Factotum Posted November 25, 2019 Share Posted November 25, 2019 The Lib Dems really just needed to not be shit in this campaign. I know the Tory campaign has been pretty awful, but the Lib Dems one is rights up there Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members Lion_of_the_Midlands Posted November 25, 2019 Paid Members Share Posted November 25, 2019 In not at all surprising news Tory candidate for Lincoln Karl McCartney is facing pressure from Hope Not Hate for retweeting Tommy Robinson and other islamophobic tweets. I'm sure he will be claiming it wasnt him like the time he retweeted the professional dominatrix. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members JNLister Posted November 25, 2019 Paid Members Share Posted November 25, 2019 Two minutes long and every second is worth it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members Chunk Posted November 25, 2019 Paid Members Share Posted November 25, 2019 5 hours ago, Factotum said: I know the Tory campaign has been pretty awful, but the Lib Dems one is rights up there That's my impression too. Corbyn refusing to state his Brexit position in the ITV debate aside, Labour seem to have done everything right. The Tories have had one fuck up after another. And yet the polls show the Tories gaining all the time. I just can't reconcile these two things in my head. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Factotum Posted November 26, 2019 Share Posted November 26, 2019 Quote That's my impression too. Corbyn refusing to state his Brexit position in the ITV debate aside, Labour seem to have done everything right. The Tories have had one fuck up after another. And yet the polls show the Tories gaining all the time. I just can't reconcile these two things in my head. I think the biggest issue is Corbyn and Brexit. A large swathe of people just either do not like him, think he's a raving communist or are let down by him on Brexit. Alternatively you have the people who view him as Unpatriotic, anti British (pro-IRA, Anti Monarchy) or someone who won't get Brexit done. Big Business don't want him as they feel he's anti the city and you also have the former Working Class now Middle Class who think that his tax policy will take all their money and why should they help anyone? The manifesto is really positive, it has popular policies which play well with people BUT they just wont vote for him. People don't even like Johnson. Infact its hard to think of two more unpopular candidates, but at the end of the day they'll vote Tory over Labour because of the man in charge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members Dead Mike Posted November 26, 2019 Paid Members Share Posted November 26, 2019 12 hours ago, Chunk said: That's my impression too. Corbyn refusing to state his Brexit position in the ITV debate aside, Labour seem to have done everything right. The Tories have had one fuck up after another. And yet the polls show the Tories gaining all the time. I just can't reconcile these two things in my head. You're underestimating how toxic the Labour front bench are to the majority of people. Maybe not your friends & family but most people don't agree with you, as demonstrated by the polls* Â Â *yeah but who believes them anyway etc etc etc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members quote the raven Posted November 26, 2019 Paid Members Share Posted November 26, 2019 Just got done watching Andrew Neils brutal interview with Sturgeon. Cant wait to see how the others get on i expect badly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loki Posted November 26, 2019 Share Posted November 26, 2019 I'm pretty confident the polls don't mean anything at this stage, they are varying so wildly.  But even so... I think it mainly comes down to personalities, as ever.  The great British public think Johnson is funny, and a bit of a mad lad, and so they'll vote for him.  Corbyn has been effectively portrayed as the second coming of Stalin, so they won't. Universal suffrage was a mistake It's been interesting that the Tories have hidden Rees-Mogg in a cupboard for the election campaign, he's clearly toxic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members tiger_rick Posted November 26, 2019 Paid Members Share Posted November 26, 2019 (edited) 50 minutes ago, Dead Mike said: You're underestimating how toxic the Labour front bench are to the majority of people. Maybe not your friends & family but most people don't agree with you, as demonstrated by the polls* Â Â *yeah but who believes them anyway etc etc etc It's utterly frustrating but it's true. Nicky Morgan trying to defend their "50,000 new nurses" pledge on Piers Morgan's breakfast thing is getting a lot of play at the moment (The jist being that 50,000 "new nurses" figure includes retaining 19,000 existing nurses). You can imagine the reaction if it was Diane Abbott in that position but it's all just a giggle when it's Morgan. Edited November 26, 2019 by tiger_rick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members Dead Mike Posted November 26, 2019 Paid Members Share Posted November 26, 2019 18 minutes ago, tiger_rick said: It's utterly frustrating but it's true. Nicky Morgan trying to defend their "50,000 new nurses" pledge on Piers Morgan's breakfast thing is getting a lot of play at the moment (The jist being that 50,000 "new nurses" figure includes retaining 19,000 existing nurses). You can imagine the reaction if it was Diane Abbott in that position but it's all just a giggle when it's Morgan. The frustrating thing is that this isn't new news. Everyone's known since Labour lost the last election that the public found them appalling & what changes have been made? Head in the sand, echo chamber bollocks. Every time I see a social media post with someone asking 'How are the Tories still ahead in the polls?' it simply demonstrates how detached from the public mood they are. