fleischmark Posted March 10, 2004 Share Posted March 10, 2004 I took my mate to an FWA show he said 'meh'I showed my mate FWA, he said 'This is boring, can we turn it off'I took him to see WAW, he said 'That was well good! Whens the next event with them?'So, yeh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Dave Pick Posted March 10, 2004 Share Posted March 10, 2004 The point people are missing is, fair enough if certain promotions aren't ready for TWC yet - but why does FWA have to have a 5 year deal in the contract?Herbie has already said WZW and whatever other promotions aren't ready and denied them BEFORE the contract was signed. If that contract hadn't been signed, and WZW started producing higher level productions in the next 6 months, then Herbie could've changed his mind and put it on the channel - British wrestling wouldn't lose anything as another quality program comes onto the station. But now that it has been signed, this can't happen for another five years.In the end of the day, if the contract didn't have this clause in it...it would make no odds currently as no other promotion are ready for the channel yet. But within a year I'll guarentee several promotions will be ready for TV (GPW allegedly already are as they use Sumners too) and when the footage reaches Herbie, there'll be nothing he can do about it because of this clause. Without it, it's not like a promoter would hold a gun to Herbie's head and shout very loudly "SHOW MY FOOTAGE YOU BASTARD!". It would simply be down to Herbie to say either;"Yes, you're promotion is ready for my channel, we will air it on so and so days, here is the financial information blah blah blah"."No, you're promotion is not ready for my channel. We are sorry we cannot air the footage, but onc you raise your production standards to a standard I am happy with, by all means, please send me another videoproving this."Now, that's all out the window as every answer for the next five years is a big resounding "No". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hong Kong Dave Posted March 10, 2004 Share Posted March 10, 2004 Kenny made a valid point re TWC - they deserve at least as much grief as the FWA are getting in this thread if not more so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fleischmark Posted March 10, 2004 Share Posted March 10, 2004 Kenny made a valid point re TWC - they deserve at least as much grief as the FWA are getting in this thread if not more so. Dissing FWA is far more fun Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gwailofilms Posted March 10, 2004 Share Posted March 10, 2004 So, I'm the only one who reads the statement as "We've signed with The Wrestling Channel for five years and we're proud to say that we're the only promotion in the UK that meets their broadcasting standards"?Oh, carry on then... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Dave Pick Posted March 10, 2004 Share Posted March 10, 2004 So, I'm the only one who reads the statement as "We've signed with The Wrestling Channel for five years and we're proud to say that we're the only promotion in the UK that meets their broadcasting standards"?Oh, carry on then... I think we're all reading theThe Frontier Wrestling Alliance is proud to announce that on March 4 th 2004, a five-year contract was signed to make the FWA the sole and exclusive UK promotion on the new Wrestling Channel.Part. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fleischmark Posted March 10, 2004 Share Posted March 10, 2004 So, I'm the only one who reads the statement as "We've signed with The Wrestling Channel for five years and we're proud to say that we're the only promotion in the UK that meets their broadcasting standards"?Oh, carry on then... The Frontier Wrestling Alliance is proud to announce that on March 4 th 2004, a five-year contract was signed to make the FWA the sole and exclusive UK promotion on the new Wrestling Channel.*Carries on* Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest overbooked Posted March 10, 2004 Share Posted March 10, 2004 Thing is though - the stuff on those previews were much darker than the same footage on the videos. This might be something to do with how it was broadcast, or something. Not the FWA's fault, per se.Well, its not a problem any other show has had on the previews, and even without the lighting problems the FWA production values are not that great. And to say any promotion needs to have values as good as that is a joke when there are US indy shows that look like poo too on TWC.And nobody's answered my original thing - if all these other groups are so good, to the extent that they deserve TV deals too, how come British Wrestling's still in the shitter?You can't simplify things like that. The reasons for British wrestling being in the shitter are manifold, from losing TV in the 80s, the Big Daddy effect (big men in leotards image, no heels with heat left 'cos he's squashed them all), the WWEification of wrestling, all factors above and beyond any dodgy booking in the past ten years.Its not like if every promotion let off fireworks, had a shiny ramp, a couple of US indy guys booked and a three camera set-up that British wrestling would suddenly be super-over again.Pick makes the main point. What happens when another company is ready? And...is the FWA really ready?Competition is healthy, I don't think this deal is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kenny McBride Posted March 10, 2004 Share Posted March 10, 2004 British Wrestling's been all crap attendance-wise for the last ten years. For half of that, the FWA wasn't even in existence. Nevertheless, the reason it's been rubbish isn't because of tributes and false advertising, it's because the FWA's been brainwashing people and denying them TV deals. Gotcha.Yeah, but that time when the FWA didn't exist was a down time for the business globally. And