RMC420 Posted March 11, 2004 Share Posted March 11, 2004 But discussing what can/should be done to solve the problem of the exclusive 5 year deal being bad for British wrestling does warrant further discussion.Where should the "other" promotions go from here? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest bodybag11 Posted March 11, 2004 Share Posted March 11, 2004 Something important that all the armchair "experts" on here seem to have missed...TWC may be "free" to watch but it will survive on ADVERTISING!As somebody who has made a living selling ADVERTISING I can tell you for a fact that if you were to load British Wrestling on the TWC you would have a very hard job selling the Ad time! It looks cheap, has a lousy reputation and next to no USP. The FWA has worked hard and Invested heavily to get to the level to get on TV.Far too many people think that just because a promoter runs a few shows in Britian he should automaticly get a shot at being on TV.Let me ask you this...If you write a Sitcom do you instantly think it should be made and shown on the BBC because it deserves a chance to be seen?Buisness is about hard choices and MAKING MONEY. And newsflash Wrestling is a BUISNESS! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Dave Pick Posted March 11, 2004 Share Posted March 11, 2004 Something important that all the armchair "experts" on here seem to have missed...TWC may be "free" to watch but it will survive on ADVERTISING!As somebody who has made a living selling ADVERTISING I can tell you for a fact that if you were to load British Wrestling on the TWC you would have a very hard job selling the Ad time! It looks cheap, has a lousy reputation and next to no USP. The FWA has worked hard and Invested heavily to get to the level to get on TV.Far too many people think that just because a promoter runs a few shows in Britian he should automaticly get a shot at being on TV.Let me ask you this...If you write a Sitcom do you instantly think it should be made and shown on the BBC because it deserves a chance to be seen?Buisness is about hard choices and MAKING MONEY. And newsflash Wrestling is a BUISNESS! Oh yes, and when Addidas want an advertisement on the channel they'll look straight at an FWA show and be all "Oooooo...they have smoke machines! Lets get advertising time during that!"You've also missed the point! Nobody is questioning the fact that other promotions are not ready for the channel YET. But they are going to be forced to wait 5 years now, until they are. This means, if a rival British fed were to draw 150 000 people and have the worlds biggest dream card showcase with hollywood movie style production values, but is filmed and produced in Britain, it cannot be shown on TWC for another 5 years. And just imagine the amount of people who would want to advertise during THAT! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel Edler Posted March 11, 2004 Share Posted March 11, 2004 Oh yes, and when Addidas want an advertisement on the channel they'll look straight at an FWA show and be all "Oooooo...they have smoke machines! Lets get advertising time during that!"You've also missed the point! Nobody is questioning the fact that other promotions are not ready for the channel YET. But they are going to be forced to wait 5 years now, until they are. This means, if a rival British fed were to draw 150 000 people and have the worlds biggest dream card showcase with hollywood movie style production values, but is filmed and produced in Britain, it cannot be shown on TWC for another 5 years. And just imagine the amount of people who would want to advertise during THAT! And there, people, is a great summary explaining precisely people's problems with this.So, that should stop the stupid "yeah but FWA is on tv now thats more than the past wen der woz none! wykkkd!" posts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest bodybag11 Posted March 11, 2004 Share Posted March 11, 2004 Dave, mate..come on if such an event were to take place other channels would get a deal to screen it in a heart beat! Why does all British Wrestling have to get on TWC? Oh and which other groups wrestlers have bosted appearances in FHM, This Morning and MTV?Trust me when you sell advertising these things matter..as for the 5 year deal..Buisness is full of such deals. Do you think when Beckham signed to promote Pepsi everybody complained that it was unfair on Coke drinkers?!Or perhaps you think it's unfair that Henry only plays for Arsenal and not Brentford too?Look at it this way The FWA spend loads of money and time getting their production up and are protecting their interests. I mean at the moment their Talent is free to work for any promotion they want! Like wise talent form elsewhere is FREE to get booked by the FWA. Oh and call me Cynical but how many times do multi year deals end up in the bin anyway?! