Pick Your Power Game Thread

[Retro Red]

Right back from work a little more to add to my last post.

 

All this changes is that Snake went from being scum to bulletproof scum as far as I'm concerned. A confirmed bulletproof essentially becomes vanilla because the role is negated (since nobody will now target him unless they want to test the claim). I say the lynch is still a valid one, the Lion flip serves nothing if it's a mislynch whereas the Snake one at least would confirm SMS's role. I get the feeling Snake will be flipping scum, bulletproof or not though.

 

Bristep isn't this essentially what has happened with the bomb role after you got the claim out of Tom now the scum can't get caught out by trying to kill the bomb as long as they avoid trying to kill the top 5 listed players.

 

Suggest questions that you want Ron to ask.

 

Just give him one more day.

Any questions I want Ron to ask I really would rather just have the answer straight out of Snake today, in fact him asking Ron to Neighbouriser him with you giving his role is even MORE suspicious. The neighbouriser role is useful to share info and suspicions away from prying eyes Snake doesn't have any additional info if he is town bulletproof so why in particular should Snake asked to be neighbourised. The role should be used to try get cop/watcher/tracker info shared by a number of players so if a player goes down as town cop then that info is not lost that night phase as another player has that info. So I can't see a reason for Snake to be asking to be neighbourised day 1, maybe after a few days so he can keep this info save but not day 1.

 

SMS why did you choose to rolecop Snake assuming your town surely the best bet for using your claimed role for the town is to investigate the claimed vanillas at the bottom of the list, i.e Lion who you claim to be suspicious of, as that way you could use the role as a sudo cop role because if they reveal as vanilla then there town and if goon then there scum. So I'm just trying to understand the reason you say you targeted Snake where the only info you get is role which doesn't help with the alignment of a player in this particular game

 

I don't think it works like that. I think that Vanilla/Goons get a "basic no role" result.

 

It is a good point though, it is far more prudent to investigate the claimed VT's to check for liars. Investigating Snake just smacks more of snooping. Especially without prior suspicion of the person you investigated.

well as far as I'm concerned Goon is a role so I don't see that being the case but lets ask

 

MOD QUESTION IS GOON CONSIDERED TO BE A ROLE IN GAME?

 

SMS if you thought Lion would be investigated by a cop you still had a number of other vanilla claims you could have checked and also did you not consider that there may either be 1) a scum cop or 2) no cop in game given that really the first player in the game should be going for the most important role and so no one else might have tried going for that role?

 

Re : the "isn't this the same thing" I don't see how it is. The bomb is still an active element in the game (if Tom was truthing) and if the scum don't have it then they're going to have to tread carefully if looking to NK one of the top 5. (And unfortunately with SMS's 'reveal' that's now down to 3 players).

 

I also didn't have prior knowledge of the bomb before I asked Tom the question, whereas SMS knew Snake was bulletproof before he made a claim for him.

 

LA again as I have training tonight.

[Mafia Scum Scum]

Right back from work a little more to add to my last post.

 

All this changes is that Snake went from being scum to bulletproof scum as far as I'm concerned. A confirmed bulletproof essentially becomes vanilla because the role is negated (since nobody will now target him unless they want to test the claim). I say the lynch is still a valid one, the Lion flip serves nothing if it's a mislynch whereas the Snake one at least would confirm SMS's role. I get the feeling Snake will be flipping scum, bulletproof or not though.

 

Bristep isn't this essentially what has happened with the bomb role after you got the claim out of Tom now the scum can't get caught out by trying to kill the bomb as long as they avoid trying to kill the top 5 listed players.

 

Suggest questions that you want Ron to ask.

 

Just give him one more day.

