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Your top 10 wrestlers of the modern era?


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You see to me that's all down to perspective and very much open to interpretation - while you interpret 'wrestling ability' to mean one thing I interpret it to be another. It is my belief that everything that goes on in the ring whether it is physical contact between two wrestlers or verbal banter from one wrestler is still all part of a wrestler's 'ability'.

I agree. As technically proficiant (in terms of crisply executed moves and sequences) as a match may be if it doesn't excite and compell me enough to wish it'll never end then it really serves no purpose. Its just guys trading holds, nothing else, it falls flat on its face just like a sitcom with a hilarious script being performed by actors with no comic timing. A wrestler may well be a walking encyclopedia of holds but if he doesn't know how do use them properly to connect with the fans then all that knowledge is irrelevant. Look at the way Doug Williams' NOAH performances exposed the holes in his work which he manages to keep otherwise well hidden in ROH. Unless you're watching a manic Toryumon tag match, less is nearly ALWAYS more, just look at the gripping four minute headlock during Kobashi/Honda.

Truth is folk can critisize my fave's & dislike's all they want...cos I dont really give a shit ( I'm a pretty laid back person you see  :sleeping:

This isn't about favourites though, its who you think is the BEST based on what you've seen. Try being objective, if you prefer 'Dude Where's My Car?' to 'Citizen Kane' because it has more wanking references or were more excited as a child by Kwang :blush: than Bret Hart that doesn't necessarily mean they're better now does it?Anyway, here's mine based on those whose work I've seen enough of.....1. Dynamite Kid- its truly amazing the way his matches STILL hold up a full 20-25 years later. Unlike someone like Tom Zenk whose matches from 10 years ago fall flat on their arses today, Dynamite's performances bristled with such energy and contained just the right amount of insane bumping and uncompromising brutality (a nasty european uppercut out of nowhere gets you every time) that its impossible not to lose yourself in the excitement. You know a wrestlers great when two decades later you can look back and enjoy their work without having to contextualise what you're watching.And the rest in no particular order....Steve AustinBret HartMick FoleyChris BenoitMitsuharu MisawaKenta KobashiJushin LigerRic FlairSatoru Sayama(no room for Steamboat?!?!?) :angry:
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Anyway, here's mine based on those whose work I've seen enough of.....1. Dynamite Kid- its truly amazing the way his matches STILL hold up a full 20-25 years later. Unlike someone like Tom Zenk whose matches from 10 years ago fall flat on their arses today, Dynamite's performances bristled with such energy and contained just the right amount of insane bumping and uncompromising brutality (a nasty european uppercut out of nowhere gets you every time) that its impossible not to lose yourself in the excitement. You know a wrestlers great when two decades later you can look back and enjoy their work without having to contextualise what you're watching.

I know I didn't have Dynamite in my Top 5 but the guy is incredible, I recently watched a stack of Dynamite vs Tiger Mask 1 matches from 1982 the other week and it still smokes 95% of stuff in our modern era.The series of matches are timeless classics, the crisp moves, the quickness of the reversing of waistlocks and hammerlocks draws you into these gripping contests.Just my few cents to back up cattle mutilations post to give the #1 spot to Tommy.Personally I wouldn't have him as my #1 but I couldn't really argue others not having him at number #1.regards Nate Holynski
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He was a solid worker his first two years in the business. Between 1992 and 1995, he was very good, but there were at least fifty other wrestlers who were out-performing him in the ring during that era. Between 1996 and 1997, he entered some tremendous performances, and his non-wrestling work was awesome. Between 1998 and 2000, Austin was very hit and miss, though his various injuries were possibly to blame for this. He had a helluva 2001, before enduring a frustrating 2002. He really did bugger all this year, and that seems to be that.So, by my reckoning, he had three excellent in-ring years, as well as another four good/very-good years. Compared to people like Tenryu, Hansen, Aja Kong, Kyoko Inoue, Dynamite Kid and Tsuruta, who didn't make my list, he didn't have their kind of consistency or longevity as a world-class in-ring worker.

