WhizzKid

Jonny Storm

Doug Williams Vrs Phil Powers - Premier Promotions at Weston-super-Mare

Doug Williams

Rob Brookside Vrs James Mason at Croydon in February

No... I slag off the bad and praise the good. It's not my fault that usually the bad outweighs the good on All Star shows, now is it?

Well, we've noted that you certainly don't. You slag off most things relating to All Star. It's especially sad when you don't even attend some shows and feel that you can comment then. You slagged off a bill at Bristol earlier in the season that you didn't attend from what I could tell which featured another 5 Star Vrs Whiplash match, had Brookside, Dynamite and Mason (three of the UK's best) and had an appearance from Kendo Nagasaki as advertised. You downplay things like attendances - there was easily 400 plus at Bristol last week and knock promoters that don't aim their product directly at you when promoters you are ultra keen on have done exactly the same thing but you don't mention it for some reason!? You slag off (and wish death on, which I find very sick) a wrestler who is still one of the best in the country based on hatred that I guess comes from a few comments he has made in the past. No offence to Frankie Sloane, but if you think he's a better wrestler than Robbie Brookside, I think you need to pay more attention to the shows you attend.

If anyone has a bias when reporting events it's you - witness your review of the Marty Jones match.

If I was as biased as everybody who's an idiot says I am, then I'd have come on here shitting over every match except the main event (and I might have even shat on that, if you listen to Whizzer, who coincidentally knows what I look like but doesn't come over to say hello despite being damned rude online).

Perhaps we caught you in a good mood! Usually you slag off plenty which is very good on All Star shows. Oh yeah, still confused as to how you think I know what you look like and the only times I've been mildly critical of you is when you've been offensively rude to me and others.

Another strong card last night at Bristol.Skull Vrs Sinner - entertaining with Murphy dishing out the usual stiff looking offenceMarty & Spiderman Vrs Torres & Streefighter - Looked like Jonny under the hood. Crowd were into it with Marty getting a very good ovation. Excellent speech from Marty - one of the great workers and talkers ever in British wrestling and to see him get the ovation he got was something special.5 Star Vrs Whiplash: These two have had an excellent series of matches this year at the Colston Hall and are as good as any of the newer young stars on the circuit. The working a full time schedule has certainly helped put the finishing touches on them as wrestling performers.Sloane Vrs Powers Vrs Adonis: Powers was very impressive in this one. Never taken to Sloane at all but he put some effort in last night.Jonny Vrs Doug: Excellent match as you'd excpect from these two. Another excellent UK match of the year candidate from All Star. A nice touch with confetti coming down from the ceiling at the end to round off a great evening of wrestling entertainment, if a little sad because one of the true historic UK wrestling venues closes it's doors on wrestling but I, and many other fans, have so many great memories of shows there but wrestling will certainly carry on in Bristol and surrounding areas in 2004.

Well I could have sworn that Majik's Midlands Pro Wrestling group has enjoyed steadily increasing attendances, as well as the two Scottish feds. And UCW (Wilts) drew a full house of 250 a few months ago (more on that in a second). And FWA Northern Exposure houses were up from northern Breakout Tour attendances... Newport went from 350 paid and fifty comps to 440 paid, ten comps... Broxbourne's held steady, Portsmouth's pretty much the same as it's always been for the Academy shows unless Sloan wants to correct me (plus they're running more), and WZW seem to be on the up, too, although I know very little about them except their posters look quite nice.

So, as always attendances are up and down for all promoters. As for Newport, glad to hear the FWA are doing so well (although really not a whole world different to the Bristol attendances) but I'm sure if they tried to run every 3 or 4 weeks there I'm sure it would be difficult. As has been stated before, the movement to a new venue has nothing to do with attendances. If that was the case, they wouldn't continue to run in the city would they?

As far as I can see, the arse is dropping out of these people's products: The tribute guys like Oric and Klondyke Jake, All Star, and Premier. I'm basing this on there being very little news of actual tribute shows nowadays - Cwmbran used to have one every couple of months, then they came to Newport and got closed down by Trading Standards. There's very little moaning about total tribute shows on boards any more, which is a good thing.

