ReturnOfTheMack

Double post, I blame Dan Brown.

His recent speech oh wait, at the Fabian Society talked about "a fair world for all" under a world system of Banking and hinted at the same thing for climate change

What a cunt! Wanting a fair world for all and an easier, more streamlined banking system and for everyone to work towards dealing with climate change together. He should be strung up.

No, but its also kind of obvious that bankers would be running the banking system and that goverment leaders would make the decisions on policy. Despite what they think the taxi drivers really dont run it all.

- Who are the richest people in the world, and who controls the entire monetary system? Bankers.

 

- Who appears to make decisions on world policy, who we go to war with, and our laws and legislation? Government and in some historical cases Royalty.

 

- Who controls and manufactures our necessities, material possessions and media consumption? the Corporate world.

Is this serious or some kind of sarcasm Im not getting?

Im re-re-re-reading 'Are You Dave Gorman?'. Pure brilliance.

The show originated following a drunken bet between Dave Gorman and his friend Danny Wallace. The bet was thus: Gorman claimed that he shared the name "Dave Gorman" with the assistant manager of East Fife F.C. and that there must be "loads" of others around. Wallace disagreed with him. So the two travelled to East Fife (from London

No rational person would say that Denise Fergus should not have the right to access details of the murderers of her son.

I'd say she should be about the last person who should know, what with her having reason to hate them and want revenge. What else could she get out of it?

I know/knew 10 year olds who were fully aware of the world and were still evil little fuckwits. Oh sure its because of how they were brought up (usually, though I have known people brought up well turn out to be dicks), but it doesnt stop them being evil.

 

That said, I agree that it would be more important to try to rehabilitate them from the shitty upbringing, at least give them the chance to change the direction they are taking. I feel the same about the 2 kids here in doncaster, what they did was evil, but they didnt have much of a chance with how their mum and dad treat them.

 

It's a difficult issue; of course the parents in both cases are contemptible cunts who should be strung up, but IMO some people, kids or not, are just wired wrong - the capability to do something as evil as that has to be there in the first place, because there are plenty of people who've had shitty upbringings and yet don't murder or torture small children.

 

For that reason, there has to be an element of punishment as well as rehabilitation in these sentences - like it or not, they are culpable for their actions and need to know that they'll have consequences. Allowing both of those men to live their entire adult lives as free men is no punishment at all, in my opinion. The fact that Venables has apparently gone on to re-offend seems to show that he's not yet been effectively taught that his actions will have consequences.

Erm, they were punished. They were sentenced and served their time. They'll have to live with the guilt for the rest of their lives. Do you really think Thomson and Venebles are living the high life now, chuckling about their youthful indiscretion? You say 're-offend', like he's gone out and killed another kid. He could have just failed to report back to the prison on time or something, y'know.

 

 

As far as I'm concerned, 8 years (in a unit without the punitive environment of adult prison) is not a punishment that fit the crime - they didn't lose a day of their adult lives, and probably had a much more comfortable childhood and better care inside than they would have had on the outside. In my view, 'justice' has to include some measure of retribution for the victim - in this case, the sentence was entirely waited towards making sure the offenders were alright with no care towards the victim. I honestly don't know whether they're regretting their actions or 'living the high life, chuckling about their youthful indiscretions' now, because I can't fathom the mindset of the kind of sick cunt who does that to a toddler. That they had the chance to live a full, uninhibited adult life that they didn't allow James Bulger is not even close to justice, IMO.

 

Though I take what the tabloids say with a pinch of salt, the reports today suggest Venables is still a fucked-up individual with every chance of posing a danger to society. Even if they're wide of the mark, I think it's highly unlikely that he'd be summarily marched back to prison and the story leaked to the press for something as inconsequential as failing to report to his parole officer on time.

You say 'sick cunt' as if it was a premeditated child murder. It was nothing of the sort. It was a couple of fucked up kids from fucked up homes who perpetrated something that started off as a 'game' and resulted in a horrific crime.

I disagree, it was premeditated. They tried to abduct another child first, so it wasnt spur of the moment, and they took Bulger to a place they thought they could cover up their actions by making it look like a train hit the child. Thats not a 'game', thats a planned killing.

