Official ROH Discussion Thread

[Checkmate]

It scares me how red neck the briscoes are. Who does everyone think is going to win steen/generico

[Dearly Devoted Dexter]

Re : Steen vs Generico - I can't see Generico losing his mask, looks like Fatty Steen will be taking a break from ROH for a while.

 

Before Moxley comes out here, Dreamer makes this a Hardcore match in a promo where he's just dying to say ECW and obviously has been told not to

 

With regards the Bucks, I think they signed for TNA after they'd taken this booking; TNA tried to get them to pull out; Gabe threatened legal action: and so a compromise was reahced where they appeared on the card, but not on the PPV.

 

There's an interview with Paul London in this month's Powerslam, in which he's asked why he hasn't gone back to ROH. He reckons he attended an ROH show in 2004 and found lots of "political nastiness" there, which he says is even worse now. Newsflash Paul - there's politics in pretty much every workplace; if you ever make it into acting you'll find that out the hard way.

 

Champions Challenge

[Dearly Devoted Dexter]

Results from last night nicked from PWI Insider

 

 

Bobby Cruise opened the show by mentioning anyone who hadn't heard the results of the Louisville tapings that Christopher Daniels defeated Eddie Edwards for the ROH TV Title last weekend.

 

-Kenny King defeated Adam Cole in a really good opener. Cole is obviously a rookie in ROH but was given a really strong run at King and came really close on several occasions to putting him away. Cole seemed to come down hard on his knee at one point when King dumped him to the outside and it looked tender for a moment or two, but he shook it off and it didn't seem to slow him down too much. King caught Cole coming off the top rope and turned it into the Royal Flush to get the win. Cole got a loud ovation after the match.

 

-Mike Bennett defeated Colt Cabana in another solid match. Bennett carries himself really well, he's got the look and is a solid worker as well. He's definitely got that star package and had a really competitive match with Cabana. Some comedy stuff found its way in but this was otherwise a straightforward match that ended when Cabana had Bennett in the Billy Goat's Curse but Bob Evans distracted Cabana and allowed Bennett to roll Cabana up and get the win.

 

-ROH TV Champion Christopher Daniels defeated Andy "Right Leg" Ridge in the final match of Ridge's Trial Series. This was the best match I've ever seen Ridge have, Ridge was very competitive and at one point hit a superkick that knocked Daniels out but the momentum sent Daniels to the floor, and by the time Ridge got him back in the ring, he was only able to get 2. Ridge went for another superkick but Daniels ducked and hit the Angel's Wings to pick up the win. Good match, and definitely not a slam dunk for Daniels. Daniels cut a postmatch promo telling Ridge that he knows he's worked hard to improve and not to be disappointed about losing because he may not have the experience, but he does have the heart and he's got a great future ahead of him.

 

-Bobby Cruise announced a return date to Plymouth for Friday, March 18th.

 

-Kevin Steen & Steve Corino defeated Jay & Mark Briscoe in a really good match. They started fighting on the floor to jump start the match and brawled around ringside. Hard hitting match, Steen & Corino got the win when Mark went for the Cutthroat Driver on Corino, but Steen nailed him and hit a Package Piledriver and Corino covered Mark for the win. Steen grabbed a microphone and told Generico that he's going to die tomorrow night. Jay Briscoe grabbed the microphone after Steen & Corino left and said that it didn't matter about tonight, because Papa Briscoe's going to be in the house tomorrow and they're coming for the Kings Of Wrestling, and then reminded us that if we can't be there, that we can order the iPPV on gofightlive.tv. I was a bit surprised to see the Briscoes lose, but it makes sense to make Steen look strong since he's main eventing tomorrow night. Also, it really was a good match and I feel like the Briscoes have gotten back into their groove and have been having some really strong matches in the last few months.

 

INTERMISSION

 

-El Generico won a Four Corner Survival over Grizzly Redwood, Rhett Titus, and Ricky Reyes. This match was all about the other three guys building to Generico tagging in and destroying everyone else in the match. Generico won with a brainbuster on Grizzly, then started to pick him up for a second brainbuster, then changed his mind and set him up for a Package Piledriver but Steve Corino came out and stopped him. Corino went on to say that Steen and Generico have been going at it for a year now and it needs to end, and that can happen if Generico just takes the mask off because now it's unsanctioned and Corino can't control Steen anymore. Generico statrts to take the mask off but then kills Corino with a running Yakuza Kick and attacks him until the Jobber Patrol comes out to pull him off.

