fraserbee

Back at WCW Starrcade 1992, Ron Simmons was supposed to defend the WCW title against Rick Rude. Unfortunately, Rude got injured and he was replaced by Steve Williams. Simmons held onto the title here but went on to lose it to Vader a week or so later at a house show. The question is this: Was the plan always to have Vader win the belt back, or, if Rude had been healthy, would he have defeated Simmons for the title at Starrcade?

Back at WCW Starrcade 1992, Ron Simmons was supposed to defend the WCW title against Rick Rude. Unfortunately, Rude got injured and he was replaced by Steve Williams. Simmons held onto the title here but went on to lose it to Vader a week or so later at a house show. The question is this: Was the plan always to have Vader win the belt back, or, if Rude had been healthy, would he have defeated Simmons for the title at Starrcade?

Everything fucked up that year though. Michaels went on strike, Brets knee gave out after Mania and needed to go under the knife. All plans had a spanner in the works (apart from Austin becoming the biggest star in the business obviously).

 

It is amazing looking back now how many times plans had to change that year, and yet it still turned out one of the best years the WWF ever had artistically. There were the things you mentioned - Brets injuries and Michael's moods (refusing to lose to Bret, running away after the fight with Bret then refusing to lose to Davy Boy at One Night Only), but add to that Austin almost getting paralysed at Summer Slam, Brian Pillman dying and the fall out from the Survivor Series screwjob. If you consider that WWF were being soundly beaten by WCW on Monday Nights all year, working in the WWF offices must have been absolutely hellish.

Two very different questions.

 

1. I was wondering if anyone knew what happened to Justice Pain? He was CZW champion a few years back and then disappeared. I gather he was a bit of an arse but he was a passable wrestler with decent size and look, so I'd have thought someone in wrestling would have given him a shot.

 

2. During their time in WCW, both Sid and Vader used a version of the powerbomb as a finisher where they would lift the opponent over one shoulder and then drive them down. However, when they went to WWF, Sid changed his powerbomb to the more common variation where he lifts the opponent up so that one of his opponents legs ends up either side of his head before driving him down. Vader rarely used the powerbomb in WWF, but when he did, he also changed it to the one-leg-either-side-of-the-head variant. Anyone got any info as to why they did this? Did WWF have a dislike to the over the shoulder move? Is it perhaps more dangerous?

 

It's the holidays, I've been sitting indoors because it's been raining all day, and these just popped into my mind. Any help putting my mind at rest would be appreciated.

Other than those already mentioned, I enjoyed:

 

Jim Duggan's - he came across as a lot of fun.

 

Ricky Steamboat - quite a quiet man, but he had a lot of interesting stories to tell. Only thing was, he had a bogie hanging out of his nose the whole time!

 

Ken Shamrock's surprised me. I saw it on TWC back in the day, didn't have high hopes for it but found it really interesting and very entertaining.

 

My favourite overall would have to be Marty Janetty's first one however. He had so many great stories to tell, and he told them in such an engaging way. If he'd shown nearly as much character in the ring, and spent a little less time collecting these great stories, he'd have done a lot better though!

Ric Flair is famous for the many 60 (and 90) minute draws he had in the 1980s. What I am wondering, is how many of these 'hours' were real hours and how many may have been keyfabed? We know the WWF shaves time off Royal Rumble entrants to keep things exciting and I'm sure WCW have in Wargames entrances in the past too. It would have been very easy for Flair and his opponent to have been wrestling for a long time and the ring announcer to start counting down to the time limit with perhaps only 45-50 minutes gone. Unless people in the crowd really kept an eye on their watches, very few people would have been likely to be any the wiser, especially since very few of these matches were recorded.

I was just wondering if anyone knows what has become of ex CZW champion Justice Pain? I've not seen or heard his name mentioned in quite a while.

 

On a similar topic, from what I've seen of him from CZW, he was at least a reasonable wrestler, definately not a typical CZW gimmick guy and he has a good build, so it always surprised me that he never got a try-out with WWE or TNA. Was he just not interested in moving away from the small-time or did he have problems of some sort or a bad reputation?

 

CM Punk had problems with him when they had a CZW title match in February or March (can't remember which) in 2002. Pain refused to go over the match beforehand, Punk took this as him saying that he was "too good" for this (or something). I THINK a few others have said the same about Pain too. Not really much of an answer, but there you go.

 

I always thought he was a bit shit, mind.

Thanks anyway - I guess he has a bit of a rep as an arsehole.

 

I didn't think he was that great, but as he's a fairly muscular, fairly high-profile indie worker who can wrestle a bit, so I was just surprised he's never at least been given a try out in WWE or TNA.

