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The Jorge Masvidal Discussion Thread

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Is there anything you particularly take umbrage with in what he said? I listened to the full interview and reading it in text I can't really fault what he says. He has his views, he expressed why he has those views, why hate on him for that? I don't agree with all his views but he expressed them in a way that made me see his side of the argument. He also kept his cool despite his so called friend Dan Le Batard constantly berating him for his political beliefs .

 

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11 hours ago, Zebra Kid Mark said:

Is there anything you particularly take umbrage with in what he said? I listened to the full interview and reading it in text I can't really fault what he says. He has his views, he expressed why he has those views, why hate on him for that? I don't agree with all his views but he expressed them in a way that made me see his side of the argument. He also kept his cool despite his so called friend Dan Le Batard constantly berating him for his political beliefs .

Take umbrage with? No, because he's a fighter, not a politician. I didn't really expect him to be an enlightened, engaging source of societal discussion, so I'm neither here nor there on what he said. 

As I've said to @Carbomb often enough, if I only cheered for or even watched fighters I agree with politically I'd be watching maybe three UFC cards a year!

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Expressing yourself well doesn't make reprehensible political views any less reprehensible, anyway. There have been plenty of white supremacists, racists, Nazis, fascists, Stalinists, and all range of horrendous cunts who expressed themselves with a perfect semblance of reasonability, affability, calmness, and even warmth. Masvidal's views, like Trump's, are ignorant, dishonest (or at least completely discrepant with what Trump is actually saying and doing), and support policies that harm ordinary and vulnerable people, not help them. He could talk like Tony Hart dressed as Santa Claus, and finish them all off with a big "Ho ho ho", and it wouldn't make a lick of difference. They're still shit views. He's free to express them, and I'm free to think he's a cunt.

Either way, like @David has said, if I only watched fighters I thought were decent politically, I'd almost never watch, and I don't tune into MMA to get the latest hot takes on political policy from the Octagon. I've learned to channel my distaste - I can watch Till, Covington and Masvidal, because it'll be satisfying seeing them get beaten. Usman breaking Covington's jaw was a thing of beauty.

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On 7/22/2020 at 2:31 PM, SBD said:

I know Masvidal said he only wants Usman outside of that surely the biggest fight would be Nurmagomedov if he returns 

im still surprised at Masvidals attitude post-Usman, i did think he'd be looking at the the remainder of his career to be capitalise on his name and look for the biggest fights but he was very much of the attitude that he'd got his money where he needs it to be and the focus is the belt.

Personally the chance of McGregor/Masvidal, Masvidal/Diaz II fights are too good to pass up, both stylistically for everyone involved and from an excitement standpoint.

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It's possible that, having had just a taste of the potential chance to win a belt, he's got himself a new fix. Either that, or he's at the point where he'll only take fights with a significant outcome, i.e. big money and/or titles.

Edited by Carbomb

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3 hours ago, Carbomb said:

Expressing yourself well doesn't make reprehensible political views any less reprehensible, anyway. There have been plenty of white supremacists, racists, Nazis, fascists, Stalinists, and all range of horrendous cunts who expressed themselves with a perfect semblance of reasonability, affability, calmness, and even warmth. Masvidal's views, like Trump's, are ignorant, dishonest (or at least completely discrepant with what Trump is actually saying and doing), and support policies that harm ordinary and vulnerable people, not help them. He could talk like Tony Hart dressed as Santa Claus, and finish them all off with a big "Ho ho ho", and it wouldn't make a lick of difference. They're still shit views. He's free to express them, and I'm free to think he's a cunt.

Either way, like @David has said, if I only watched fighters I thought were decent politically, I'd almost never watch, and I don't tune into MMA to get the latest hot takes on political policy from the Octagon. I've learned to channel my distaste - I can watch Till, Covington and Masvidal, because it'll be satisfying seeing them get beaten. Usman breaking Covington's jaw was a thing of beauty.

Which view in particular of Masvidal's do you deem reprehensible? What policy did he reference that harms ordinary people and how? Lumping him in the same group as nazis, fascists and white supremacists is a little bit steep.

In regards to where he goes next, I don't quite buy into it that he wants an immediate rematch, I think as soon as the Conor and Nate rematch gets floated in front of him I think he will snap up the opportunity.

Besides, hasn't Dana confirmed that Gilbert will definitely get the next shot at Usman or did I imagine that?

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1 hour ago, Zebra Kid Mark said:

Which view in particular of Masvidal's do you deem reprehensible? What policy did he reference that harms ordinary people and how? Lumping him in the same group as nazis, fascists and white supremacists is a little bit steep.

 

Like with everything to do with this sort of thing, it's not just what he's saying, it's what he's not saying, between the lines, that is the problem. I'm fairly sure you know this.

His defence and support of Trump is the view that is reprehensible, because what he's saying is directly at odds with what Trump is actually doing and saying, e.g. the treatment of refugees by sticking them in concentration camps and treating them like caged animals, the arrest of citizens using DHS officers and hauling them off in unmarked vans, or the poo-pooing of Covid as a threat, or rolling back universal healthcare, or enabling the police to continue to kill unarmed black men - which of these policies don't hurt ordinary people? To just say "Well, some things need to change, but I'm not a politician so I don't know" is just fucking dishonest - people are literally dying because of these policies; knowing enough to talk about how great Trump is for his policies that Masvidal voted for, but not enough to say how the worst policies should change is a fucking cop-out.

Do I really need to list all the shitty things Trump and the GOP's done and said? Anyone defending that is shit: you support Trump, you're supporting everything I've listed above and more. You don't get to pick and choose.

Plus that thing about the cities - that's sheer, unbridled dishonesty. "Trump didn't do that." Fucking bullshit. He's spent the past four years inflaming racial tensions with his speeches, tweets, and endorsements, and yet because he didn't enact any direct policies, he "didn't do that"? 