 

-TJ Perkins defeated Kyle O'Reilly. I saw these two wrestle one another at EVOLVE earlier this year, and that match was really good but I think they topped it here. They did a lot of mat work early on with chain wrestling and submission, which didn't get over with the crowd at all. They got a better reaction once they moved on and started opening up with the high impact kicks. They did a series of pinfall reversal sequences until O'Reilly went for the Magistral Cradle but Perkins countered to a cradle of his own for the win.

 

-ROH World Champion Roderick Strong defeated Sonjay Dutt in an excellent non-title match. Sonjay was a last minute replacement for the injured Kenny Omega, and he took advantage of the opportunity and had a good showing for himself, busting his ass out there and being the Sonjay Dutt he should have been during his ROH run last year. Roderick put Dutt away with a vertical suplex into a backbreaker.

 

-The Kings Of Wrestling defeated the American Wolves in a hard fought, back and forth match that went over a half hour. I'd have to sit and watch all three matches again, but I think this may have been better than either of the KOW-Briscoes matches from Big Bang and Death Before Dishonor VIII. Eddie Edwards in particular looked like a million bucks and it took three rolling elbows from Hero to finally put him down. The KOW attacked the Wolves after the match and left them laying, and then after they were gone and the Wolves were back up, they got a standing ovation and Davey cut a promo saying that this was supposed to be their last match as a team, but he thinks the Kings OF Wrestling are on the run and they were never a team that was put together to be commercially successful, and it doesn't matter what title you put on the DVDs, they're a brotherhood and they're what ROH is all about, and the fans are all a part of that brotherhood.

 

This show was excellent, it's far and away the best ROH house show (ie not HDNet, iPPV, or in New York) that I've been to in a very long time. For the first time in a long time I felt like a real effort was made to put on a show that was terrific from top to bottom, and the difference was noticeable. The main event blew me away and everything underneath was solid to very good, and as a fan I really hope that ROH continues presenting house shows like this because it was everything I first fell in love with about the company.

Edited December 18, 2010 by Dearly Devoted Dexter

[air_raid]

Anyone watching the iPPV - what time does it start, our time?

[Dearly Devoted Dexter]

If I can stay spoiler-free tomorrow I might buy it and watch it tomorrow night

[air_raid]

Results from the Final Battle iPPV :

 

<-- click on 'spoiler' to show/hide the spoiler

 

 

18/12/10 * Final Battle 2010 * New York, NY

(1) The All Night Express beat Adam Cole & Kyle O'Reilly, Kenny King pinning Cole after the One Night Stand.

(2) Colt Cabana pinned TJ Perkins with a roll up.

(3) Sara Del Ray & Serena Deeb beat Daizee Haze & Amazing Kong, Del Ray pinning Haze after a piledriver.

(4) Eddie Edwards pinned Sonjay Dutt after Die Hard.

(5) Homicide pinned Chris Daniels after an Ace Crusher in a non-title match.

(6) The Briscoes & Papa beat Chris Hero, Claudio Castagnoli & Shane Hagadorn, Jay pinning Hagadorn after a Doomsday Device with Papa.

(7) World Heavyweight Champion Roderick Strong beat Davey Richards by stoppage with the Stronghold.

(8) El Generico pinned Kevin Steen in a no-disqualification match after hitting him in the face with a chair.

 

 

In the World title match, Davey absorbed a horrific pasting at ringside, getting put through a table and then a Tiger/Gibson Driver on the floor immediately afterwards. Strong then threw him over the guard rail and tried to let him get counted out. Davey got back in at 20. Richards eventually mounted a comeback. At one point Davey had Strong in an anklelock and just sort of let go, retreating to his corner where O'Reilly tried to clear his head and the ref seemed to be checking if he was ok to carry on, either selling a concussion or actually hurt. Roddy came back strong, Davey kicked out of a flying big boot, Tiger Driver and a suplex-into-lungblower, before getting lamped with an inverted Death By Roderick, a low superkick and a low flying boot. Rod applied the Stronghold (knee in the back) and the ref stopped it because Richards was apparently out.

 

The main event involved plenty of blood - Steen smearing Generico's blood all over himself - tables, ladders, chairs, and an inevitable run in from Corino and Cabana which included a tease that Cabana might turn on Generico but twatted Corino with the chair instead. This match had three terrible kick outs at the end which shattered suspension of disbelief for me - Steen kicked out after a brainbuster on the apron, Generico kicked out of a package piledriver on an upright chair, and Steen survived the turnbuckle brainbuster. Indyriffic stupidity.