You make some good points there, but as far as throwing out names not making your lists, there are probably at least 30 names that could easily have made top 10. I won't really disagree with what you said about Austin, except that I would say he was better than 'very good' in 93 & 94. In 92 I felt he was really starting to come to himself as one of the top workers in the US, and when put together with Pillman he was pretty much at the top. I've said many times that I consider the Blonds to be the best team in US history, although charisma and 'other' factors are taken into consideration there. In 94, he had some excellent matches with Ricky Steamboat, and even managed to have great bouts with the likes of Johnny B Badd and Maxx Payne. He had a bad 95, but that was due to injuries. I wouldn't really call him hit & miss in 1998, as for the most part he was great in the ring, and deserves a tremendous amount of credit for changing his style 100% without suffring THAT much in-ring wise. I thought his PPV bouts with Foley, Undertaker and Kane were great for the most part, and even liked the WM14 bout (but everyone else hated it, so I'm probably the only one). The fact that he didn't have the great matches on RAW is understandable I'd say, due to his injuries.I also felt he was missing something in 99, but if you look closer, I don't know if that's really fair to him. For the first two PPV's, he worked with McMahon, and storyline wise, I thought he entered grand performances in those. Then the two matches with Rock, which I personally thought was excellent. His PPV match with Undertaker shouldn't really be counted due to the Owen tragedy. The KOTR match with Vince & Shane was pretty bad, and probably his worst PPV bout in a long time. I thought the Fully Loaded was pretty much excellent, within the WWF style. Definitely Undertaker's best match since the Mankind HIAC. The Summer Slam three way was somewhat disappointing, but Austin was obviously hurt, and shouldn't be blamed for that. His final PPV bout, with HHH, really helped put HHH over, and even Meltzer gave it ****. So, while 98 & 99 are known as some of Austin's 'worst', I still think he did a hell of a job all things considered. And of course, he totally proved everyone wrong with his run in 2001. It's always debatable, but I think Austin belongs on this list, as he's been one of wrestling's premier performers for the last decade. When injuries forced him to slow down, he changed his style like no one had ever done, including Jushin Liger. To me, the best American performer since the heyday of Randy Savage.
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In no order after number 1)..............1)Dynamite KidMisawaLigerBenoitAngleBret HartMichealsEddie GuerreroFlair10) either Malenko or Sayama or Owenbut the list could go on and on.

Dude, you just dipped into my back issues of PowerSlam, didn't you?!
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Hm..So, do you guys see all the Japanese wrestling via tapes? I'm curious, since so many people have Japanese wrestlers, would anyone mind recommending me the best promotion to get started on and any shows in particular?

(I was going to PM this, to save cluttering the thread, but it might be of interest to someone else wondering the same thing, so I'll post it here.)If you're a WWE fan, and you like cruiserweights, then the best place to start is definitely Toryumon. They have great flyers and some really innovative submission stuff, but what sets them apart from the rest of the Japanese feds is that they have feuds and storylines that cross the language barrier without the aid of an interpreter. This is mainly because almost everyone in the promotion's in a stable, so you instantly know what side everyone's on, but it definitely helps that everyone's young and enthusiastic about what they're doing. Plus, as far as I can tell from my limited viewing, there aren't many other Japanese feds that are currently anywhere near their best (NOAH being the obvious exception), whereas Toryumon will deliver another good new show every month.And even if you do need an interpreter, there's a wicked English-language site at http://toryumon.shiningwizard.com/. :thumbsup:If you get other responses, they'll likely say that AJPW is the best heavyweight wrestling of all time, and has the best storylines and characters of all time, but to be honest I find their stuff a bit impenetrable. There're lots of online tape reviews, but nowhere that I've found that has a feud timeline or anything, which is why Terje and co. always say that you need to watch half a dozen tapes before you 'get it'. I think they might be right, but I'm not sure I want to spend time doing that right now. Maybe someday.(And just to keep it vaguely on-topic, Liger and Eddie G are my top two for being the total in-ring package. But I readily acknowledge that I do need to see another couple of Kobashi matches.) Edited by Spatular
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Shawn Michaels - the best ever as far as I'm concerned. Even more kudos to him that he comes back after so long out and puts in performances like he did against Jericho at Wrestlemania which is far superior to anything else in the WWE this year.Bret Hart - I never used to like Bret that much, I was a big HBK fan and they spent a lot of the time on different sides so I got it into my mind that I couldn't like both! It's only recently that I've started to like Bret more from watching past matches.Keiji Muto - captivated me as the Great Muta 14 years ago, and then when I started watching him in Japan I saw him as Keiji Muto too, his 2001 was one of the best years I've ever seen a wrestler have.Yuji Nagata - probably the best wrestler to effectively use lots of kicking and striking that I have ever seen. One of the greatest 'carriers' in the world today.Hulk Hogan - I don't care if he doesn't fit the description of a great in ring wrestler, I like what he did in the ring and thoroughly enjoyed his matches, that's reason enough for me for him to be included.Eddie Guerrero - while HBK was out of the game there was Eddie G, now they are both in the WWE at the same time and I am thoroughly spoiled. Like HBK, a fantastic all rounder.The Rock - always moaned at for having few moves but when you use them as well as Rocky does you don't need 000's of them. Had far more great matches than he'll probably ever be given crdit for.Steve Austin - like Muto, and maybe even more effectively, changed his style and remained as superb as before, maybe even better. Disturbingly underrated as a 'mat wrestler' when you read people talk about him.Ric Flair - one of the very best ever and like most others in the list, so very good at making his opponent look good.Bobby Eaton - probably not an expected inclusion but a worthy one all the same. One of the many unsung heros of the 80s and 90s who tirelessly gave his all and had fantastic matches with a multitude of partners in tag matches and had some fun as a singles wrestler when given the chance.

