Keelan

- Who are the richest people in the world, and who controls the entire monetary system? Bankers.

 

- Who appears to make decisions on world policy, who we go to war with, and our laws and legislation? Government and in some historical cases Royalty.

 

- Who controls and manufactures our necessities, material possessions and media consumption? the Corporate world.

 

Is this serious or some kind of sarcasm Im not getting?

A simple observation. Obviously simplified, but would you disagree with it?

Maybe you should research the history of the mental health industry.

 

Just curious, what are your thoughts on the mental health industry?

Like all aspects of human well-being there's a lot of merit in it, good doctors and good researchers, but also like all aspects of the health industry there's quackery, money hungry drug companies looking to get everyone on dangerous psychotropic drugs and historically good old Nazi doctors and secret trials.

I find it ironic that a woman being given treatment by Freud's daughter hung herself in Freud's house after years of on and off Freudian treatment.

In general I think a lot of it is guess work, and doctors are far too quick to prescribe drugs. A pressured NHS giving those that need serious time and help only 30 mins every month doesn't help some people's situation.

I don't like the increasing trend in today's society of bringing back people's IQ as a means for taking away children. Reeks of Eugenics.

Keelan is an obvious mentalist and why any of you are rising to him is beyond me. He won't be on the UKFF for much longer anyway, unless padded cells have WiFi now.

Even so, they've managed to elect a black president who's the son of a Muslim. So they're doing alright.

And they're still stupidly believing in all that change they thought he'd bring lol

I'm just saying instead of carrying on the debate. Picking on a part of it and getting a discussion going, you simply dismissed it. You decided the ego stroke you both gave each other by agreeing was more pleasing that perhaps having your belief system given a bit of a shake.

 

There's no debate to be had. I consider all this stuff you're pushing to be childish, delusional nonsense. It's not about being a sheep, or closed minded, or having an ego (which is a hilarious accusation from a conspiracy theorist), I just see no worth in debating the specifics of your conspiracies, because it's all complete garbage. I've seen and read a ton of this kinda thing over the last fifteen years, and I fully know where and why I stand on the issue. If you think my world view is going to be shaken by the tired, hoary old stories about Bilderberg or global cartels or the FEMA coffins, you're mistaking me for a fucking idiot with such a slender grasp of reality it can only be seen through an electron microscope.

 

That's why I dismissed it. Where could the conversation go? You think it's right, I think it's utter shit. Neither of us will budge. My opinion about conspiracy theoriests as a whole is all there is to offer, and that's been posted.

Well then you seem to be falling for the most extreme anti-conspiracy theory rhetoric, mostly coming from other people like you that cherry pick soundbites from documentaries instead of actually looking for yourself.

"old stories about Bilderberg or global cartels or the FEMA coffins"

Ok so we'll start with Bilderberg. Do you deny this organization exists? I don't think you do. But if you did you'd be a liar.

We can go from there.

Woyzeck, you're right. Trying to have this conversation always reminds me of this Family Guy sketch:

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l693NzVcPyg

 

Right back at you.

I thought we were having a polite debate though. I guess "herd mentality" took over for you both.

 

Maybe you guys, with your open minds and free-thinking, should come up with another catchphrase to throw at people who get tired of one-sided debates about childish nonsense. That one's wicked stale.

I'm just saying instead of carrying on the debate. Picking on a part of it and getting a discussion going, you simply dismissed it. You decided the ego stroke you both gave each other by agreeing was more pleasing that perhaps having your belief system given a bit of a shake.

I've just read your article, Keelan.

 

I wouldn't even know where to begin with that apart from to suggest that you up your meds a little. What's really tragic is that underneath all the paranoia and bizarre leaps of logic you're clearly not a stupid guy. I think you've gone way down a rabbit hole and probably have no idea how to get out.

 

It's like you've swept up all the litter in a street and woven it all together into a coat and then persuaded yourself that the litter was DESIGNED to be clothing but only you were observant enough to notice. It's scary and a little unsettling.