 

Great bit of storytelling at the end - Generico has Steen on his knees, and is ready to clobber him again with a chair. Steen holds up the mask he took from Genny at GBH IX. Generico takes it and stares at it for a few seconds, before throwing it aside and twatting Steen, then taking the pin.

 

Bottom to top a great show and the main was full of action, but those three false finishes were SILLY. As bad as Shawn Michaels surviving the Tombstone on the floor at WrestleMania. For everything ROH does right, that could have been any rubbish indy from 2002 just having things get kicked out of for the sake of it.

 

Feel a bit in no mans land really. I cant believe some of the stuff some of the E viewers purport to enjoy, but then for ROH to book sillyness like that...

 

Never mind. It can't sully a damn enjoyable viewing experience.

 

 

 

[close spoiler]

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Edited December 19, 2010 by air_raid_crash

[jackhennessey]

SUPER HALF NELSON BACKBREAKER!

 

 

that made me lose my shit, yeah looking back near misses with that amount of head drops and stuff was mental but sod it, had fun watching it and its the end of the year gotta go out with a bang! No spoilers here but Papa Briscoe was/is legitimately the MAN!

Edited December 19, 2010 by jackhennessey

[JPC]

It was a great PPV by ROH.

 

The opening tag was a lot of fun. O'Reilly and Cole make a great team and they should fill the gap left by the Young Bucks.

 

Colt Cabana vs. TJP was great. Flawless chain wrestling. Would love to see them do a longer match, perhaps a 2/3 falls or 30 minute iron man match.

 

The women's tag was okay, better than WWE/TNA womens matches but that was expected.

 

Edwards/Dutt was okay but both guys lack any kind of crowd work what so ever. It was just a series of carefully planned routines.

 

Homicide/Daniels was fun for what it was but if this was 5 years ago it would have been a far more hard hitting, far faster and far better match.

 

6 man tag was fun too. The whole show was fun up to this point.

 

Then it gets very serious. Strong/Richards was fantastic, great story told at the finish. On par with the Richards/Black series.

 

Generico/Steen was brutal. I agree with the points made about the last three near falls but it had to come down to Generico's revenge chair shot. It was like beautiful poetry.

 

Great end to the year. Best wrestling PPV all year from any company anywhere. 2011 is going to be great for ROH.

[Dearly Devoted Dexter]

Tag Wars 2010 – 28/8/10

 

 

El Generico vs. Eric Stevens – add another piece of empirical evidence to the fact of El Generico being one of the most underrated guys in the business, as he drags a decent match out of the moribund Eric Stevens. Generico with the BRANBUSTAA! just shy of ten minutes.

 

Steve Corino vs. Bobby Dempsey – Jesus fucking wept, this match went 9.33, a good 6 minutes longer than it had any right to. One of the most pointless matches in ROH history; I’m not even going to record the result.

 

Grizzly Redwood vs. Necro Butcher – speaking of pointless, another waste of time Embassy vs Grizzly match. Necro wins with the Tiger Driver.

 

Eddie Edwards vs. Colt Cabana – easily Cabana’s most relevant outing for awhile; after a couple of comedy spots he mercifully shelves the routine and instead has a decent little match with Edwards. The former tries to outwit Edwards with mat wrestling and WOS style spots (and credit to Kevin Kelly for actually mentioning World of Sport, as opposed to lazily labelling it “that European style”), while Edwards counters with lets of NOAH style strikes. The TV champ goes over with a bridging pin.

 

The Bravado Brothers & Cedric Alexander vs. Jake Manning, Caleb Konley & Mark Dillinger – try and describe this match without using the word “jobber”. Cedric Alexander might be worth a look in a singles match; but I couldn’t give a fuck about the rest. In particular the idea that the Bravados are supposed to be the future of the ROH tag division is maybe the most laughable thing I’ve heard in 2010. Lance Bravado pins Konley after double team kicks to the head.

 

Kevin Steen vs. Roderick Strong – given that Roderick’s heel turn is stuttering somewhat, why would you book him in a match where he’s going to have to play babyface? Don’t look at me, I only review these things. A solid match, although you came away feeling these two were capable of having better. Steen worked Strong’s leg for much of the match. Corino lobs Steen the chain; but Cabana runs in, followed quickly by Generico. After all that, Strong pins Steen after hitting Black’s superkick.