Welcome back Midnight Express/Skyscraper/Shin Nihon Fan/Zeusamanic/Steveamaniac/Steve!I knew you'd be back sooner or later. ;)
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ok my choices have to be 1.bret hart- the best there is etc.2. ric flair- would be number one if i wasnt a bigger mark for bret truely the greatest of all time3. kurt angle- the modern day flair4. owen hart- could adapt to soooo many styles the greatest wrestler to never hold the world title.5.the dynamite kid- have u all forgotten bout him6.terry funk- how many great matches could one man have wit sooo many styles7. chris benoit- his matches says it all8. bobby eaton- the greatest tag wrestler ever period9.ted dibiase/ jake roberts- the greatest ring psychologists ever10.(ok i know thats eleven but the guys deserves to be mentioned) arn anderson- like owen he was often in the shodows but never was a man more consistent

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Truth is folk can critisize my fave's & dislike's all they want...cos I dont really give a shit

The main point of this forum, as has been said many many times by many different posters, is to create discussion. Instead of getting all defensive when somebody disagrees with your views, why not attempt to justify the views and explain why you expressed them. If everyone reacted like that when their opinion was questioned this forum would die out because every single thread would degenerate into a flame war. If you post in a thread like this, you should expect someone to question your choices and, ideally, you should be prepared to, as you put it, stick up for your opinions.alternatively, we could end up with a forum like this..post0r: Kurt angle is the best wrestler ever.CyberYokel: Ha! No he isn't, why would you say that?post0r: Fuck you!!! Its my opinion!!111 I am allowed to say it and its none of your business!!!Moddish: *sigh* Thread closed. Wonderful. :/
OK, .. I'd just like to say I aint exactly good for giving reason's why they fit in my list :( ... but I'll give it a shot ( & no I dont want any flame war's ;) )I picked Jeff Jarrett cos I have never seen him blow any spot's... I liked most of his match's Jeff Jarrett vs Chris Beniot at Starrcade 1999 & Jeff Jarrett vs DDP at Spring Stampede 200 for eg/ which were very good match'es.Simon Diamond I piked him cos ....cos damit I dont know... I just like his match'es & his style :) Bugger... I'm not good at giving reason's :(:(:(:(
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Thank God Midnight...erm..LOP brought up having Hogan in the list, I bet there were a lot of people who were to afraid to put hogan in due to his workrate, but as has been said before, it's all about the show and love him or loathe him Hogan was one of the best for drawing fans into his matches. The old arm drops two times and then the pointy finger thing, the hulking up, and this is quite possibly the weirdest thing i've ever said, but here goes...facially when he's selling it looks good, it looks real.Benoit is 10 times the technical wrestler Hogan is, but he does bore a lot of people rigid, is it me or was his in-ring work a lot more passionate up to end of 2000? I used to really like Benoit in WCW, don't get me wrong he still puts on a good match, but something that was there isn't anymore, these days he doesn't seem bothered, that's too harsh, I think I'll just shut up, I'm giving myself a headache :confused: I dunno it's something, I can't put me finger on it though!Anyway onto my top 10!1 - Ric Flair - The greatest wrestler i've ever, ever seen, still main reason I watch RAW.2 - Hulk Hogan - See above! Not going through that again3 - Bret Hart - Great talent, who had that intangiable factor to draw you