 

The people you need to be talking to about this are your family and quite probably a shrink. I remember in that thread that Woyzeck quoted above we discussed the connections between conspiracy theory and mental breakdowns. I mentioned a guy I knew who'd got deep into this stuff and then suffered a breakdown and had to be sectioned. I'm afraid to say he's never really recovered and in fact recently has made the decision to finally move home permanently. I don't know which cam first but it certainly opened up my eyes - I'd previously dismissed this sort of thing as harmless.

I've never heard such sanctimonious ego driven drivel in my life.

"we discussed the connections between conspiracy theory and mental breakdowns"

Oh you did did you, ROFL.

And I feel for your poor friend, but that's like equating the recent pentagon shooter to the whole of the 9/11 truth movement. Some people are just prone to mental breakdowns.

Maybe you should research the history of the mental health industry.

Good grief.

Woyzeck, you're right. Trying to have this conversation always reminds me of this Family Guy sketch:

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l693NzVcPyg

Right back at you.

I thought we were having a polite debate though. I guess "herd mentality" took over for you both.

You don't get to be so smugly secure in arguments about who scored the winner in the 1988 FA Cup

Ah Football, one of man's great distractions. I like how the South African world cup resulted in the eviction and murder of several poor black shanti neighborhoods. And how it was a British construction firm that got the job to build the stadiums. And how it will be the rich slave drivers who own the hotels and big businesses that will get all the economic benefit from the events.

It's all just vague unsubstantiated guff though, isn't it? You're throwing out neat little phrases as a substitute for any real substance. "People like me" are simply people who've taken the time to read widely with an open mind, make our own judgements on things based on observable fact and logic.

 

That's exactly what I am accusing you of not doing.

 

I know, that's one of the things about you that sets off my warning systems.

 

In his first statement he clearly says "this is the first year of global governance with the establishment of the G20 in the middle of the financial crisis. The climate conference in Copenhagen is another step toward the global management of our planet."

 

What does that mean to you? To me it highlights the ideologies of many of our leaders, that they are pushing for a global structure. Having read world history extensively there is ample evidence to suggest this ideology has been on the table for hundreds of years. The economic crash was the result of a flawed banking system, put in place by the same people that have always been for globalization. Climate change is very suspect at the moment and is all about global solutions for this "global" problem. Whether you think it's sinister or not its plainly obvious where we are heading.

 

 

That's my point, that's how you perceive the conspiracy (to be a simple shadowy government), but a few years reading up on it and you'll realize that this isn't the case, and isn't how the conspiracy is laid out by the people that claim it's going on.

 

It's the history of the banking system, it's globalist ideologies, it's quazi-secret think tanks like the CFR trilateral commission, bilderberg group and club of rome. It's Jewish Zionism, it's corrupt big business, it's religion.

 

All of these things collectively push forward a new world order. They don't necessarily all work together. But basic human nature is about control.

 

I'll just say it again, what do people really think globalization is?

 

So what you're saying is that the basic human tendency towards creating social units is somehow worrying? You use the term "globalization" as if it's some sort of evil plan to enslave mankind. As a race we have continually evolved into larger and more stable socio-political frameworks as we outgrew the existing ones.

 

The caveman found that working with other cavemen meant they could catch larger prey.

 

Two local tribes joined forces to cooperatively defend against a larger invader.

 

Tribes became nations joined by common languages.

 

Nations joined together in treaties and pacts to encourage trade and defend common principles.

 

You say you're a student of history- what in all that do you find so worrying?

This is what it falls down to, a trust issue. Do you trust an eventual world body in governing the world? Because I don't

History was written by the winners, the winners were bankers, big business, politicians and in some historical cases royalty. Once you get a world system run by few people, you don't get out without serious bloodshed. Britain wasn't given a referendum on the Lisbon Treaty. I don't like that.

Let me pose a question, if a world system takes grip, and we are supposedly in world peace. Who then are the enemy? Anybody with dissenting views? I think that's the highly likely scenario. The world can work with simple treaties and trade agreements. There does not need to be a centralized hierarchy of control.

Now you may not see the general idea of globalization as a plot. Firstly that doesn't mean it's not going to be a dangerous system. Secondly I personally do think there is ample evidence of it being a plot.

- Who are the richest people in the world, and who controls the entire monetary system? Bankers.

- Who appears to make decisions on world policy, who we go to war with, and our laws and legislation? Government and in some historical cases Royalty.

