostalgia demands are unlikely to be the norm or draw what they would have done 30 years ago. 

On 4/22/2021 at 7:23 PM, DavidB6937 said:

Honestly? I still bloody love it really. Might not be the cool answer but I genuinely do enjoy it a lot. I still have that emotional attachment to a lot of WWE while AEW has been a real joy that I wasn't expecting to hit the heights that it has sometimes. Throw in the different companies like NJPW that I'll watch more just for my fix of wanky workrate stuff and yeah there's still plenty of good quality content out there. And I'll watch the older shows for a nostalgia kick too from time to time.

I think it'll always be one of my favourite things simply because it's always evolving yet stays the same at the heart of it all. I'd be very surprised if every company out there managed to put me off completely.

Genuine question here... 

How do you find the stupid stuff like mysterio losing an eye or the fiend returning after being burnt alive? I can't look past that. 

He was one of my guilty pleasures. A rather shit worker but so funny and you could tell he really was trying so hard to do well. Bless him, getting that disease is horrific. 

That is amazing! I real throw-back. 

On a side note, Scott Steiner looks almost the same as he did 20 years ago! At least facially. For a guy that was juiced up to the gills I am surprised Eddie Guerrero died before Scott. I can only imagine what steroids have done to his heart etc. 

I'm sure there is a thread here with this but for some reason searching doesn't work for me so apologies in advance...

I just had a massive rant in the "wrestling is fake" thread (good thread BTW) and wanted to get people's thoughts on what keeps them interested/watching the current product (be it WWE, NJPW, AEW, ROH, IMPACT etc)? 

Over the years I have fallen out of love with the one passion I had for my entire childhood and teenage years. I continue to watch some NJPW because it is at least presented as a sporting type contest and the booking at least has a degree of logic (even though Gedo seems to have lost a step re: long-term booking) and I greatly admire the level of ability most of the roster has to put on quality matches (G1 being the key must watch for me). I occasionally dip into AEW and WWE/NXT if I am bored and there is a specific match that sounds okay but I cannot tolerate the mental booking decisions and/or lack of struggle to the point that I can only watch standalone events or matches where I don't have to pull my hair out in frustration.

I can't quite let go of my childhood obsession, possibly because of that fuzzy, warm feeling it brings me to watch Hogan, Austin, Michaels, Rock, Undertaker et al as I did all those years ago. Funnily, when they wheel out the old guys I have less interest than at any other time; leave my memories alone! 

When it's good it is fuckin brilliant! That is what keeps me mildly interested. Through all the shit there can be a match or an event that makes me remember why I love(d) wrestling and going to shows is untouchable in terms of the energy and emotion that comes from the crowd. That's why I stay in this coercive relationship with wrestling! 

So what keeps you watching or being interested? 

I started watching in 1996 when Michaels was at his peak and he begun his feud with Sid. 

I immediately assumed it was at least partially fixed when it came to me that the mechanics/physics of Irish whips, chokeslams and various other moves defied any sort of logic. Why didn't the guy being grabbed by the neck pull away or drop to the floor? Why would someone run into ropes, turn, run back and get hit when he could just stop running? The fact that guys the size of Undertaker or Vader could punch you in the face for 15 minutes and there never be a single bruise was somewhat odd and the fact that nobody ever put their hands up to protect their heads from chair shots in 1997 felt ludicrous. 

I always felt that the likes of Bret Hart and Austin were legitimate bad-asses who could really hurt you if they wanted and that they had a genuine hate for each other (I was 11 ish at the time) and Austin's feud with Vince, Bret's with Michaels and Undertaker versus Mankind always made me question whether they actually did hate each other. Then we moved to brawl for all; guys wearing padded gloves knocking each other out in a minute when every other week they can go for ten or fifteen minutes taking huge moves. That was the decider for me; the whole thing was a huge fraud. Not that I minded, at that point I cared about the characters. There was mystique around the Undertaker, Austin was someone who you wouldn't mess with, you wanted to go for a beer with the Rock or DX and that was enough for me. 