To all you do gooders, that are saying he should not be harmed, and they where only 10

 

I do hope you never ever have kids. These two should have rotted for natural life for what they did. Being 10 is no defence. With any luck the father will find out where they are and do what he said on tv.

 

If the man gets found out and fucked up, so what maybe just maybe he might feel a tiny bit of the terror that baby did when they killed him on the railway tracks by chucking rocks at his head while he screamed for his mummy.

 

How on earth people can feel sorry for them is madness.

 

Do you know any 10 year olds? They were fucking kids for crying out loud.

I know/knew 10 year olds who were fully aware of the world and were still evil little fuckwits. Oh sure its because of how they were brought up (usually, though I have known people brought up well turn out to be dicks), but it doesnt stop them being evil.

That said, I agree that it would be more important to try to rehabilitate them from the shitty upbringing, at least give them the chance to change the direction they are taking. I feel the same about the 2 kids here in doncaster, what they did was evil, but they didnt have much of a chance with how their mum and dad treat them.

Thats the one! thanks fella.

No, not that mate. Thanks anyway.

Hey, anyone remember who did the matrix spot? I wa stelling my cousin about it but I cant seem to remember who it was and I cant find it on youtube with what I know.

Yeah, but the point is he got his face out there somehow. So obviously it did happen in some areas, and didn't in others.

 

Kiffy is just being an aggro dickhead again.

 

 

No I'm not, well yes I am a bit but the points still bollocks.

Cops going into schoolds and giving talks on drugs is not a local bobby everyone knows the name of.

He was our local policeman and everyone knew his name. Seriously, it may not have been the case in every place, or even most, but it was in our town. PC John Glover was a nice guy with a huge Magnum PI tash, he did talks in schools on more than just drugs (he did trainline safety, truanting, bullying, the whole lot) as well as being the local policeman.

He stood down about 15 years ago to be replaced by a guy I dont know, but my family do as my mum is friends with a few of them in the area.

edit: though I certainly agree that its not made a huge change to society that we dont know them anymore. Its just a case of people like to think they have it worse than people before them.

Im 29 and I remember my local policeman though. Only because he used to come round to the schools in the town to give talks about drugs and stuff, otherwise I wouldnt have had any clue.

Hey guys, I'm looking to get hold of DDT DVDs, if anyone has them for sale please PM. Thanks.

Cushings Doctor was a human who was actually called Doctor Who. He wasnt a Time Lord, and he wasnt 'The Doctor'.

Parallel worlds maybe?

Also a Time Lord only has a finite number of regenerations. Though the theory says, but The Master has had more than his cycle and at points the Time Lord High Council 'gifted' extra regenerations to Timelords so it may be an artificial limit rather than a biological one.

At the end of the episode I just kept thinking he was almost like the Valeyard.

Same answer as when you asked in post 98 of this thread, on the 1st of october.

 

Worry not, my friend. Your opinion from then has been duly noted and considered.

 

I was looking to see if anyone else had anything to add. Basically because the BNP stuff was getting old.

Truth be told I had assumed you forgot you asked.

A team from the UN's nuclear watchdog has inspected a previously secret uranium enrichment plant in Iran, Iranian officials and media have said.

 

The inspectors from the International Atomic Energy Agency are expected to visit the facility, near the holy city of Qom, again over the next two days.

 

The visit comes as world powers await Iran's response to a new proposed deal over its uranium enrichment programme.

 

Iran would send some enriched uranium to Russia to be turned into fuel.

 

The proposed deal is seen as a way for Tehran to get the fuel it needs for an existing reactor, while giving guarantees to the West that its enriched uranium will not be used for nuclear weapons.

 

But opposition inside Iran to the agreement is said to be growing. The government has promised a response this week.

 

Source: BBC.com

 

Does anyone know what the problem is with Iran and it's nuclear development?

 

I'm assuming the problem is the possibility that they could be making nuclear weapons. Would I be correct in saying that the US & UK already have such nuclear weapons?

 

If so, then why are we attempting to stop other nations from doing the same?

Same answer as when you asked in post 98 of this thread, on the 1st of october.

A quick quote from an article linked on my google page

http://www.guardian.co.uk/politics/2009/oc...estion-time-bnp

The leader of the BNP, Nick Griffin, found himself the victim of an extraordinary attack from his own supporters last night following his controversial appearance on the BBC's Question Time.

