AEW Fight For The Fallen

[Bohan]

10 minutes ago, Mat said:

I'm sure that I saw somebody in a previous thread recommend Fite TV, and if I sign up, you get some kind of credit. Anybody got one that they want me to use so I can get you something for me signing up and purchasing F4F?

Feel free to use mine pal, reference is m5p91y6

[gmoney]

That was fine. I'm not that into the Bucks, but it was pretty good. 

Enjoyable overall I thought, but not blow-away.

Pros
-A few good matches
-Great, different  looking venue
-Less shitty comedy

Cons
-Commentary is pretty rotten. Alex Marvez seriously should never ever be allowed to announce on a show again. Just abysmal. Excalibur has an intensely irritating voice, and JR is completely out of touch. 
-Jericho stuff was bad. Apparently he forgot to cut a promo the first time so had to come back out and waste everyone's time. 
-Aside from MJF, I don't think anyone has come across a potential break out star yet, so they probably should try and do something about that.

[The Gaffer]

The commentary is killing me. Marvez and Excalibur just have that awful indie soporific quality that makes them sound like they're doing some nasally Nintendo podcast from their bedroom. And even in wrestling nothing looks quite as ridiculous as a man commentating in a mask. 

[Supremo]

2 hours ago, gmoney said:

Aside from MJF, I don't think anyone has come across a potential break out star yet, so they probably should try and do something about that.

Totally disagree. Luchasaurus, Jungle Boy and Darby Allin all came across as break out stars on this show. It was easily the best thing about the show; seeing acts naturally getting more over than the last time we saw them. In fact, Luchasaurus and Jungle Boy were so over and are so obviously fantastic that the crowd took ages to recover from their match and poor Hangman Page suffered greatly from having to follow them.

Overall, it was a positive show. There seems to be a clear attempt to listen, learn and fix problems as they go and although this show still had its issues it felt like a big improvement on two weeks ago. The comedy shit was kept to a minimum, there was almost nothing that'd make you embarrassed to be watching, no-one got their head smashed in, no-one mentioned CTE and - shock, horror - the pre-show actually featured promos that built up the matches later on!

The venue was absolutely gorgeous. I probably would've aimed the hard camera at the crowd rather than a brick wall, but other than that it was a great looking building that gave off positive early Nitro vibes. Considering they're only three shows in, they've done a great job of keeping a consistent aesthetic but still managing to make each show look different to the last. Production in general seemed to have improved, too. The entrance music was mixed better all night long, they correctly switched Omega's music to the version with vocals and the way each guy's entrance got a snippet of their Titan Tron shown was cool as well. Commentary still needs a lot of work though. Alex Marvez has improved and felt far more comfortable but he's still pretty shit and by the time the main event came around you got a genuine sense that he was annoying JR, with Jim shutting him down constantly. It's just not a good combination, grumpy Jim having to stomach shitty Marvez. You're left with poor Excalibur spending all his time trying to steer both of them into something resembling a good team. Bring back Goldenboy.

One thing I loved all night was the natural, funny moments that you'd never get on a WWE show. Opting to show the sponsors of the show on-screen, only for the camera to find them acting like drunk tits. Some dickhead fan screaming in Kip Sabian's face, only for him to send him packing with a kiss on the lips. Pentagon throwing his glove to the referee, the ref failing to catch it, so they do it again to laughs and cheers from the crowd. All of this is the shit I love. WWE is so overproduced and micro-managed that you'd never get moments like that these days. Tiny, inconsequential things, sure, but it makes all the difference. It's what stands out most when I watch stuff back from the late 90s. Those boss, fun little moments that just happen naturally and aren't meticulously scripted out ahead of time. Hopefully we get more going forward and guys are allowed the freedom to try things out and have some fun on the weekly TV.

Quick, fun little opener. Sonny Kiss is a great act and in front of that crowd even the Librarian stuff didn't feel so out of place. At Fyter Fest it felt like no-one had a clue what was going on. Here though, in front of what felt like a more hardcore AEW crowd who follow all the online shenanigans, the Librarian stuff felt like a totally acceptable lower-card heel act. It probably also helped that Avalon has the chops to at least have an OK match, unlike Blue Pants. Going forward, if they must continue this gimmick this is definitely the dynamic they should use, with Avalon in the ring and Leva playing manager on the outside.