Interestingly, that was probably the most realistic time period of my wrestling viewing; it has gone down hill since then with the likes of Meltzer Drivers, multiple kick outs of moves, sledgehammer shots, people being set on fire, celebrities wrestling like they are pros and the vast amount of twitter kayfabe-destroying pictures of guys relaxing together on tour whilst hating each other in the ring. If I were to be a 10 year old in 2020/1 I would have no interest whatsoever because the whole thing SCREAMS fake. In fact they don't even pretend that it is real or even a struggle and as such I would have no interest in who hates who. I think the key thing that would put me off in 2021 is the fact every fucker is so grateful and "happy" to be there. Women wrestlers bursting into tears after every milestone, videos saying how proud and happy they (men) are happy to be part of the big event... I cannot comprehend Austin, Rock, Hogan or Michaels ever gushing about how proud they are that they have been "given the opportunity" to main event Wrestle-Mania. 

My family tolerated my obsessive fandom though would always say "its all crap", "its put on/fake" and that they are "friends in real life" and this stopped me talking about wrestling to them or anyone else at length. It was only in 2000/1 when my school had a boom period of watching wrestling (culminating in a bunch of us going to watch WM17 at a mates house) that I felt it socially acceptable to mention wrestling in "real" life. 

Apologies for my usual cynical rant. I have come to the conclusion that wrestling simply isn't for me anymore and whilst I take interest in what is happening (hence lurking/posting here) I cannot even bring myself to describe wrestling in the US as wrestling any longer. It's a performance, a show, a spectacle but there is no pretence that it is real and for me that is such a kicker cos it is not the product I grew up adoring. I will have to stick to NJPW (which at least has a sense of sportsmanship and legitimacy, even though they gave the IWGP title to the current holder) and watching old tapes/shows for my nostalgia kick. 

1 minute ago, Shy Dad said:

For no real reason not so much. The arcade anarchy match was the blow off to Best Friends breaking Kips arcade machine when him and Miro were doing their streamer gimmick and it worked. 

Multi man's you could argue yes, but I think a lot of them are working in the way Japan does of having your main guys on screen and protected from not taking the pinfall or themselves getting the win on someone less established, and not battering their body up as much.

Unlike Darby, who appears to be going through an absolute war each week at the moment. Either that guy feels no pain or enjoys it.

I really worry about that guy. Firstly the drop makes no sense (why would you do it, not seeing if your opponent is in place or not) but also he does so much stuff for a guy as thin as he is and the long-term impact is likely going to be horrific for his joints (if Dynamite Kid was in a wheelchair this guy almost certainly will have some mobility issues when he turned 60). 

3 hours ago, RedRooster said:

Babyface Jericho is almost certainly going to be the shits if he leans into his sense of humour. The early days of his podcast were impossible to tolerate thanks to "jokes" on the level of "My Jerkoff Friend" and whatever the fuck that song was.  

I hated this show. For me, it summed up how ridiculous AEW is right now. Every match or segment featured a faction or someone who is in a faction outside of the Women's Title bout and Miro's promo. Enough, already. Stop trying to cram everyone on to every card and either cut the dead weight, or loan some of your wrestlers out to the NWA and/or Impact to allow them to develop. 

I can accept QT Marshall - barely - as Ogogo's coach, but when you have so much talent on your roster, why is he getting the push that he's getting? Is there anyone out there outside of AEW who thinks this is a better use of TV time than the Penta/Cody feud they originally hinted at?

Pac, Fenix, The Dark Order, The Acclaimed, Nyla Rose, Paul Wight, Leyla Hirsch, Riho, SCU and Serena Deeb are among the talent who do not have direct feuds right now (you could add Jungle Boy to that list, even though he had a match this week) - they have all of these people waiting for something to do, while QT fucking Marshall is about to wrestle one of AEW's biggest name wrestlers? It's mind-blowing. 

Are they still doing multi-mans and hardcore/gimmick matches a lot for no real reason? I vaguely remember that many shows had no-DQ or other gimmicks involved but I haven't watched in a long time because I didn't "get" it. The tag matches that had absolutely no selling or rules just turned me off which is sad because I love tag wrestling more than singles. 