- Who controls and manufactures our necessities, material possessions and media consumption? the Corporate world.

Then there can be no debate on who controls the world

It's all just vague unsubstantiated guff though, isn't it? You're throwing out neat little phrases as a substitute for any real substance. "People like me" are simply people who've taken the time to read widely with an open mind, make our own judgements on things based on observable fact and logic.

That's exactly what I am accusing you of not doing.

I like how conspiracy nuts have leapt on Van Rompuy as their latest "proof" of New World Order. His appointment highlights just how un-joined up the so-called World Government is, when even those countries within the EU are so divided and suspicious of each other that any serious candidate was vetoed to the extent of promoting a virtual nobody to a job which theoretically should be as prestigious as the President of the US. As a result, the EU lacks a really powerful and uniting figure to promote their interests on the global stage and have effectively fucked themselves. A pretty poor bit of realpolitik by the lizards.

In his first statement he clearly says "this is the first year of global governance with the establishment of the G20 in the middle of the financial crisis. The climate conference in Copenhagen is another step toward the global management of our planet."

What does that mean to you? To me it highlights the ideologies of many of our leaders, that they are pushing for a global structure. Having read world history extensively there is ample evidence to suggest this ideology has been on the table for hundreds of years. The economic crash was the result of a flawed banking system, put in place by the same people that have always been for globalization. Climate change is very suspect at the moment and is all about global solutions for this "global" problem. Whether you think it's sinister or not its plainly obvious where we are heading.

I've said this many times before, but it bears repeating. For all your claims that "people like me... simplify" things, in fact one of the reasons that some people find the idea of a shadowy global conspiracy so appealing is that it allows them to believe that someone is in charge, that there is some uniting force behind all the craziness you see around you. The reality of the world, that it's a crazy, complicated, illogical place that just messes along as best it can... that's too scary for some people to come to terms with.

That's my point, that's how you perceive the conspiracy (to be a simple shadowy government), but a few years reading up on it and you'll realize that this isn't the case, and isn't how the conspiracy is laid out by the people that claim it's going on.

It's the history of the banking system, it's globalist ideologies, it's quazi-secret think tanks like the CFR trilateral commission, bilderberg group and club of rome. It's Jewish Zionism, it's corrupt big business, it's religion.

All of these things collectively push forward a new world order. They don't necessarily all work together. But basic human nature is about control.

I'll just say it again, what do people really think globalization is?

a country like our own dominated by a 2 party system.

 

That's right - they've got the Republicans and Democrats, we've got The Tories and Labour and Lib Dems and UKIP and Greens and SNP and Plaid Cwymru and Respect and BNP and Ulster Unionists and Captain Rainbow's Abolish Government party. Exactly alike.

 

Don't you ever get tired of just spouting bollocks Duane? I love you as a fellow Bournemouthian, but seriously you do my head in.

 

As far as the original video... I wonder what it is about the American psyche that tends towards the extremes of political beliefs? As well as the religious right (the "fundies") you've got this conspiracy-theory driven left that seems to have grown up in opposition. They may be minorities but they are incredibly vocal and increasingly influential, both sides of the divide.

 

I think that it's to do with the fact that America is founded on the slightly contradictory principals of revolutionary political freedom and religious conservatism. The two have always been pulling in different directions and in this age of mass media and instant communication it's easier for like-minded hysterics to group together.

 

Of course there's not a giant global conspiracy. I think I've said before that conspiracy theorists never stop to think of the logistical nightmare of running a worldwide secret organisation. You're talking about politicians who struggle to control their parties and balance the budget, let alone secretly plan for alien invasion or whatever the vogue is this week. Gordon Brown has a wonky eye and can't control policy leaks from within his own cabinet - you think he could keep being a lizard or planning the London bombings secret? Give over.

 

The closest things we have to a secret government dedicated to taking over the world are the Catholic Church (tried, succeeded, lost grip on power) and the Scientologists (trying, jury still out) and neither of them has successfully kept their existence quiet.

No we have the LibLabCon and the BNP that are being used by the mainstream media to tar real issues like immigration and climate change scandals as some kind of crazy racist fringe way of thinking.