 

Lee Barnes, the BNP's legal officer, accused Griffin of "failing to press the attack". Barnes complained on his personal website that Griffin "should have stood up to these whining, middle-class hypocrites that use the race card for self-enrichment

BNP are committed to stemming and reversing the tide of non-white immigration

 

so basically getting rid of blacks that are not english?? i think i might join

Nick Griffin is also on record having said that there is 'no such a thig as a black Briton'.

Bet you cant wait to be rid of them peskie darkies.

Made me chuckle anyway.

Well, wikiquotes says

Keep England White" is a good slogan.

 

On Commonwealth immigration, recorded in Harold Macmillan's diary entry for 1955-01-20 (Peter Catterall (ed.), The Macmillan Diaries: The Cabinet Years, 1950-57 (Macmillan, 2003), p. 382)

So it could be possible, if he thought that way.

According to the BNP the only people who belong here in England are the "ethnically British", that refers to white people who were born in this country.

 

Really?

 

Whenever i've heard Griffin talk about the matter he has mentioned the fact that they are not looking to eject anyone who is not;

 

1) An illegal immigrant

2) An immigrant with a criminal record

 

He has said that money would be available for anyone who wishes to return to the country of their parents birth if they wish, but then again they have said that the Government offer this option already.

 

I'm sure they're lying though, just like they did about Churchills views on racism.

Well, a quick google search has an article from the Time where it says he said:

ON RACE

Last night, as Bonnie Greer prepared to enter the electric atmosphere of the BBC Question Time studio, she came face to face with Nick Griffin for the first time.

 

"It was the strangest thing because as I came out of my dressing room prepared for combat, it was as if he'd been waiting for me in the corridor," she says.

 

"I was the last to emerge and when he saw me, he turned and smiled his greasy smile and clumsily half extended a hand. I ignored it and thought to myself: what are you about? Are you forgetting I'm black? Are you forgetting you called me a black history fabricator? Are you trying to show me you aren't racist?"

 

But the off-camera behaviour of the leader of the far-right British National Party towards Greer, a black Chicago-born writer who became a British citizen 11 years ago, was to become even more bizarrely ingratiating as they entered the studio.

 

"We were seated next to each other and as we were having our microphones attached, he leaned towards me like I was his new best friend and tried to make small talk. "Bonnie, how many times have you been on?" he asked. "Bonnie, do you find it scary?" I looked him straight in the eye. "No," I replied sharply, "but you might."

 

Speaking exclusively to the Evening Standard immediately after filming at Television Centre in west London, Greer, 60, describes - over a stiff vodka - the ordeal of sitting next to Griffin as "probably the weirdest and most creepy experience of my life".

 

"I spent the entire night with my back turned to him. At one point, I had to restrain myself from slapping him. But it was worth it," she insists, "because he was totally trounced. I had thought we'd face a formidable orator, somebody who knew his facts and had his ducks in a row but the guy was a mess!

 

"From the moment the audience began shooting questions, it was a case of the Emperor's new clothes. He was completely exposed as an evasive liar who couldn't even stand up his own quotes and looked like a buffoon."

 

The other panellists - Justice Secretary Jack Straw, shadow minister for community cohesion Sayeda Warsi, and Lib Dem home affairs spokesman Chris Huhne - came down on him like a ton of bricks, she says.

 

"They were formidably prepared with quotes and statistics, and [host] David Dimbleby was excellent at holding him to account. I don't know if the cameras picked this up but Griffin was trembling and shaking like a leaf.

 

"There was a pivotal moment in the show when Dimbleby pressed him on whether he was still a Holocaust denier and he just looked totally bereft. For a couple of seconds there was a deafening silence. It was an amazing moment. You could see the panel thinking, 'He's done for'.

 

"He had climbed in the ring with some heavyweights and in all honesty, he got slapped around. The audience and the panel took him down time after time. It was a blood sport. He looked totally out of his depth. I was shocked by how ill-prepared he was. He didn't seem to have credible answers to anything."

 

Before the show there were those who expressed concerns as to whether this elegant but softly-spoken intellectual would be robust enough to take on Griffin.

 

As the only non-politician on the panel, her job would be to lift the debate above party politics, but she'd need to be less the lofty academic and more the voice of the people.