As has been said earlier attendances are mixed for all promoters at the moment and the FWA not running anywhere at the moment (turn a blind eye to that I notice Moj) shows that the arse could indeed be dropping out of the British wrestling industry sadly. It's a shame because the guys that you mention, especially All Star and Premier, who put on a great show and even Jake and Orig have had moments. It's just that entertainments come in and out of fashion as has pro wrestling many times and in time you'll find out that for yourself. Wrestling survived in this country at times thanks to those venues and promoters that you continue to slag off and I just hope that the promotion you support isn't as cocky to the fact that we are heading for a down period at the moment as you. It may need loyal fans and a lot of hard work from promoters, wrestlers and supporters alike to keep the business alive and well as a live entertainment in this country.

AmDrag, in particular, was advertised on being at Bristol at least twice on his FIRST tour, yet did not show.As we discussed at the time, Dragon was billed just the once at Bristol and his arrival was delayed. He was advertised on a poster (against P N) and was scheduled to arrive but when it was confirmed he wouldn't be here for the show, he wasn't advertaised in the press ads I recall. You and Moj went on that he was billed twice and started believing it yourselves it seems. It shows that you guys don't pay attention, and certainly not to detail, as much as you claim. Oh yeah, and Doug Williams even turned up on that show and wasn't billed on the poster or in the press. You can't get any better addition than that!Sylk Wagner Brown & April Hunter. Their pictures were seen on at least 1 Bristol poster, but they never showed when they were on tourSlyk and April have never been announced as appearing at Bristol, although their picture appears on a number of general posters. The only local (to you and I) shows they have been announced as appearing on are Swindon and Gloucester earlier in the year and they appeared on both.It's also well known why P N wasn't at the Bristol show. Legit 'no shows' which you are going to get more often from a promotion that puts on so many shows, than one that puts on just a handful of shows. Simple maths, although I know from the crowd size estimates you come out with isn't one of your strongest points.

See, I was referring to the stuff I quoted from him, which is why I quoted it. You know, the stuff that summarises why All Star attendance is down, which coincidentally is the stuff that Dixon doesn't seem to grasp.

It's only the thoughts of yourself, Bagga and a couple of others on why attendances for All Star shows are down. Different types of fan enjoy different things and where as the general internet audience are easy and simple to provide for, a touring promotion aiming their product for a wider audience has to put on a wider variety of wrestling for the punter. As has been mentioned audiences in general are down because wrestling is going through one of those down periods. I have nothing against the FWA but know you are a fan, so please tell us why a product that you claim is so much better than the other UK promoters is feeling the pinch too?? Yes, the Bristol, Croydon and Hanley audiences are down but still decent sized crowds and other recent All Star shows have drawn crowds as good as ever. If it's not just the down turn in the popularity of wrestling, why do you think attendences at Broxbourne and Bethnal Green are down on what they were? The thing that people get so annoyed about, is that you and a couple of others slag off All Star for things (that in most cases I don't really see as a problem whether All Star, FWA or whoever do it but it upsets you) and then others can prove that the FWA and others do exactly the same but you tend to not mention it or are not upset about it when that happens - think it's called being two faced. I guess when you're successful like Brian Dixon, you're going to get knocked by certain people. The shows I have seen this year from the group were very strong, they've given some good young wrestlers a place to work and learn more about their trade, they had one of the top talents outside of the UK, American Dragon, working for them for six months, they had classics like Dragon Vrs Storm, Doug Vrs Storm, Mason Vrs Brookside, P N Vrs Brookside, Swift Vrs Dynamite, etc, etc (as good as anything I've seen in the UK) and given so many wrestlers a place to work and make their living. So many positives this year and another great year ahead in 2004 by the looks of things.

So, a tribute, lots of stalling, and I assume a decent match if you cut all the bullshit out, yes? That's fair enough (although the tribute thing is dodgy) if it's only one match on a card, but routinely at Colston, out of a four match card, three of them will follow that pattern.

Performance is part of the wrestling and what you call stalling is what most people call working a crowd. Don't FWA have loads of microphone work there matches, it's no different to that. As for tributes - you must spend most of the time in the bar at the Colst because Spidermask is the only tribute we have had in the past year. The odd tribute is part of a varied show. Not my cup of tea but the again neither are wrestlers who base their matches around jumping off a balcony.

When have the FWA advertised a dead wrestler as appearing on their shows? Or used a tribute? Or had the ring announcer say 'At the next show, these people WILL DEFINITELY be appearing', and then not let anybody know that the people aren't working the show until they're all in the building? Or sold fake WWE merchandise on their merchandise tables?