And what is exactly an extreme political belief? One that supports the constitution? Is Anti-War? Prefers to end a privately operated central bank like the Federal reserve that pretty much caused the economic collapse? Sounds like a pretty good belief to me and one I'd hold if I were American.

Conspiracy theory left? Most believers in the New World Order conspiracy are generally apolitical or at least Libertarian. That's why the call it the false left right paradigm.

And as I said in the other post it is people like you that simplify the conspiracy and then say its not logical to have a world wide conspiracy. It's very logical when you understand that there are mannnnnny different groups and factors that go in to it. Calling 9/11 and 7/7 an inside job again is far too simplistic. People who really do the research don't think the government just went "hey lets stage these attacks".

And the closest thing we have to a world government is, I dunno... the WORLD GOVERNMENT being declared by Herman Van Rompuy the new unelected president of Europe, member of the Jesuit order of Catholicism and who attended the secret Bilderberg group. Gordon Brown who seems to say New World Order every other week. You know "climate blah blah we need world tax, banking crash blah blah we need a world financial system"

Globalization is a world government.

I got up to part foyr before switching off, anybody beat me?

 

When the fuck did this chap turn into such a loony toon?

 

So because he dares question the official government story on such topics as 9/11, he is automatically a loon?

 

Brilliant.

That is the idea, let someone air their views then call them a loony for being different and questioning what we are told. I say sod that go against the grain and stand up and fight for what you believe in. That takes strength of character and I respect people such as Ventura for doing so.

Agreed.

When did everyone just start going along with the government?

Too busy playing XBox I guess.

I'm a regular listener of the AJ Show. I've been researching what he's been saying for a few years now and anyone who seriously thinks that they're not trying to set up a world government needs to look deeper. 9/11 was used entirely as a pretext for war and a reason to introduce the highly controversial Patriot Act which stripped everyone of their rights, similar to anti terror laws over here. It's all about problem, reaction, solution folks. Whilst people might not like Alex Jones, his message is true and he's fighting the good fight.

 

To the person above who said that he always blames Jews and Mexicans. You've got it totally wrong. That is not what he is saying. However he does say that the Bilderberg group are heavily responsible for what's going on. Before I get attacked from any on here who refuse to believe that most of what we've been told all of our lives is a lie please watch the following films......

 

Martial Law 9/11 - Rise of the police state

Terrorstorm - a history of government sponsored terror

Endgame - Blueprint for global enslavement

Fall of the Republic pt1 - The Presidency of Barack H. Obama

 

I don't know where to start so won't bother. Those films are designed to make money, right?

Another misconception. Alex is perhaps the only "conspiracy theorist" that puts his movies online for free. Anyone that buys them are just giving him a shout out.

He didn't just decide "oh today I'll make money talking about conspiracies". In fact he's not a UFO guy or anything like that. He simply started with a camera shouting out his local corrupt politicians.

I got up to part foyr before switching off, anybody beat me?

 

When the fuck did this chap turn into such a loony toon?

 

So because he dares question the official government story on such topics as 9/11, he is automatically a loon?

 

Brilliant.

 

No, but if he thinks a diabolical government conspiracy is behind such events as 9/11, he is automatically a loon. There are these evil cabals secretly controlling everything that happens on the planet, yet somehow they've let their fiendish plans fall into the hands of a million mouth-breathing, fuckwitted fantasists on Youtube. It's a load of cunts who fancy themselves vigilantes fighting against a tyrannical regime because their reality is too boring.

Just because you're oversimplifying it, doesn't mean those that believe in it are oversimplifying it. It's not as simple as a "secret cabal is behind everything!" They don't necessarily all meet in a back room somewhere lol

It's the combined affects of the banking system, powerful Zionism, quasi-secret think tanks like the CFR, Trilateral Commission, Bilderberg Group, wallstreet, big business.

What do you think globalization really is?

Alex Jones is just a fat racist. All his conspiracy stories always seem to conclude with Jews or Mexicans trying to destroy the glorious American sovereignty.

That's absolutely ridiculous, in fact most people that research this stuff often conclude that Alex Jones doesn't implicate the Israel lobby enough in regard to their influence over American foreign policy.

He does rag on Mexicans, but mainly because he sees immigration getting out of control, much like many do in the UK.