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ClassicsGuy Posted March 11, 2004 Share Posted March 11, 2004 Oh yes, and when Addidas want an advertisement on the channel they'll look straight at an FWA show and be all "Oooooo...they have smoke machines! Lets get advertising time during that!"You've also missed the point! Nobody is questioning the fact that other promotions are not ready for the channel YET. But they are going to be forced to wait 5 years now, until they are. This means, if a rival British fed were to draw 150 000 people and have the worlds biggest dream card showcase with hollywood movie style production values, but is filmed and produced in Britain, it cannot be shown on TWC for another 5 years. And just imagine the amount of people who would want to advertise during THAT!And there, people, is a great summary explaining precisely people's problems with this.So, that should stop the stupid "yeah but FWA is on tv now thats more than the past wen der woz none! wykkkd!" posts. The other promotions have had 16 years to get their shit together.FWA did it in, what, a couple of years? They worked for it, they deserve it.Brock Lesnar signed a 7 year deal six months ago. Shit happens. The supposed five year deal may not be written in stone.And anyway - a five year deal is bad because ON THE OFF CHANCE of another company being ready for tv inside that time, then they will not be able to get on tv?So lets stop the world for something that MAY happen inside the next 2 years (but hasn't happened in the past 16 years). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikey Freedom Posted March 11, 2004 Share Posted March 11, 2004 The other promotions have had 16 years to get their shit together. What promotions would they be? All-Star? Premier? Anyone else who has been around that long ago? The vast majority of promotions have had the same amount or in most cases even less time than the FWA. No one is questioning that the FWA has come a long way in what is essentially a short period of time. 5 years ago, how many promotions were running regularly..4?5? If this deal had happened then, there would have been very little if any complaints. Now that there are a good 10-15 promotions running regularly in different parts of the country, and all have their own, growing fanbases, the deal smacks of the FWA running scared of any potential competition. Far too many people think that just because a promoter runs a few shows in Britain he should automaticly get a shot at being on TV.At least that should have the option open to them in the future. Something to aim for. This deal effectively shuts that until 2009. I just hope this works out in the end, because if the bottom falls out, the FWA might go down with it, and I don't want to see any promotions go down. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest bodybag11 Posted March 11, 2004 Share Posted March 11, 2004 The other promotions have had 16 years to get their shit together.What promotions would they be? All-Star? Premier? Anyone else who has been around that long ago? The vast majority of promotions have had the same amount or in most cases even less time than the FWA. No one is questioning that the FWA has come a long way in what is essentially a short period of time. 5 years ago, how many promotions were running regularly..4?5? If this deal had happened then, there would have been very little if any complaints. Now that there are a good 10-15 promotions running regularly in different parts of the country, and all have their own, growing fanbases, the deal smacks of the FWA running scared of any potential competition. Far too many people think that just because a promoter runs a few shows in Britain he should automaticly get a shot at being on TV.At least that should have the option open to them in the future. Something to aim for. This deal effectively shuts that until 2009. I just hope this works out in the end, because if the bottom falls out, the FWA might go down with it, and I don't want to see any promotions go down. I again ask this question..Why do you think that British Wrestling has to ONLY be on TWC? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobbins Posted March 11, 2004 Share Posted March 11, 2004 (edited) Oh yes, and when Addidas want an advertisement on the channel they'll look straight at an FWA show and be all "Oooooo...they have smoke machines! Lets get advertising time during that!"You've also missed the point! Nobody is questioning the fact that other promotions are not ready for the channel YET. But they are going to be forced to wait 5 years now, until they are. This means, if a rival British fed were to draw 150 000 people and have the worlds biggest dream card showcase with hollywood movie style production values, but is filmed and produced in Britain, it cannot be shown on TWC for another 5 years. And just imagine the amount of people who would