All Star never advertised a dead wrestler as has been discussed so many times before. FWA have advertised wrestlers who have no showed or cancelled and Corino suggested that he never agreed to appearing at one of their shows. No the FWA don't sell fake WWE merchandise but there's plenty of stalls selling various bootleg tapes from what I've seen.Some people are interested in the UK scene, so I just put up info on their shows that I hear about. You seem to have problems or too much time on your hands.

No we don't... as far as I know, we quote from either the posters, what you post on this forum, and what the ring announcer announced at the previous show. Seph might even phone the box office... Most of the time, they're three seperate cards, and then you get a fourth on the night.

Well, often you don't pay attention. You say things were billed or announced when they weren't and say people no showed more times than they did. I guess that you just don't pay attention but it looks as if you're lying. Granted some people no show or can't make the show but there are few wrestlers with name value in the UK, so as long as the show is good, which it is, that's all that matters.As for the stuff about Newport shows, from what I hear the crowds weren't any bigger than Bristol gets every three or four weeks. As for you saying how great the Newport audience are - please! I'm not into that we're better than you stuff. I'm sure that the Newport shows were good but so are the other shows produced around the country by other promoters. We have a wealth of talent working so hard around the country and promoters putting on strong shows at all of the venues. The fact that you don't appreciate them is so sad and tiresome. Just stick to your FWA fanclub, watch your FWA videos and wait for the FWA to return to Newport, while the remainder of us go out and enjoy a wider variety of wrestling available in this country.

The other thing I would point out, because a fan of the FWA is critical of other promotions, maybe blindly critical in some cases, why do you same guys feel the need to slag of the FWA itself? Its very hypocitial to be honest.

People tend to not slag off the FWA, just point out the things that the odd FWA fan might be critical about one promotion can be found everywhere including on an FWA show. If you tend to follow these threads, it usually starts with me giving some news about a show in the UK that isn't promoted by one of you guys and Moj just comed on and slags it off. The truth is that a lot of people go to shows for the wrestling product and find that there are many great promoters out there whose product is every bit as strong as the FWA and can see how "blind" as you put it some people are.As for Moj, you constantly complain that the bill isn't as advertised but half the time you, and Seph, quote things that weren't billed anyway. You go to most 'house shows' in the world these days and you're not sure what the card is. You didn't know what most of the card was the last time the FWA went to Newport I recall. You always get a good show and that's why there are so many regulars who never miss a show. Even to someone like you, the fact that the likes of Doug Williams, Jonny Storm, James Mason, Marty Jannetty, Flash Barker, Jody Fleisch, etc have all appeared on Colston Hall shows over the last couple of seasons when they weren't even billed seems point towards the best talent available in the country constantly being used on these shows. The fact that a great wrestler suddenly doesn't become so great when they are appearing for All Star tells us more about your sad tiresome bias than anything else. You can't seem to cope with any promotion that deals with wrestling matches as opposed to making everything just a version of televison wrestling.

Not advertising dead people... as far as I know that's always been the preserve of Dixon. And tributes? Yes, other people do use them, like Oric, but that doesn't make them right...

As has been discussed before no dead wrestler has been advertised. Just a picture of a wrestler who appeared on a previous tour along with all the other wrestlers who appeared on the previous tour. Dixon uses the odd tribute and we've discussed this before that this is not a bad thing when used moderately they are an acceptable addition to a card. We've also pointed out that your beloved FWA even use 'em in everything but name.

Hahaha. Try 100 to 250...

I've actually had a count of audiences this season because I know this one would come up and they've never been anywhere near 100. Always 250 or more. It's funny because you used to come on here and quote 200 people when the crowds were much bigger than they've been this season. It's another example of you down playing another promoter's success.

They don't put on a good show month after month. That's why they're in trouble and vacating big halls for small ones. That's the whole point.

If you know what you're talking about (which you obviously don't), wrestling moving out of the Colston Hall has nothing to do with the promoter. I, and most fans, know the shows are good hence you get an audience of 250 plus turning up every 3 weeks. Just because you don't like it - not enough balcony jumps for you I guess - just shows that you just want a tv product rather than an actual wrestling one.

Broxbourne has a capacity of 350 or so. Broxbourne FWA shows draw 300-350+.

As has been said earlier the Colston Hall audiences NOW, when wrestling as a live product is at a low and All Star are still drawing 250 crowds every few weeks. Broxbourne is a 350 seater is it, well I've heard that recent shows have had a fair few empty seats, so attendences are roughly the same. It's sad but true. Surely if you can blame the dropping attendance figures for All Star on their product, you'll have to do the same for every UK promotion right now.