Any questions I want Ron to ask I really would rather just have the answer straight out of Snake today, in fact him asking Ron to Neighbouriser him with you giving his role is even MORE suspicious. The neighbouriser role is useful to share info and suspicions away from prying eyes Snake doesn't have any additional info if he is town bulletproof so why in particular should Snake asked to be neighbourised. The role should be used to try get cop/watcher/tracker info shared by a number of players so if a player goes down as town cop then that info is not lost that night phase as another player has that info. So I can't see a reason for Snake to be asking to be neighbourised day 1, maybe after a few days so he can keep this info save but not day 1.

 

SMS why did you choose to rolecop Snake assuming your town surely the best bet for using your claimed role for the town is to investigate the claimed vanillas at the bottom of the list, i.e Lion who you claim to be suspicious of, as that way you could use the role as a sudo cop role because if they reveal as vanilla then there town and if goon then there scum. So I'm just trying to understand the reason you say you targeted Snake where the only info you get is role which doesn't help with the alignment of a player in this particular game

 

I don't think it works like that. I think that Vanilla/Goons get a "basic no role" result.

 

It is a good point though, it is far more prudent to investigate the claimed VT's to check for liars. Investigating Snake just smacks more of snooping. Especially without prior suspicion of the person you investigated.

well as far as I'm concerned Goon is a role so I don't see that being the case but lets ask

 

MOD QUESTION IS GOON CONSIDERED TO BE A ROLE IN GAME?

 

SMS if you thought Lion would be investigated by a cop you still had a number of other vanilla claims you could have checked and also did you not consider that there may either be 1) a scum cop or 2) no cop in game given that really the first player in the game should be going for the most important role and so no one else might have tried going for that role?

 

That was something I was considering, but I got worried about how quiet El Nicko had been, but if I had checked it out a bit more I would have realised he had been replaced.

 

Go look at Mikes first post in this game, you will see he has Teedy Kays name crossed out and Brownies added, but not for other players who have been replaced.

 

I used that as a guide to remind me who else was in the game and what draft number they got.

 

I made a mistake by using that, then another by not checking through properly and remembering that Snake replaced Nicko, so I am sorry for that mistake.

[Retro Red]

I know that the mafia scum wiki is considered dated but from it there is this;

 

* Role Cop:

 

Investigates, but receives information about ability instead of alignment.

 

Receives information about ability instead of alignment. So I wouldn't expect them to get a Goon or Vanilla result.

[Mafia Scum Scum]

Right back from work a little more to add to my last post.

 

All this changes is that Snake went from being scum to bulletproof scum as far as I'm concerned. A confirmed bulletproof essentially becomes vanilla because the role is negated (since nobody will now target him unless they want to test the claim). I say the lynch is still a valid one, the Lion flip serves nothing if it's a mislynch whereas the Snake one at least would confirm SMS's role. I get the feeling Snake will be flipping scum, bulletproof or not though.

 

Bristep isn't this essentially what has happened with the bomb role after you got the claim out of Tom now the scum can't get caught out by trying to kill the bomb as long as they avoid trying to kill the top 5 listed players.

 

Suggest questions that you want Ron to ask.

 

Just give him one more day.

Any questions I want Ron to ask I really would rather just have the answer straight out of Snake today, in fact him asking Ron to Neighbouriser him with you giving his role is even MORE suspicious. The neighbouriser role is useful to share info and suspicions away from prying eyes Snake doesn't have any additional info if he is town bulletproof so why in particular should Snake asked to be neighbourised. The role should be used to try get cop/watcher/tracker info shared by a number of players so if a player goes down as town cop then that info is not lost that night phase as another player has that info. So I can't see a reason for Snake to be asking to be neighbourised day 1, maybe after a few days so he can keep this info save but not day 1.

 

SMS why did you choose to rolecop Snake assuming your town surely the best bet for using your claimed role for the town is to investigate the claimed vanillas at the bottom of the list, i.e Lion who you claim to be suspicious of, as that way you could use the role as a sudo cop role because if they reveal as vanilla then there town and if goon then there scum. So I'm just trying to understand the reason you say you targeted Snake where the only info you get is role which doesn't help with the alignment of a player in this particular game

 

I don't think it works like that. I think that Vanilla/Goons get a "basic no role" result.