even so, people like Jason Harrison were able to draw big crowds to Walthamstow, while crowds in Croydon and Bristol were still pretty strong. The only difference is that the FWA looked to ECW and the internet for inspiration and fans, while Dixon and his ilk looked towards the WWF and Joint. Dixon's (and others') more consistent business suggests that his way may well be more effective, and while I agree that tributes, false/misleading advertising and poor quality shows do a great disservice to the industry, it's not like anyone in this game can get too sniffy about shady business tactics.Like I said anyway, my problem is with TWC's shortsightedness, not with the FWA's attempts to strengthen their position as the most thoroughly branded company in the country. Ultimately, that's the only way they're going to get the quantum leap if growth that they've been looking for all this time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kenny McBride Posted March 10, 2004 Share Posted March 10, 2004 (edited) Can I just add that Moj is wrong about me, and I hope he gets cancer?I don't actually hope he gets cancer. I just need half my statement to be false, so I can retract it later. Edited March 10, 2004 by Kenny McBride Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobbins Posted March 10, 2004 Share Posted March 10, 2004 The point people are missing is, fair enough if certain promotions aren't ready for TWC yet - but why does FWA have to have a 5 year deal in the contract?Herbie has already said WZW and whatever other promotions aren't ready and denied them BEFORE the contract was signed. If that contract hadn't been signed, and WZW started producing higher level productions in the next 6 months, then Herbie could've changed his mind and put it on the channel - British wrestling wouldn't lose anything as another quality program comes onto the station. But now that it has been signed, this can't happen for another five years.In the end of the day, if the contract didn't have this clause in it...it would make no odds currently as no other promotion are ready for the channel yet. But within a year I'll guarentee several promotions will be ready for TV (GPW allegedly already are as they use Sumners too) and when the footage reaches Herbie, there'll be nothing he can do about it because of this clause. Without it, it's not like a promoter would hold a gun to Herbie's head and shout very loudly "SHOW MY FOOTAGE YOU BASTARD!". It would simply be down to Herbie to say either;"Yes, you're promotion is ready for my channel, we will air it on so and so days, here is the financial information blah blah blah"."No, you're promotion is not ready for my channel. We are sorry we cannot air the footage, but onc you raise your production standards to a standard I am happy with, by all means, please send me another videoproving this."Now, that's all out the window as every answer for the next five years is a big resounding "No". What happened to Pick? That was a great post. Ok, Bobbins. What promotions in this country promote a product that could get shown on TV, and not be an embarrassment? The closest I've seen is FCW, and their main event was a total abortion which would make casual fans go 'Fuck this' and switch off. UCW have had good shows, but when they're bad, they really go all out to beat Heroes of Wrestling in the crappiness stakes. Hammerlock had their chance a few years ago. All Star we all know about, plus Dixon said he didn't want to do it. RBW draw about sixty people. One of the Scottish feds has Drew McDonald and is therefore out. The only promotion I can really think of is WAW, to be honest, but that's based on one show in Cheltenham which had no production values to speak of, but it's probably different in Norwich.I couldn't agree more. Can you explain the need for this five-year exclusivity clause then? 'Cause it really escapes me. And don't say it's to save Brit-wres from embarrassment, 'cause that's as bad as the naive ROH fanboyism that's going on at the moment.This whole thing reminds me of the thing in the Life of Brian where the bloke from the Judean People's Front wants the right to give birth, or something.Fuckoff! It's the People's Front of Judea. 'Judean People's Front', bunch of splitters.The thing is they end up agreeing that he should have the right to give birth even though he can't. So really you're proving my point with your analogy. The difference being that at some point in the next 5 years a British wrestling company might grow a uterus, but Alex Shane will be the only person allowed to have a baby, so what's the point in anybody else cultivating somewhere for the foetus to gestate. And Alex is so busy denying anyone else a right to give birth that he can't even get his own fallopian tubes in order. Or something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wrestle-zone Posted March 10, 2004 Share Posted March 10, 2004 My Main worries, after a night of serious reflection on this deal is as follows:1.. A 5 year deal is very brave, I mean the channel has not launched and the FWA have so far not promoted more than a few shows a year. Let alone weekly shows and big PPV style shows. Booking shows is a hard job to do and I know how hard booking a monthly show with storylines is, i could not imagine how hard booking and producing a weekly show would be. 2.. If the FWA are going to be the "Regulator" on what British wrestling Promotion gets on the channel. What happens if you fall out with the FWA? Does this mean promoters have to kiss arse in a big way? What happens if say I don't want my production to look like the FWA's and I want a more gitty CZW/ECW look, rather than a TNA look?3.. Lets say in 12 months time I have a product that I feel is ready for TV, lets say the constant investment in my company brings us over what is required and our shows are actually better than whats