So wrestling is less popular now in the UK than in 1995?

As has been pointed out earlier, I think it is less popular as a live entertainment. Entertainment has come on so much over the past 8 years. We have so much choice now for entertainment that a wrestling show at your local hall is likely to be less of a draw to the casual fan (which is the main wrestling audience) than it was as little as 8 years ago.

You can harass me for being picky about the little details, but the little details MATTER to people who pay money and expect a certain match after weeks of anticipation. Dixon is *extremely* lazy and shoddy with keeping the fans up to the news.

What amuses me is that you and Moj can pick holes in All Star shows but you can do the same to any promotion if you feel the need. Anything levelled at All Star can be levelled at most other promotions. It amazes me that in your words you are "picky about small details" when you are often wrong abou small details yourself. Doug Williams Vrs Rob Brookside was never billed for the last Bristol show, it was the Brookside Vrs P N, so when you feel that small detail is so important and don't even know the details yourself (a bit like saying Pete Collins has never retired before) it shows that these details you are so picky about matter not. All Star put on a good show month after month and that's what a good wrestling fan wants.As for moving to a new venue - read the local press Seph. The council say wrestling isn't a part of the entertainment they want at the Colston Hall and the lack of support the venue has given wrestling by not putting up publicity material, not including it on venue publicity suggests that they have tried to kill off wrestling at the venue over the past couple of years. That together with ticket prices being put up and the apparent down period in wrestling at the moment explains why 200 to 300 fans turn up at the Colston Hall now as opposed to double that in the recent past. Still that's a very good figure for a wrestling venue to get each month and despite what you say, the FWA get a similar figure at there Broxbourne shows these days. It's very sad that wrestling is ending at the Colston Hall. It was the first place I saw live wrestling and have been a regular since an early age. The standard of wrestling has always been high and even now, with no support from the venue, it outdraws most shows in this country. The fans are loyal and passionate and having travelled to a lot of UK venues, the Colston Hall has one of the great crowd atmospheres with people really into the action.

Translation:I'll slag off anything on this forum that has something to do with All Star Promotions 'cause I'm a sad git.

Translation:Colston Hall has a couple of thousand seats in it. All Star draws about 150 every month. So now they're moving to a dodgy leisure centre somewhere.We're advertising Doug Williams V Jonny Storm, but it probably won't happen. Please come!Also: Marty Jones is wrestling! We can't get away with calling it a retirement match any more, as he's had several million of them, so we'll go 'It might be his last match!' in order to entice some suckers through the door...

Translation:I'll slag off anything on this forum that has something to do with All Star Promotions 'cause I'm a sad git. Can't appreciate any wrestling in this country unless Alex Shane tells me it's good. Please list all of Marty Jones' "several million" retirement matches. He's never retired or mentioned it until now. Once again you don't know what you're talking about Moj.

After a run of 50 years, the Colston Hall in Bristol will have it's final ever wrestling show next week. The long running venue has always been one of the top UK venues and has had regular wrestling seasons for decades with bi-weekly shows taking palce up until the early 90's. Shows have continued even thoughout the low period of live wrestling in the UK during the mid 90's when the Colston Hall was one of the only regular venues to run wrestling shows. Just about every British and visiting international wrestler has appeared at the venue and over the years the venue has hosted some of the top feuds and matches seen on UK soil. Colston Hall management have decided to end their relationship with pro wrestling, even though live wrestling will continue in the city from eraly next year.The final show at the Colston Hall on Thursday 18th December 2003 (7-45 pm start) will be headlined by a clash of two of the UK's top stars with the All Star Promotin's People's title on the line. 'The Anarchist' Doug Williams will put his title on the line against the hugely popular Jonny Storm in what is likely to be an excellent finale for wrestling at the venue.Also, making a special appearance will be 'Main Man' Marty Jones, who has appeared at the venue more than any other wrestler. The outspoken star from Oldham is scheduled to appear in tag action in what very well could be his final match. Others scheduled to appear include 'Industructable' Skull Murphy, 'Brooklyn Brawler' Julio Torres, 'Wildman' Whiplash, etc etc.

Name: Chad MayneWebsite: NAEmail : chadr_mayne@yahoo.comType of videos: US indy tapes and European wrestling (e-mail me for list) in addition to rare humour and other merchandise.Approx. delivery time: up to 7 daysTrades Taken?: Yes