 

Outside the BBC complex, hundreds of screaming anti-fascist protesters were engaged in running battles with the police because they believed Griffin - an MEP whose party won six per cent of the vote in the last European elections - should not have been invited.

 

At stake was the future credibility and popularity of the BNP and its leader who would no doubt try and present a sanitised version of himself and his party.

 

Was she satisfied with her performance?

 

During the show, which focused on making Griffin account for his pernicious views on subjects ranging from immigration to the Holocaust to homophobia, Greer was well received but came across more as a bemused lecturer than the feisty combative some had hoped for.

 

For example, when Griffin was asked to explain how the BNP could justify using Winston Churchill as its symbol, Bonnie pointed out that Churchill's American mother was rumoured to have Mohawk blood and that he could not have joined Griffin's "all-white" party.

 

Later she scolded Griffin for calling David Duke's Ku Klux Klan a "non-violent organisation" and said he was talking "BS".

 

And she invited him to the British Museum for a lesson to understand once and for all that there is no such thing as "the indigenous English people".

 

But it took a black audience member to really raise the roof when he told Griffin: "You're a disgrace. The vast majority of this audience find what you stand for to be completely disgusting."

 

Why was she not more strident in her attacks on him? "I didn't need to, because others like Jack Straw waded in so heavily. I felt my job was to subtly lampoon him, toy with him, expose the idiocy of his ideas.

 

"I didn't want to come across as the angry, screaming black woman pointing my finger and hollering because that's how people like Griffin and his supporters view black women. I saw us as a team - it wasn't an ego thing, wasn't as if I had to take him down all on my own."

 

There was a touching moment, she says, just before they started recording when Sayeda Warsi ran over to her and said: "Are you okay sitting next to Griffin?" "I said: 'I'm from Chicago, I'm not scared of this guy!' And we just hugged spontaneously. We were like two prize-fighters going into the ring to do battle."

 

Was it a tough choice to appear alongside Griffin on the show? "When I was asked I deliberated for days. As someone who grew up in America and who is more cultural than political, I wasn't sure what I'd bring to the table. But then I realised, I'm the only one on the panel who has chosen to come to this country.

 

"I chose to come here because I saw it as a country of decent, fair people. But also because this country gave my father, Ben Greer, who was a black sharecropper from Mississippi, his first decent experience of white people he'd ever had.

 

"He came here during the war, in a blacks-only unit as part of General Patton's army and was involved in the second wave of D-Day landings, and later he always spoke about how well the white working-class Brits had treated him, the very people who today are said to be turning to the BNP.

 

"My daddy always said that sunlight is the best disinfectant. So I decided to come for him, and also for my deceased white English mother-in-law, Joan Hutchins, who had never met a black person before she met me, and who welcomed me into her heart."

 

The day had begun with top-secret calls from Television Centre to Greer and the other panellists that they should be ready and dressed to go "any moment" and that cars would be dispatched to pick them up with "just 15 minutes notice".

 

Greer picked her outfit carefully: a demure dark top and jacket and on her wrist, a colourful African bead bracelet. "I was wearing the colours of Jamaica and of Africa," she laughs. "A touch of ethnic."

 

They were provided police contact numbers - and in Griffin's case a police escort - in case they had to change their route at the last moment.

 

At 6pm, with hundreds of protesters engaged in running skirmishes with the police out front, they were quietly smuggled in through a back entrance.

 

"Usually we all mingle in the green room before the show but there was no mingling this time and we all had our own private green rooms. The show itself was tense, like no Question Time I've ever experienced.

 

"To me, the stars though, were the audience. It was a typical London multicultural audience and they were just brilliant in the way they held Griffin to account. It made my job easy."

 

Does she think that the BNP membership would swell, despite Griffin's poor showing? "No, I think that young people watching the show who might have been tempted to join the BNP will think again after seeing his dismal performance.

 

"Having him on and holding him to account on such a public forum is like getting to interrogate the Wizard of Oz - he's been built up and up, but then you find he's just a windbag and there's nothing there."

 

At the end, she laughs ruefully, Griffin turned to her and gave her his business card. "Bizarre - I can't even begin to understand why."

 

She shrugs. "Afterwards, there is usually a communal supper for all the panellists. But not this time. Nobody could bring themselves to break bread with Nick Griffin."

Credit: Londonstandard.co.uk

Seems the people in the studio also thought he was bricking it.