want to advertise during THAT!And there, people, is a great summary explaining precisely people's problems with this.So, that should stop the stupid "yeah but FWA is on tv now thats more than the past wen der woz none! wykkkd!" posts. The other promotions have had 16 years to get their shit together.FWA did it in, what, a couple of years? They worked for it, they deserve it.Brock Lesnar signed a 7 year deal six months ago. Shit happens. The supposed five year deal may not be written in stone.And anyway - a five year deal is bad because ON THE OFF CHANCE of another company being ready for tv inside that time, then they will not be able to get on tv?So lets stop the world for something that MAY happen inside the next 2 years (but hasn't happened in the past 16 years). Then what is the fucking need for the exclusivity deal? For fucks sake, what is the world coming to when Dave Pick is the voice of reason. The other promotions have had 16 years to get their shit together.FWA did it in, what, a couple of years? They worked for it, they deserve it.Jesus motherfucking Christ, you have got to be shitting me.If you're talking about the show on TWC, there hasn't been a dedicated Wrestling Channel for the last 16 years. If you're talking about the show on Bravo. 1. It wasn't promoted by FWA. 2. It was a fucking huge failure in terms of securing a spot on TV for British Wrestling.Am I going to have to put this in big bold red letters?READ THE THREAD.What Lister said is ALL I have ever said.I've read it. Maybe you should go back and read your own posts because you seem to have forgotten that you come across in this thread as an FWA fanboy who thinks that the only other wrestling companies in this country are K-Star, All-Star and TWA.The main reason for this becoming a 17-page thread of bullshit is because you took a contrary stance to this:No other promotions being on the Wrestling Channel for at least five years is bad for wrestling in Britain.Seriously, that is the only complaint that anyone has with this deal. If you agreed with that statement (as you claim to do now) then you shouldn't have argued against it for the last 17 pages and wasted everyone's time.Maybe if you had read the press release on Page 1, then you wouldn't have had to backtrack on Page 6 and say that something smells fishy about the five-year deal, after spending the last five pages arguing that there was nothing fishy about it at all. And then spent pages 13 onwards making an ass of yourself because you hadn't bothered reading pages 6-13.I find it highly amusing that the guy bringing up all the "Maybe if you'd read....*rolls eyes like a condescending prick that reads too many Crimson Mask posts*" stuff didn't even bother to read the press release on Page 1 that he spent the next 17 pages arguing about.We're all delighted that FWA is on the channel. All of us. But some of us have a problem because we don't see the need for FWA to eliminate all of their competition. How fucking hard is that to grasp? You seem to completely forget that this is not a weekly slot on a major channel. Anyone who thinks that people will be tuning in at the regular time every week just to watch FWA is out of their minds. FWA will just blend in with everything else.Edit: Unnecessary personal dig removed. Edited March 11, 2004 by bobbins Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikey Freedom Posted March 11, 2004 Share Posted March 11, 2004 (edited) I again ask this question..Why do you think that British Wrestling has to ONLY be on TWC?Because there is no one else, unfortunately...everyone can attempt to make cases for it, but it isn't going to happen. Every time a channel has tried to promote wrestling, it has failed or at least hasn't helped the channel in anyway. Channel 5 are the only ones who got anywhere with wrestling, pulling in 6-800,000 a show with Worldwide, but nothing since although there has been ample opportunity to pick up something. Bravo...tried it once, again has had ample opportunity to continue with it...nada. Extreme Sports....if TWC don't outshine the viewership for it without any british wrestling, no need to worry, it'll be out of business long before the 5 years comes up. Overload.... . ITV? The Transatlantic Challenge...and then nothing. Who knows, might be able to squeeze some wrestling back in between the 10:20 and 10:30 sex shows on Live TV again. Listen I don't want to be cynical over this, but it's getting hard not to be. Here's a question that might be up your street bodybag. Why would a channel take wrestling on....because they are trying to pull in viewers no? A british wrestling show, even the FWA's will bring in maybe 10,000 viewers(and that's an overestimate on my part IMO). What channel is going to take that on, with such a small viewership gain? That why any opportunity to have an outlet like TWC is like winning the lottery to promotions. Maybe