 

It is a good point though, it is far more prudent to investigate the claimed VT's to check for liars. Investigating Snake just smacks more of snooping. Especially without prior suspicion of the person you investigated.

well as far as I'm concerned Goon is a role so I don't see that being the case but lets ask

 

MOD QUESTION IS GOON CONSIDERED TO BE A ROLE IN GAME?

 

SMS if you thought Lion would be investigated by a cop you still had a number of other vanilla claims you could have checked and also did you not consider that there may either be 1) a scum cop or 2) no cop in game given that really the first player in the game should be going for the most important role and so no one else might have tried going for that role?

 

Re : the "isn't this the same thing" I don't see how it is. The bomb is still an active element in the game (if Tom was truthing) and if the scum don't have it then they're going to have to tread carefully if looking to NK one of the top 5. (And unfortunately with SMS's 'reveal' that's now down to 3 players).

 

I also didn't have prior knowledge of the bomb before I asked Tom the question, whereas SMS knew Snake was bulletproof before he made a claim for him.

 

LA again as I have training tonight.

 

Don't go putting all the blame on me.

 

I warned of the consequences if I revealed my info and people were still voting Snake.

 

Snake is V/LA till sometime tomorrow, with the time not stated, so may not be back till after the day ends.

 

If I believe in something, I will stick my neck out and fight for it, even if it leads to my lynch or costing the town because I do honestly believe I am trying to do the right thing for the town here.

 

If you see that differently, then that is fine, but I can't please everyone.

[Retro Red]

Right back from work a little more to add to my last post.

 

All this changes is that Snake went from being scum to bulletproof scum as far as I'm concerned. A confirmed bulletproof essentially becomes vanilla because the role is negated (since nobody will now target him unless they want to test the claim). I say the lynch is still a valid one, the Lion flip serves nothing if it's a mislynch whereas the Snake one at least would confirm SMS's role. I get the feeling Snake will be flipping scum, bulletproof or not though.

 

Bristep isn't this essentially what has happened with the bomb role after you got the claim out of Tom now the scum can't get caught out by trying to kill the bomb as long as they avoid trying to kill the top 5 listed players.

 

Suggest questions that you want Ron to ask.

 

Just give him one more day.

Any questions I want Ron to ask I really would rather just have the answer straight out of Snake today, in fact him asking Ron to Neighbouriser him with you giving his role is even MORE suspicious. The neighbouriser role is useful to share info and suspicions away from prying eyes Snake doesn't have any additional info if he is town bulletproof so why in particular should Snake asked to be neighbourised. The role should be used to try get cop/watcher/tracker info shared by a number of players so if a player goes down as town cop then that info is not lost that night phase as another player has that info. So I can't see a reason for Snake to be asking to be neighbourised day 1, maybe after a few days so he can keep this info save but not day 1.

 

SMS why did you choose to rolecop Snake assuming your town surely the best bet for using your claimed role for the town is to investigate the claimed vanillas at the bottom of the list, i.e Lion who you claim to be suspicious of, as that way you could use the role as a sudo cop role because if they reveal as vanilla then there town and if goon then there scum. So I'm just trying to understand the reason you say you targeted Snake where the only info you get is role which doesn't help with the alignment of a player in this particular game

 

I don't think it works like that. I think that Vanilla/Goons get a "basic no role" result.

 

It is a good point though, it is far more prudent to investigate the claimed VT's to check for liars. Investigating Snake just smacks more of snooping. Especially without prior suspicion of the person you investigated.

well as far as I'm concerned Goon is a role so I don't see that being the case but lets ask

 

MOD QUESTION IS GOON CONSIDERED TO BE A ROLE IN GAME?

