Porkchopcash Posted August 30, 2019 Share Posted August 30, 2019 Just out of curiousity, what time does your chip shop close? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheToeSucker Posted August 30, 2019 Share Posted August 30, 2019 (edited) hopefully soon so he shuts up Edited August 30, 2019 by TheToeSucker Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members Supremo Posted August 30, 2019 Author Paid Members Share Posted August 30, 2019 5 minutes ago, Seratonin said: Was Omega a babyface or a heel in this promo? What's that got to do with the point I made about them listening and adapting to criticism? The babyface/heel thing is interesting though. According to Meltzer, the blurring of the dynamic is done by design and they aren't planning on having purebred faces or heels. I guess we'll have to see how it goes. On the surface, it sounds like a bullshit Russo, "It's got to be real, bro!" philosophy. But when you really think about it, why can't it work? TV, movies and sport don't succeed purely because they've got binary goodie and baddie characters. Surely the best and most interesting characters are going to be layered and dichotomous? Look at a guy like Conor McGregor. Even at his most popular, he still had loads of negative traits about him that most would describe as, "heelish." Look, I couldn't tell you if Cody is a heel or babyface. His character has been all over the place since All In. Has that made his stuff any less enjoyable or effective though? I wouldn't say so. His feuds and matches have been some of the best stuff of the last twelve months. Similarly, go and watch that incredible NXT UK special from the other day. Walter almost comes across as a noble, disciplined, respectable guy, but by the end you still end up wanting Tyler Bate to smash his face in. And regardless of whether he was a babyface or a heel, there's no denying that Kenny's promo was fucking brilliant, easily the best thing he's done in AEW so far, massively elevating the Moxley feud. Ultimately, I wonder if those in the business themselves sell the medium and its fans short assuming characters have to be either babyface or heel. I know there's nothing wankier than the phrase, "shades of grey," but it'll be interesting to see someone try and pull it off who's hopefully not a moron. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members Chris B Posted August 31, 2019 Paid Members Share Posted August 31, 2019 Whether he's a heel or a face, I believe Kenny Omega hates Jon Moxley more than I've believed a feud in years. He was cheapshotted after he lost a match he believes he should have won. I care more about this feud than I expected. I want to know what happens next. I'm totally up for Pac and Omega in the meantime. The idea that it's shit storytelling because Omega isn't being enough of a face and going 'jumping jillickers, I sure hope you get well soon, Jon' is odd. Man, remember when Austin kept swearing, assaulting defenceless people and being vindictive? What a shit babyface. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members tiger_rick Posted August 31, 2019 Paid Members Share Posted August 31, 2019 Shades of grey is bullshit. There have to be heels and babyfaces. It's the fabric of every story ever told. They don't all have to be the same. They don't all have to have the same moral compass or the same motivation but they're always there. They don't have to be on the same side. How many good people have friends/boyfriends/girlfriends/husbands/wives who are dicks? That's life. Adam Page is the purest fucking babyface on the planet right now. Chris Jericho is an absolute piece of shit. It's wrestling 101. Some of the others are harder to peg. These shows take place in front of an audience that react positively to most people. Like NXT. Everyone is a babyface by default. And they've only had a couple of shows to tell the stories. If the characters start to feel bipolar, then they've got a problem. That's the problem with Vince Russo bullshit. It's not that characters are grey. That's horseshit he's made up. It's that they're black/white/black/white/black/white in the space of two hours because he doesn't understand how to tell a story. Bro. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UK Kat Von D Posted August 31, 2019 Share Posted August 31, 2019 23 minutes ago, tiger_rick said: Adam Page is the purest fucking babyface on the planet right now. Chris Jericho is an absolute piece of shit. It's wrestling 101. Some of the others are harder to peg. Couldn’t that be linked? The few guys they have in the clearly defined heel/face roles are more effective as something special. Wouldn’t be as good if everyone did it, just like it wouldn’t be as good if everyone was doing spot monkey matches. A good roster has variety, that can apply to characters too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MPDTT Posted August 31, 2019 Share Posted August 31, 2019 Great preview show! Â Â Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pinc Posted August 31, 2019 Share Posted August 31, 2019 The presentation of wrestling has been stuck in a rut for years and is well overdue something to move it on in the way that the introduction of a sleazy aesthetic first by ECW and then the WWF did in the late 90s. Experimenting with the Face/Heel divide is probably long overdue, and timely given that most crowds are now smark crowds to some extent and they cheer for whoever they see as credible regardless of Face/Heel alignment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members Supremo Posted August 31, 2019 Author Paid Members Share Posted August 31, 2019 (edited) Between that Countdown To All Out and NXT's Prime Target special, today's two shows have had some of the best build up of anything all year. I'd like to hope this is a sign of things to come, with competition driving both companies to try new things and fresh approaches. Doesn’t it cost something ridiculous like half a million dollars to do an episode of Raw? And yet here we are, with the best hype all year coming from a YouTube show and Trent Seven in his back garden. Edited August 31, 2019 by Supremo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CavemanLynn Posted August 31, 2019 Share Posted August 31, 2019 Where have they aired that preview show? It's one thing putting it online available via the usual sites us fans know about, but a great piece like that should really be an extended hype ad on casual TV. If Khan has the cash, that's what they need to be doing, if their intention is not just to bleed more dollar out of the existing niche market but to widen the audience beyond WWE. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TildeGuy~! Posted August 31, 2019 Share Posted August 31, 2019 1 minute ago, CavemanLynn said: Where have they aired that preview show? It's one thing putting it online available via the usual sites us fans know about, but a great piece like that should really be an extended hype ad on casual TV. If Khan has the cash, that's what they need to be doing, if their intention is not just to bleed more dollar out of the existing niche market but to widen the audience beyond WWE. It was on TNT... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members Devon Malcolm Posted August 31, 2019 Paid Members Share Posted August 31, 2019 40 minutes ago, Pinc said: Experimenting with the Face/Heel divide is probably long overdue, and timely given that most crowds are now smark crowds to some extent and they cheer for whoever they see as credible regardless of Face/Heel alignment. How do you know this is what they're doing and it's not a combination of poor writing, booking and performing? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UK Kat Von D Posted August 31, 2019 Share Posted August 31, 2019 33 minutes ago, Devon Malcolm said: How do you know this is what they're doing and it's not a combination of poor writing, booking and performing? Because there are some people with perfectly defined face/heel characters, so they are obviously aware how to do it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedRooster Posted August 31, 2019 Share Posted August 31, 2019 If anyone else has paid for Starrcast, the MJF show is worth watching, it’s a lot of fun. He’s absolutely excellent in it and shows off what an excellent character he should be on the TNT show. The Cody interview with Tony Schiavone is great too, Cody is such a likeable guy and Schiavone is a great interviewer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members Devon Malcolm Posted August 31, 2019 Paid Members Share Posted August 31, 2019 1 hour ago, UK Kat Von D said: Because there are some people with perfectly defined face/heel characters, so they are obviously aware how to do it Fair point but it still seems slightly speculative to me. And as Seratonin liked my last post, I'll bale from this thread, nobody needs that on their CV. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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