 

The Kings of Wrestling vs. The Briscoe Brothers vs. The Dark City Fight Club vs. Kenny King & Rhett Titus – Ultimate Endurance – the first Ultimate Endurance match for over two and half years; and it may well have been the best one to date (although I’d need to go back look at the one at WTC before I could swear on it.) The first fall is Four Corner Survival rules; and after some silliness in which everyone tries to make the Kings wrestle each other, Titus and King build some steam up on Cory Chavis. Jon Davis makes the hot tag, but Titus and King wrest back the upper hand, and hit the springboard blockbuster onto the knees to eliminate the DCFC at 18.28. Second Fall is Texas Tornado Rules, and Jay Briscoe immediately gets some colour on the floor. Titus and King batter Jay on the outside, while in the ring the Kings work over Mark. They can’t get the pin though, and eventually King and Titus chance their arm in getting a quick pin on the champs, allowing the Briscoes to get themselves together. The Kings get tossed out; and Titus gets clobbered with the Doomsday Device at 28.06. The final fall is Scramble rules, but it makes little impact – Hero blasts Jay with the loaded elbow pad to retain the belts for the Kings at 28.19. Although I don’t believe for a second that the fans voted for the stipulations as claimed; this was a very good UE match, and one of the best tag outings in ROH this year.

 

Tyler Black vs. Davey Richards – ok, so it wasn’t quite as epic as their DBD 8 effort; but it was still a bloody good effort. Black busts out the “U Can’t C Me” again, and Richards gives him a battering for his troubles. Richards throws everything at Black, but just can’t put him away...until he locks in the Clover Leaf, and the champ taps in this non-title affair. Superb stuff.

 

Overall – the undercard was patchy, but the two main matches delivered in spades.

Edited December 21, 2010 by Dearly Devoted Dexter

[Dearly Devoted Dexter]

Evolve 4 : Danielson vs. Fish

[neil's bitch]

Whislt im here, Dexter, What is the fuss about Jon Moxley? I mean really, i just dont get it......he looks like a drug addict to me, and his in ring work doesnt seem as good as people make out. Bar that his promos are ok, but you can base all the hype on just that......can i? The only reason i ask is for a while DGUSA where near on jizzing about him, and he has general notable mentions from various places also, but again i just dont get it.

[Dearly Devoted Dexter]

Moxley...he's ok. Very good on the mike, but his in-ring work's very hit and miss. That said I've only really seen his stuff in DG:USA and EVOLVE (apparently some of his best work has been in CZW). He is a touch overrated, but if he can polish up his in-ring work a bit he could be a top guy on the indies. It'll be interesting to see how 2011 pans out for him.

[theblackvinnymac]

Yeah I think his promo's are good but his in-ring skills/wrestling isn't up to par for him to be a major player in ROH just yet for me.

But he's definitely in a group alongside Brandon Gatson, Ryan Taylor & Orion Bishop that have the potential to be big indy wrestling names...

 

Also am I the only person who doesnt get why Chris Hero isnt the ROH world champ or at least a major contender for the title???

I thought with the likes of Desmond Wolf and Tyler Black leaving he would of been the natural heir to the throne

[neil's bitch]

Yeah I think his promo's are good but his in-ring skills/wrestling isn't up to par for him to be a major player in ROH just yet for me.

But he's definitely in a group alongside Brandon Gatson, Ryan Taylor & Orion Bishop that have the potential to be big indy wrestling names...

 

Also am I the only person who doesnt get why Chris Hero isnt the ROH world champ or at least a major contender for the title???

I thought with the likes of Desmond Wolf and Tyler Black leaving he would of been the natural heir to the throne

 

I think its because he was looking good for a title run last year or so, but he didnt quite get to "That" level that other champions had, so they put him back with claudio, who if i remeber rightly was in the same sort of position.

 

To be hoenst i think this tag team is really helping his get to that level that he needs to be at, and would imagine in the next year or so he'll be up there in the ranks for sure.

[Dearly Devoted Dexter]

The big problem with the ROH title picture is that by the time they eventually put it on Black, Davey Richards had pretty eclipsed him as the star of the company. Then they had to put the belt on Strong because Richards was in Japan for GHB 9. Jobbing Strong out at FB would have cut him off at the knees in terms of his ROH career, so they've kept the belt on him for now. When Richards does eventually get the title I can see him having a Danielson length run. In relation to Hero as champ, it's going to be a year or two before that happens I'd say.