 

SMS if you thought Lion would be investigated by a cop you still had a number of other vanilla claims you could have checked and also did you not consider that there may either be 1) a scum cop or 2) no cop in game given that really the first player in the game should be going for the most important role and so no one else might have tried going for that role?

 

Re : the "isn't this the same thing" I don't see how it is. The bomb is still an active element in the game (if Tom was truthing) and if the scum don't have it then they're going to have to tread carefully if looking to NK one of the top 5. (And unfortunately with SMS's 'reveal' that's now down to 3 players).

 

I also didn't have prior knowledge of the bomb before I asked Tom the question, whereas SMS knew Snake was bulletproof before he made a claim for him.

 

LA again as I have training tonight.

 

Don't go putting all the blame on me.

 

I warned of the consequences if I revealed my info and people were still voting Snake.

 

Snake is V/LA till sometime tomorrow, with the time not stated, so may not be back till after the day ends.

 

If I believe in something, I will stick my neck out and fight for it, even if it leads to my lynch or costing the town because I do honestly believe I am trying to do the right thing for the town here.

 

If you see that differently, then that is fine, but I can't please everyone.

 

SMS that wasn't a shot at you. I'm getting a big over defensive vibe off you at the moment.

[Ron Simmons]

I'm going to be defensive, because I stood up for something I believe is the right thing to do, but as people are unsure about it I have become a suspect and given scum info on 2 roles.

 

So anyone else got anything to add to this discussion before we look at pushing this lynch through?

Yes, if you're town, WHY are you begging for Snake's life? Obviously there's no way you can know for sure what his allignment is, is why I'm asking.

 

All this changes is that Snake went from being scum to bulletproof scum as far as I'm concerned. A confirmed bulletproof essentially becomes vanilla because the role is negated (since nobody will now target him unless they want to test the claim). I say the lynch is still a valid one, the Lion flip serves nothing if it's a mislynch whereas the Snake one at least would confirm SMS's role. I get the feeling Snake will be flipping scum, bulletproof or not though.

I'm gonna disagree with this one, Britstep. If he's town it's potentially a role we're guaranteed to keep until the end of the game. I think we need to proceed with caution. If we wind up lynching a bulletproof player the scum will be rubbing their hands in glee.

[Mafia Scum Scum]

Right back from work a little more to add to my last post.

 

All this changes is that Snake went from being scum to bulletproof scum as far as I'm concerned. A confirmed bulletproof essentially becomes vanilla because the role is negated (since nobody will now target him unless they want to test the claim). I say the lynch is still a valid one, the Lion flip serves nothing if it's a mislynch whereas the Snake one at least would confirm SMS's role. I get the feeling Snake will be flipping scum, bulletproof or not though.

 

Bristep isn't this essentially what has happened with the bomb role after you got the claim out of Tom now the scum can't get caught out by trying to kill the bomb as long as they avoid trying to kill the top 5 listed players.

 

Suggest questions that you want Ron to ask.

 

Just give him one more day.

Any questions I want Ron to ask I really would rather just have the answer straight out of Snake today, in fact him asking Ron to Neighbouriser him with you giving his role is even MORE suspicious. The neighbouriser role is useful to share info and suspicions away from prying eyes Snake doesn't have any additional info if he is town bulletproof so why in particular should Snake asked to be neighbourised. The role should be used to try get cop/watcher/tracker info shared by a number of players so if a player goes down as town cop then that info is not lost that night phase as another player has that info. So I can't see a reason for Snake to be asking to be neighbourised day 1, maybe after a few days so he can keep this info save but not day 1.

 

SMS why did you choose to rolecop Snake assuming your town surely the best bet for using your claimed role for the town is to investigate the claimed vanillas at the bottom of the list, i.e Lion who you claim to be suspicious of, as that way you could use the role as a sudo cop role because if they reveal as vanilla then there town and if goon then there scum. So I'm just trying to understand the reason you say you targeted Snake where the only info you get is role which doesn't help with the alignment of a player in this particular game

 

I don't think it works like that. I think that Vanilla/Goons get a "basic no role" result.