on offer (all speculation), we have 4 years to wait for a chance to get on the channel with our own produced shows. Surely this would not be good for anyone least of all the channel and well to be honest if other TV companies like what they see they would also be hosting wrestling and would be going up against the channel...4.. The unsigned shows I am led to believe will involve people from other promotions, like giving them a chance to be on a FWA show. Is the way to try out new wrestlers and basically take them away from thier respective promotion? As a promoter this is the bigest question that worries me.5.. wZw are not ready at the moment for TV, but we will be in 12months time. I will make damb sure of it, if I have to import talent and mix it with the best we have to offer, then thats the route to take. I run a company thats invested a lot of money into our shows production. Not TV side but sheer fan/live show production. Investing in a production company will be our goal over the next twelve months. The FWA stuck a business deal, its a massive one. Time will tell if the FWA/TWC will work out. A monopoly in wrestling to me is not the answer, but its not my channel or promotion. I only hope that if other promotions do work with the FWA then they actually make something out of this and are not exploited and blinkered by the sight of being on TV. After all even the smallest of promotions are in this to make money and earn a living, TV deals are not given away free of charge, people do get paid money to be on TV as they do to be on crowd only shows. The wrestling channel will be purchasing these shows from advertising revenue afterall. Personally I cant wait to the launch and I will actually get to watch some wrestling, might even help me in some future booking prospects from the US/Japan. The time to stop bitching about the deal has come and well lets get behind them and see what develops. You never know it might actually be good. I hope so, I have a lot of my life invested in this business I love....Gary Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sean Posted March 10, 2004 Share Posted March 10, 2004 I will quickly give my opinon. From what i have seen FWA is the only show ready for t.v right now. Although whats to say in 6 months to a year another 1 or 2 will not be ready. I think its bad to make an exclusive deal, but on the other hand at least we all have a wrestling channel to argue over Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pyrotechnik Posted March 10, 2004 Share Posted March 10, 2004 (GPW allegedly already are as they use Sumners too) Actually after seeing the quality of production Sumners produced the FWA poached Sumners from GPW. GPW do have a new production company however that can easily replicate and surpass the standards Sumners produced, the "hold the line" tour last week was a test run of the company's capabilities and was deemed a sucess.Shame, cos most of you wont be able to see it for 5 years now.In short I gotta ask one thing, classics guy. How much is shane paying you to kiss his ass on here so much, your missing the entire point of most people's anger and talk like you have been to every wrestling promotion and seen every event because unless you have the comments you are making are based on your opinion, so stop bringing them across as facts.Personally, this is a time where the rest of the uk scene are gonna have to dig in, work together and come up with interpromotional shows that share talent and production values to come up with shows of such a high standard FWA will look like a 2 bit production company. Wont happen sadly, would be nice though.Oh and when is Shane making his big announcement? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
$tew Posted March 10, 2004 Share Posted March 10, 2004 I cannot see how any of this makes TWC bods or the FWA evil people.I don't think it does, and although others have pretty much suggested that, I don't think I've ever said it.Let's get this straight.Firstly, FWA have no duty to help the other British companies, other than a moral one - and this business is relatively moral free anyway, so no point in quibbling that. They are quite within their rights to negotiate for (and get) this deal. Good for them.Secondly, as far as I know, TWC have never once claimed to be the saviour of British wrestling, nor have they even given a hint at any time that they would be showing any British footage other than FWA. They're perfectly entitled to enter into this deal too.What annoyed me - and others, apparently - is the apparent length of the deal signed.I never expected any other Brit promotions on TWC. Certainly not at the launch anyway... but as Linus said, in five years, FWA went from non existance to becoming this "big" promotion with national TV. Imagine what might happen in the next five years to any other company...?You've got Gary Graham from WZW saying how he will look at this as a challenge to get his production values up to FWA levels. That's an admirable way to look at it, but the terms stated in that original press release clearly state that even if he does reach or exceed FWA standards, he still won't be able to get WZW on the channel because of the exclusivity clause.That's what leaves a bad taste in my mouth. TWC should have been the "promised land" for several British wrestling promotions - but that press release basically tells them not to even think about it. TWC is the FWA's yard.Of course, FWA Webmaster's statement on page 3 of this thread then suggests that there ISN'T an exclusivity contract - in clear contradiction of the press release... so either (a) FWA made a quick climbdown or (b) the person who wrote that press release has fucked it up royally and brought FWA a boatload of negative press. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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