I was just wondering if anyone knows what has become of ex CZW champion Justice Pain? I've not seen or heard his name mentioned in quite a while.

 

On a similar topic, from what I've seen of him from CZW, he was at least a reasonable wrestler, definately not a typical CZW gimmick guy and he has a good build, so it always surprised me that he never got a try-out with WWE or TNA. Was he just not interested in moving away from the small-time or did he have problems of some sort or a bad reputation?

Something that is bugging me:

 

I remember, during the period when Eurosport showed New Japan matches in the mid 1990s, a match was aired in which Pegasus Kid/Chris Benoit did his diving headbutt off the top rope to the floor. In the 15 years or so since I saw it, I've completely forgotten who else was in the match.

 

Does anyone else remember this, and if they do, could they tell me who Benoit was wrestling?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ECALpeobqzY...feature=related - Not sure if this has been put in here earlier in the thread, but a trip round WWF studios with Johny Polo!

That was so good. You made my day!

Recently I have been thinking about moves that have not to my knowledge been performed. One move I have dreamt up is a fall-away moonsault. A fall away slam but keeping hold of the opponent landing in a pinning position.

 

The only thing I can think of that was remotely close was John Morrison doing a moonsault with a mini ladder in a MitB match. Has this move ever been performed?

Scott Steiner used to do this move, back in the late '80s, early '90s. I couldn't find any footage of it on You Tube, but he executed it on Sid Vicious in a match with the Skyscrapers back in 1989 and punctured Sid's lung. He also did it on Tatsumi Fujinami and Takayuki Iizuka at Wrestle War 1992. I am sure he will have done it on other occasions too, but I can't recall them at the moment.

 

Edit: If you scroll to 4.35 on this video you'll see two - one botched and one done perfectly.

In the past or currently, has any 'top' company (WWE, TNA, WCW etc.) changed a gimmick match or similar on a show in light of what another show is offering around the same time?There's no correct answer for this, but if anyone has any examples of this happening (e.g. WWF changing a PPV stip because WCW is also promoting the same stip) or not happening (e.g. 2 rival PPV's offering up a cage match), or anyone mentioning a simlar practice in an interview etc that'd be great. Thanks!

I remember in October of 1997, WWF promoted the first Hell in a Cell with Michaels and Undertaker, while WCW did a Thundercage match with Hogan and Piper. The matches were somewhat similar in that they both included a cage that covered the entire ringside area. I'm not really sure whether one was staged as a reaction to the other or if it is just a coincidence.

Anyone know were you can download Diana Harts book? It was floating around on here a while back but i can't find it.Cheers

Here you go

Similarly, does anyone know if there are there any other books by wrestling personalities available for download?

Right, we're back on the silver, strawberry time machine back to 1995. Which WWF programmes would be on Sky? Thanks.

At a guess, I'd say Superstars and Mania on Sky One with Wrestling Challenge and Monday Night Raw on Sky Sports.

I seem to remember that Sky didn't show Raw until mid 1995 - we only got Raw action in recap shows like Mania.If my memory serves me right, we got Mania on Saturday lunchtimes, Superstars on Saturday tea-times, Challenge on Sunday mornings and All American wrestling on Sunday evenings all on Sky 1.I think when Raw came along first, in mid 1995, it was on Fridays about 6pm on Sky Sports. All American disappeared about this time. The Pay Per Views were on Sunday Nights on Sky Sports.I might be remembering this all wrong though.

It was from that 3 stages of Hell bout he had with Triple H at Armaggeddon 2002.

That's right - the spot they show on the video is the big spot in the last match of the three - which was a ladder match (but not a very good one).

What happened to Mark Rocco?

I believe he had a heart condition or something which forced him to retire in the early '90s.

Has Chris Nowinski been released by the WWE, and if so what is he doing now-a-days?He was a great talent, and would have made an excellent IC Champion.

I believe he suffered a serious concusion that he has never got over - much like Bret Hart.

Can anyone tell me who was under the mask of Kimchee - Kamala's manager? I think i read somewhere it was Steve 'Brooklyn Brawler' Lombardi, was it him?

When wrestling, yes I think it was. I think "Downtown" Bruno Lauer (Harvey Whippleman) also worked as Kim Chee at times, when he was just a manager.

I think you are right.I would imagine that, like most masked wrestlers/wrestling personalities, Kim Chee was likely played by a whole host of people, depending on who was free etc.

Apart from his plane crash has Ric Flair had any sort of long-term injuries?

None that I can think of. I do remember he did something to his ankle doing a sledge from the top rope to fhe floor in about 1997 and had to have some time off, but it wasn't really that serious.I also know he is suffering with his back just now, which I think is just long-term wear and tear and the lingering effects from the plane crash.Anyone remember differently?