into a match4 - Ted DiBiase - Possibly greatest heel ever, amazing psychology, brilliant mic skills5 - Arn Anderson - Greatest tag team wrestler of all time, amazing psychology, best ever on the mic, you name it Double A could do it.6 - Steve Austin - Only 2nd to Hogan in drawing fans into a match and he could wrestle!7 - Vader - Greatest heel big man ever, still remember not reading a wrestling mag in 93 when he did the moonsault, talk about raising the bar, hell, I used to go nuts when 'Quake did a dropkick!8 - Dynamite Kid - I've probably only seen about 20 of his matches, but the man is simply amazing, fn great heel too!9 - Kurt Angle - Best US worker active today10 - Jeff Jarrett - I saw this cause a bit of a brouhaha earlier, so I guess I better say something, I first saw JJ in 93 in the WWF with his country star gimmick and I marked for it, Jarrett always entertained me in ring, his 99 WWF and WCW stuff was top-notch, haven't seen much of his NWA stuff, but I guess he's doing OK there, again, somebody may find JJ pants, but I guess it all comes down to personal preferences.Apologies, I am ashamed at my lack of Japanese wrestling :blush: I really must get some tapes.

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On the "ridiculous" comment:I wasn't ripping you for picking those guys. Bobbins saw your top ten (with Jarrett and Diamond) and said "Jeff Jarrett. Seriously Jeff Freakin Jarrett?" I was simply saying that surely he should have said "Simon freakin Diamond?" as he is an stranger pick than JJ, IMO.See my point? Not that I give two shits even if you do ;)

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My 10, no order...Bret Hart - in terms of his work, the most honest, human and best storyteller I have seen.Barry Windham - everything he did, he did it with style. Coolest wrestler ever. At his peak, he had it all.Ric Flair - the classic heel, the interviews, the character, the great matches; touring the territories, putting people over and always giving to the sport.Ted Dibiase - had the best elements of both Ric Flair and Harley Race. The showmanship and the no-nonsense hard-nosed wrestling. I could watch Dibiase matches all day and never get bored.Randy Savage - the madness and the intensity, the way he wrestled never left you in any doubt about his motivations, a man of extremes.Toshiaki Kawada - maybe the most fascinating character in wrestling. I speak no Japanese, but just through his wrestling he's able to tell deep, fascinating stories. Takes psychology to another level. Tragedy, determination and all that jazz.Akira Hokuto - at her peak, she was perhaps the best ever. Amazing character, great matches.Shawn Michaels - As both a babyface and a heel, always a great worker who rarely failed to produce the goods.Big Van Vader - THE monster superworker, who - much like Aja Kong - knew how to maintain the brutal aura while also giving his opponents enough.Jerry Lawler - some interpret 'pure wrestling' as meaning ultra-technical wrestling with no theatre. I think of it as the purest artform, and to me that's what Memphis wrestling is about. The face/heel divide and ALL psychology, and every little thing the wrestler does matters - Memphis wasn't the prettiest or most scientific territory, but it was all about storytelling, and Lawler was The King.

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Welcome back Midnight Express/Skyscraper/Shin Nihon Fan/Zeusamanic/Steveamaniac/Steve!I knew you'd be back sooner or later. 

Subtle, Mo. Subtle.

as for Bobbin's: I take your comment as a joke 

No man. I was being deathly serious. It's fight the war, fuck the NORM. Change your freakin' sig. :angry::angry::angry:
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