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Factotum Posted November 26, 2019 Share Posted November 26, 2019 Quote the great British public think Johnson is funny, and a bit of a mad lad I don't actually think this is the case anymore. Even Tories are really uncomfortable with him but the difference with the right is they are win at all cost, while the left in this country eat each other. A lot of people are voting Tory/Brexit Party because they want Brexit through. Johnson is the only party leader promising to do that. The biggest thing with this election is to stop Johnson getting a majority. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rey_Piste Posted November 26, 2019 Share Posted November 26, 2019 After listening to Radio 2 for a bit this morning the only political story has been about the Labour party being branded as antisemitic. If it was another party being branded as anti-Islamic then that would actually be seen as a positive to certain groups of people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hallicks Posted November 26, 2019 Share Posted November 26, 2019 1 hour ago, Dead Mike said: The frustrating thing is that this isn't new news. Everyone's known since Labour lost the last election that the public found them appalling & what changes have been made? Head in the sand, echo chamber bollocks. Every time I see a social media post with someone asking 'How are the Tories still ahead in the polls?' it simply demonstrates how detached from the public mood they are. I'm not sure you're addressing the point here, which is that Diane Abbott suffers from institutional racism at every turn, and Nicky Morgan doesn't. Hence why Abbott's mistake from over 2 years ago is still top of mind but Morgan's dumbfuckery will be forgotten soon enough. To address @Factotum's point about the right being organised. This is true, as shown by the Brexit Party standing aside for the tories. That's what's shoring up the tories vote and it's going to be hard to shift them. I'm not sure about the left eating each other. You have the labour right constantly trying to shit things up for Corbyn et al. That isn't the left eating itself, it's the left being undermined by people who are supposed to be broadly under the same umbrella. The Lib Dems aren't leftist, their current economic position is permanent austerity forever (about as right wing as the tories). Throw in some genius ideas like "help to rent" (because what the economy needs is more consumer debt and more private landlords). They're already positioning themselves as coalition partners for Johnson, though at least Swinson's hopelessness on Question Time has exposed her shitarsery to a wider audience. I know we always end up talking about the same thing here, about the role of the media, etc etc. Labour is in a position of trying to win an election from a position of good faith with constructive policies, whilst being attacked on every side by people using every argument under the sun in very bad faith. The "answer" to Labour's problem is always get rid of Corbyn/tack right/do what James O'Brien says. I don't think that's the answer anymore. Too many people have suffered, too many people have died because of the actions of this government. "Less shit" isn't enough anymore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members JNLister Posted November 26, 2019 Paid Members Share Posted November 26, 2019 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members Dead Mike Posted November 26, 2019 Paid Members Share Posted November 26, 2019 2 minutes ago, hallicks said: I'm not sure you're addressing the point here, which is that Diane Abbott suffers from institutional racism at every turn, and Nicky Morgan doesn't. Hence why Abbott's mistake from over 2 years ago is still top of mind but Morgan's dumbfuckery will be forgotten soon enough.  I know we always end up talking about the same thing here, about the role of the media, etc etc. Labour is in a position of trying to win an election from a position of good faith with constructive policies, whilst being attacked on every side by people using every argument under the sun in very bad faith. The "answer" to Labour's problem is always get rid of Corbyn/tack right/do what James O'Brien says. I don't think that's the answer anymore. Too many people have suffered, too many people have died because of the actions of this government. "Less shit" isn't enough anymore. I'm more than aware of the abuse Diane Abbot gets & it's disgusting. It doesn't change the fact that people hate her & putting her on TV is detrimental to Labours elections hopes. With regards to your last point, 'less shit' might not be ideal but it's achievable. Would you rather have 50% of the current Labour manifesto or 5yrs of unrestricted Tory policies? Claiming you want 100% of Corbyn's Labour is fine but it's not going to happen, the public don't want it. Say what you like about the Tories, at least they realise to get the changes you want you actually have to be in power first.  Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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