Can someone explain what the fascination is with Darby? I have seen his stuff and some of it looks okay though he looks paper thin and I just can't get over the fact he looks like the average person on the street could beat him with little effort. I am not knocking his in ring work (though he has to stop that Coffin Drop, he is setting himself up for so many neck problems in the future, he is hardly Mick Foley in terms of padding) and maybe I am too old to "get" the gimmick. 

EDIT: Ignore that. Someone posted above me explaining. Not sure I get it but some people will and tha'ts also fine

What's the betting Alex Shane will turn up in a suit somewhere around this?

1 hour ago, Hannibal Scorch said:

Yeah I’m not saying there’s no merit it what you’re saying. I guess the point I’m making is that Bowen being gay, but it not being played as part of his character is better for both being inclusionary and inspirational to an LGBTQ+ audience then someone creating a character to generate heat based on their sexuality. 10 years ago Bowens would have either had to have hidden his sexuality or it would have been used as an ott character, which shows evolution.

I mean, look how the Sonia Deville story went down and that was only 2019!

I watch some moments in wrestling over the years and certainly cringe. 

Jerry Lawler asking if Goldust was "queer" springs to mind as does a very uncomfortable show when Tracey Smothers (a face on that show) getting the audience (which had many young kids) to change "faggot" to the heels. 

It has certainly improved over the years though the idea that gay = bad/heel is something that still holds some weight especially in certain communities/areas of the world. 

Finally a openly gay wrestler that isn't portrayed as effeminate prancer. As a gay man I find the way wrestling has historically presented gay character as disgusting and whilst I appreciate the likes of Sonny Kiss being who they are I also find that it just feeds straight into that stereotype that gay men are queens which is bullshit. 

I have a somewhat turbulent relationship with the gay community at times and feel that we often don't do ourselves any favours, Orlando Jordan being a really good example. I want characters that are real, genuine male athletes that just so happen to be gay or bisexual rather than the character being gay in nature. 

I am not one to buy into bullshit theories that we should all use our race, gender, sexuality, religion etc as they key features of our being. I am a person who happens to be gay but being gay doesn't define me. That's what I look for in wrestling in 2021. 

That said, when I was training at a wrestling school the idea of coming out was a HUGE taboo for me. The overtones of "ah thats gay" was a common theme and whilst I have no doubt that they would have been fine with it, it doesn't make it any less daunting. Funnily someone came out and were really well supported. 

On 4/10/2021 at 9:51 PM, SkinnersHat said:

The Mounties could definitely ride on some of the political division & difference in opinion about law enforcement in the States at the moment.

Umaga in the 80s is a great shout, kind of on a similar note would Yoko have been even more over in Hogans mid late 80s heyday, I think that could have been phenomenal.

Bam Bam’s unique look & unreal ability for a man of his size would fit right in at anytime. I could see him being an enforcer for a whole host of factions. Imagining him & Bossman as a corporation tag team has got me thinking if only.

Speaking of law enforcement. I'd find a big boss an gimmick an interesting prospect in 2021, esp if he went full heel and praised recent events w police in the US. Unsurprisingly I doubt it'd go down well with sponsors or networks though. Onr thing I miss about the attitude era... Vince didn't give a fuck. Though I'm not sure that wouldnt be cheap heat, it would certainly resemble Slaughter circa 90-91. 

I do believe using hot news items to bering characters to life isn't a bad idea. Though it's potentially polarising and contentious. I'd watch just to see what shit happens next. 

On 4/14/2021 at 9:33 PM, ThommoLincs said:

The FlatLiner Chris Mann has had a what I would say is an allegation that he shit on a disabled fans car.

 

I say I would say it's an allegation, however the dumb fuck admitted it live on Instagram and someone recorded it.

That'll ruin the paintwork

3 hours ago, JNLister said:

Does he need to spell it out to you?

I don't see the issue w it. It's not a surprise that the majority have an advantage.