not to screen events, but at least to advertise them. So far through this deal, up and coming promotions will have no avenue to screen events for 5 years, even if Vince Mcmahon gave an interview saying their shows were the dogs bollocks. And advertising wise, there seems to be little avenue either.Lister hit it on the head...FWA on TWC...good....no other promotions on TWC for 5 years....bad. Who knows, I could be totally wrong. Wrestling fans might come out of the woodwork and TWC might take off spectacularly to the point where it picks up 100,000 viewers for their top shows, then other channels might start taking an interest in wrestling again. But I don't see it happening not just now anyway. Edited March 11, 2004 by Mikey Freedom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members MoChatra Posted March 11, 2004 Paid Members Share Posted March 11, 2004 Here's something nobody has considered. Maybe the FWA has secured the exclusivity clause NOT to lock out other British promotions already trying to make somethings of themselves like WZW and ICW. It could be that the clause was put in place to counter the possiblity of someone coming along with huge financial backing that might try to sign away most of the FWA roster and take up residence on TWC, with the FWA having nothing to counter such predatory actions.Don't forget a similar situation occured four years ago, when UCW came along and signed many of the FWA's top stars to exclusive contracts. There's no reason why something similar wouldn't happen again.For all this talk of no other promotion being allowed onto the channel for the next five years and arguments about production values, I think the real reasons for the clause are probably aligned to the issue I've just outlined. When you look at it that way, you really can't blame the FWA. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Dino Crocetti Posted March 11, 2004 Share Posted March 11, 2004 FWA has been boring for quite a while now, be interesting to see how they perform on the wrestling channel with a tv show, as their old tv shows on portsmouth cable tv that I saw were very amateur with some of the worst acting and promos ever.This may be a controversial opinion but I think british wrestling is a bygone product. Don't get me wrong I enjoy the fwa shows on the odd occasion that i've been to them, but they'll never be mainstream for the british public. Wrestling had its "time" in the 70's etc when on ITV, but I don't think people will buy into now like they did back then, as 95% of british public think it's a joke and always refer to big daddy and haystacks all the time. I'm sure that FWA won't draw anymore people to their shows than they do already. Most things have a shelf life and a time and a place, british wrestling was big in the 70's, but then again so were the bay city rollers and you dont see them on tv or top of the charts anymore do you?I'm over. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest bodybag11 Posted March 11, 2004 Share Posted March 11, 2004 Mo has expanded on the point I was making early that perhaps the 5 year clause is as much about protecting the FWA from others "as stopping others coming in". After all any buisness want to protect it's assets. And Mikey I happen to know of no less than 3 occasions in the past where Wrestling has come close to coming back on TV..The main reason isn't numbers of viewers as numbers themselves aren't just the issue..one thing going in Wrestlings favour is that it's audience is incredibly LOYAL. Thus once the casuals come and go you can get around 80% of the same fans tunning in week after week..Advertisers love the idea of a stable audience and Male 16-34 year old are even better. The reasons Wrestling hasn't got on any other Channel to date is down to 3 things..1.MONEY2.PRODUCTION QUALITY/ISSUES Including levels of violence(thanks Channel4!)3.MARKETINGSort them out and you will see Wrestling back on several channels..after all more channels means more airtime...oh and I happen to know one other Channel negotiating with a Promotion as we speak.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ClassicsGuy Posted March 11, 2004 Share Posted March 11, 2004 Oh yes, and when Addidas want an advertisement on the channel they'll look straight at an FWA show and be all "Oooooo...they have smoke machines! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest overbooked Posted March 11, 2004 Share Posted March 11, 2004 WELL NAME ALL THESE OTHER BRITISH PROMOTIONS THEN THAT YOU THINK ARE SO GOOD!AND THEN HIGHLIGHT THE ONES IN RED THAT YOU THINK ARE READY FOR TV RIGHT NOW. FWA are ready right now. They pushed for exclusivity. Yes this is bad. AS I STATED ON PAGE 6 OF THIS THREAD, QUOTE ABOVE.Are you missing the point on purpose, or what? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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