And no, it isn't steep as far as I'm concerned. Firstly, white supremacists do actively support Trump, meaning that Masvidal is, in real terms, the same camp as they are. There's no place on the American ballot slip that says "I'm voting for Trump, but not for the same reasons that the KKK have."

Secondly, Nazis, fascists, and white supremacists got into power because of people like Masvidal downplaying their worst excesses, allowing them to worm their way in. They didn't just start off by executing minorities from the get-go, they did it gradually and in stages, little by little, building their power base, building tensions, getting their people in place, and anyone with even the smallest understanding of history will know exactly where this is headed. This isn't some revelation, we've seen all this before, happening in the exact same way. They start by inflaming people's fears of minorities, immigrants, and foreigners, talk about "putting their country first", engage in jingoistic discourse, and then, whenever anybody points this out, they rely on people who think they're "moderate" and "balanced" to mock and downplay their cuntery by saying "oh, don't be so paranoid, it couldn't possibly be the same as what the Nazis did, no way could that happen again".

Quite frankly, anyone who could look at America right now, and say that Trump hasn't done anything bad is a liar or a fool.

 

EDIT: BTW what is your specific purpose in asking me these questions? Is it to try and persuade me not to think Masvidal is a cunt, or to not think Trump is an execrable piece of shit? Because that isn't going to happen.

Edited by Carbomb

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36 minutes ago, Carbomb said:
 

 

Secondly, Nazis, fascists, and white supremacists got into power because of people like Masvidal

ūüėź

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3 hours ago, Carbomb said:
EDIT: BTW what is your specific purpose in asking me these questions? Is it to try and persuade me not to think Masvidal is a cunt, or to not think Trump is an execrable piece of shit? Because that isn't going to happen.

I was more wondering what in particular did Masvidal say that you hated but from reading your reply it's more in what he didn't say.

I just don't like the view you have that "If you support Trump then that makes you a bad person."

I hate Boris Johnson with a passion, I think he ruined our country pushing for Brexit and I will never forgive him for that and I think he's ruining our country as PM now. However I am surrounded by friends/colleagues who have fallen for his faux charm and actually like him, I wouldn't dream of calling them cunts though. They don't support all the bad shit he does, they ignorantly support him due to his charming demener and they believe his rhetoric. I can't hate on them for being gullible and ignorant, there's far greater evils in the world to spend my energy on.

It's the same for Masvidal in my view, he likes the good that Trump has done and he ignores the bad because it seems he doesn't quite believe the narrative put out in the media. To criticise him for that though is one thing but to label him the same as a nazi and say it's people like him that got Hitler into power shows that we're not on the same wave length on this matter and we never will be. 

I'm not as clued up on American politics as you are and I don't have the knowledge on all of Trumps policies that have made him the devil in your eyes so I can't really dissect your post.

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1 hour ago, Zebra Kid Mark said:

I was more wondering what in particular did Masvidal say that you hated but from reading your reply it's more in what he didn't say.

I just don't like the view you have that "If you support Trump then that makes you a bad person."

I hate Boris Johnson with a passion, I think he ruined our country pushing for Brexit and I will never forgive him for that and I think he's ruining our country as PM now. However I am surrounded by friends/colleagues who have fallen for his faux charm and actually like him, I wouldn't dream of calling them cunts though. They don't support all the bad shit he does, they ignorantly support him due to his charming demener and they believe his rhetoric. I can't hate on them for being gullible and ignorant, there's far greater evils in the world to spend my energy on.

It's the same for Masvidal in my view, he likes the good that Trump has done and he ignores the bad because it seems he doesn't quite believe the narrative put out in the media. To criticise him for that though is one thing but to label him the same as a nazi and say it's people like him that got Hitler into power shows that we're not on the same wave length on this matter and we never will be. 

I'm not as clued up on American politics as you are and I don't have the knowledge on all of Trumps policies that have made him the devil in your eyes so I can't really dissect your post.

Eh, it is what it is. I have a different perspective for certain reasons. I despise Johnson, but even I don't think he's as awful as Trump. But I'm not going to try to convince you, especially not in the MMA section of a wrestling forum.

1 minute ago, neil said:

Whats all this politics shite doing in the MMA forum?

It's all Masvidal's fault. The cunt.

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3 hours ago, Carbomb said:

Seriously?

its just absolutely the last sentence i would have expected to read when clicking onto a forum thread to discuss the MMA career of Jorge Masvidal is all.

Edited by Egg Shen

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His rise has been fascinating, he's exactly what the UFC needed while Conor has settled into retirement. The whole "gangster" image isn't really a new thing he's done, he's always acted that way (the back and forth with Bisping etc) the Scarface stuff is pretty cool IMO, I can see why people think it's cringe, but screw it, it's an iconic movie and something he can lean into. 

That Askren KO is only something a true pro could conjure up, easy to say it's a fluke, but it came from time spent watching tape and studying Askrens movements, it really is the most fascinating KO of all time for me. I suppose it did help that the first time I saw it, I was half cut in a bar in Budapest. 

Not going to say I've always been a big fan of the guy, didn't even realize that he didn't fight during 2018, but I'm a big fan of his after this last 18 months of work he's put in (bandwagon fan etc etc)

Politics I'll stay out of. 

If people have the time, defo check out his Diary Of a Street Fighter series on YouTube, him and his team were putting out some brilliant content pre Diaz at MSG for the BMF belt. 

 

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32 minutes ago, Egg Shen said:

its just absolutely the last sentence i would have expected to read when clicking onto a forum thread to discuss the MMA career of Jorge Masvidal is all.

It would be when you don't quote the whole sentence.

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