 

It is a good point though, it is far more prudent to investigate the claimed VT's to check for liars. Investigating Snake just smacks more of snooping. Especially without prior suspicion of the person you investigated.

well as far as I'm concerned Goon is a role so I don't see that being the case but lets ask

 

MOD QUESTION IS GOON CONSIDERED TO BE A ROLE IN GAME?

 

SMS if you thought Lion would be investigated by a cop you still had a number of other vanilla claims you could have checked and also did you not consider that there may either be 1) a scum cop or 2) no cop in game given that really the first player in the game should be going for the most important role and so no one else might have tried going for that role?

 

Re : the "isn't this the same thing" I don't see how it is. The bomb is still an active element in the game (if Tom was truthing) and if the scum don't have it then they're going to have to tread carefully if looking to NK one of the top 5. (And unfortunately with SMS's 'reveal' that's now down to 3 players).

 

I also didn't have prior knowledge of the bomb before I asked Tom the question, whereas SMS knew Snake was bulletproof before he made a claim for him.

 

LA again as I have training tonight.

 

Don't go putting all the blame on me.

 

I warned of the consequences if I revealed my info and people were still voting Snake.

 

Snake is V/LA till sometime tomorrow, with the time not stated, so may not be back till after the day ends.

 

If I believe in something, I will stick my neck out and fight for it, even if it leads to my lynch or costing the town because I do honestly believe I am trying to do the right thing for the town here.

 

If you see that differently, then that is fine, but I can't please everyone.

 

SMS that wasn't a shot at you. I'm getting a big over defensive vibe off you at the moment.

 

I have already said I am feeling very defensive.

 

I feel I have put a lot of pressure on Snake and myself, so just hope that whatever decision we make is correct, as well as hoping I haven't pissed Snake off by revealing his role.

 

I have been online most of the day, so I will take a break and try and get back on later, if not I will be back online early in the morning and will switch my vote if necessary but would prefer it not to be on Snake.

 

Added post below as Ron added post whilst I was eating my tea and previewing my post:

 

Ron, Snake is not here to defend himself, so as someone who doesn't see anything suspicious in his game play and the guy who revealed his role, I at least feel like I owe it to him to let him get back online and defend himself.

 

He is V/LA till tomorrow, but it is unknown if he will be back before deadline, so we need to make sure we are sure before we risk losing a valuable role.

 

One last thing, because he has tried rephrasing things I have said, gone on about me being defensive a few times and now claiming a revealed bulletproof role is useless I have to do this.

 

FOS: Bristep 123

 

It is only useless because you know that you as scum won't be able to eliminate him unless we help you lynch him.

[Mike Castle]

MOD QUESTION IS GOON CONSIDERED TO BE A ROLE IN GAME?

All possible roles are the 15 that people could try and claim pre-game. Vanilla Town/Goon is not a role as such.

[Mike Castle]

Go look at Mikes first post in this game, you will see he has Teedy Kays name crossed out and Brownies added, but not for other players who have been replaced.

Fixed

[Lion_of_the_Midlands]

Of course its a role Mike. It is not a power role but it is still a role.

[Ron Simmons]

Right, my vote's currently on Snake, but I think we should lynch SMS tonight. Here are my reasons:

 

1. If he flips scum, that all but confirms Snake is scum alongside him, possibly in a bulletproof role.

 

2. If he isn't scum, that rules out the possibility that Snake is working with him. It also means Snake's bulletproof, a role I think is vital to the town if it is indeed a town role. Of course, it doesn't guarantee Snake's town, but it gives us more time to scrutinize him.

 

3. SMS says he's a rolecop. If that's true, it's not really a vital role to the town. However, it's a GREAT role for the scum to have. So if SMS is scum we cut off an invaluable role to them, but if he isn't we're not gonna lose anything hugely vital.

 

4. There's information revealed, whether SMS is scum or whether he isn't. We can progress using that information tomorrow.

 

I still suspect Lion, but Bristep's correct in saying there's little to be gained from lynching him just yet. If he is scum (and I believe he is) he can be lynched at a later stage. I'm also wary of several others (including swiftstrike) but not to the extent I think they're the best lynch for the day.

 

I realize I'm starting a late wagon here, and you may not agree with what I'm saying. That's why my vote's still on Snake for NOW. But I'm keen to change it, because if we actually do end up lynching a town bulletproof player we're lynching one person the scum CAN NOT get rid off. I can't subscribe to the view that he's essentially a vanilla player now - the scum can't do anything to get rid of him, and that's going to hamper them somewhat - IF he's town.

 

If he's scum then yes, a lynch is great. But I think it's one hell of a risk to take, to lynch him tonight. I think it HAS to be SMS that we lynch.

 

I'd be interested to hear your thoughts. If enough people agree and it seems a lynch is possible, I'll change my vote. I'm very keen to do so.

[Mafia Scum Scum]

You all know my role, which should still be useful, so I am not happy about lynching me.

 

I also don't think it is fair and right to lynch a powerful role like Snakes without speaking to him first.

 

I will put my vote on anyone else the majority goes for as I just want to help town with the lynch and not lose two important roles.

[Ron Simmons]

You all know my role, which should still be useful, so I am not happy about lynching me.

 

I also don't think it is fair and right to lynch a powerful role like Snakes without speaking to him first.

 

I will put my vote on anyone else the majority goes for as I just want to help town with the lynch and not lose two important roles.

So do the (potentially) bomb fearing scum. They could quite easily just pick you off tonight anyway if you're not one of them. Also, I don't really see why, as first pick, you would go for a rolecopping role unless you were scum. Cop is by far the most useful role to us, and I would have thought that if you were a town player you'd want to ensure that would wind up in our hands.

 

I think there's more to be gained from lynching SMS than there is Snake, or anyone else right now. We'll gain information whether you're town or scum, and if you actually are scum we've perhaps hit the jackpot. Rolecop AND bulletproof? Yes please, thank you very much.

[Mafia Scum Scum]

If I was scum, would I really give all this information away so easily?

 

Really?

 

Please give this some proper thought, because you will be left with what info I have already told you, as well as being another town member down.

 

This has been towns problem in the last few games, they won't think things through properly, then scum just wipe the floor with them.

 

If I was scum, what would I have to gain by claiming this role, as it is a role associated with scum isn't it?

 

Why would I reveal the bulletproof player to everyone and defend them if I was scum, because if I was I wouldn't be able to night kill him, so why am I not pushing for his lynch?

 

I know we are all heading towards the deadline fast, but lynching me or Snake is the wrong way to go on this day, so lets look at a case on somebody else and see how we would benefit from a result on them.

[Ron Simmons]

If I was scum, would I really give all this information away so easily?

 

Really?

 

Please give this some proper thought, because you will be left with what info I have already told you, as well as being another town member down.

 

This has been towns problem in the last few games, they won't think things through properly, then scum just wipe the floor with them.

 

If I was scum, what would I have to gain by claiming this role, as it is a role associated with scum isn't it?

 

Why would I reveal the bulletproof player to everyone and defend them if I was scum, because if I was I wouldn't be able to night kill him, so why am I not pushing for his lynch?

 

I know we are all heading towards the deadline fast, but lynching me or Snake is the wrong way to go on this day, so lets look at a case on somebody else and see how we would benefit from a result on them.

Well I would question right back to you why would you defend Snake so passionately if you were town? If you're town you know his role, not his allignment. So he very well could be scum as far as you know. I question your motivation, because if you genuinely are town I think it's pretty bizarre, what you're doing.