The women's tag went far too long, felt super sloppy and was impossible to follow once the weird closed captions started. Best moment was Britt Baker making the hot tag to the wrong Japanese woman. Bloody hell, Britt.

Really enjoyed the opening six-man tag. Considering how few shows they've had, they've done a really good job building an upper-midcard of guys who can move up and down, mingle with the top guys and perhaps one day challenge for the Title. Darby Allin and MJF in particular feel like guys you could easily build towards Title contention. Definitely too many middle fingers in this match though. If everyone does it then it means fuck all.

I've already mentioned it, but Jungle Boy and Luchasaurus are the BEST. Fun, colourful, great look, great chemistry. If they don't make them the Tag Champions they've lost their minds.

Him kissing that fan away aside, Kip Sabian sucks. Proper generic, beige man, the last thing Hangman should've been doing is going 50/50 for the whole twenty minutes. That was probably my biggest gripe all night. Not every match has to go forever and feature long, drawn-out kick outs. Page winning in ten minutes or less would've been far more productive. It was the same in the Kenny Omega match. It was a fun match, and it got the, "this is Awesome!" chants they were probably looking for, but did Omega really need to go so long with CIMA? Could they not have had a quick five minute match? Or even a squash? Kenny needed something to solidify him as a top star and that could've been achieved far better in half, if not a third of the time. Also, god bless the lad, CIMA seems good enough, but where are his flippy, gymnastic mates we were promised? I'd much rather see them doing crazy spot fests than CIMA having above average matches for a guy you can tell is past his prime.

Jericho looks a state, especially in tracksuit bottoms, but he cut a good promo and the fortunate juice on Hangman helped what was an otherwise average angle. The mask thing would've worked much better if the Dark Order were still around ringside when Hangman made his entrance or something, but the way they did it was stupid. Everyone knew it was Jericho, so the announcers just looked silly acting otherwise. Jericho referencing that this might be the end of his career was interesting. I wonder if there's anything to that? Hopefully not because it's clear as day Page isn't ready to be champ and they'll have to put the belt on Jericho at All Out.

Lucha Bros are awesome. I can't wait for that ladder match. All Out looks like an amazing card.

Fun main event. Great video package beforehand, too. They clearly still need to work on pacing and timing out a show, but ironically the best stuff came when they thought they were off the air. Cody's super passionate promo was brilliant, the charity stuff was great and then Kenny's goodbye promo felt really warm and heartfelt. I wonder if they should do that going forward, incorporating the goodbye promos they do in New Japan. It'd certainly set them apart and once again allow them to speak naturally and openly. That's when these guys are at their best, when they're just acting like normal human beings.

So yeah, definitely a good show and I'm far more enthusiastic now than I was after Fyter Fest. For a company that appears to want to improve going forward, my main suggestion coming out of this show would be to stop making every match a twenty minute epic and allow some guys to just win in devastating fashion instead of trying to get everyone over at the same time. Having Jim Ross just say wins and losses matter doesn't actually make them matter. Actually have some guys look far superior to others. If everyone only ever wins by the skin of their teeth then no-one gets over and everyone stays the same. At some point, you've got to have the balls to tell some guys they're doing the job in a short amount of time. And ideally, that's exactly what you tell anyone who ever faces Luchasaurus and Jungle Boy. Fucking LOVE them.

Edited July 14, 2019 by Supremo

[TildeGuy~!]

Watched the Buy In before going to bed, Britt Baker was awful for the entire match, was she working with a concussion?

[digitalversicolor]

I'm trying to watch this on FiteTV on my Fire Stick but the stream keeps lagging or pausing for a millisecond all the time and it's really quite annoying. Any idea how to solve this?

[gmoney]

1 hour ago, Supremo said:

Totally disagree. Luchasaurus, Jungle Boy and Darby Allin all came across as break out stars on this show. It was easily the best thing about the show; seeing acts naturally getting more over than the last time we saw them. In fact, Luchasaurus and Jungle Boy were so over and are so obviously fantastic that the crowd took ages to recover from their match and poor Hangman Page suffered greatly from having to follow them.

I enjoyed Jungle Boy and Luchasaurus a lot, but I can't see them main eventing with those gimmicks. Hopefully I'm wrong. 

Darby Allin is not for me at all. Rubbish 'Dark' gimmick, no physique, doesn't seem to have much charisma. He showed a bit of fire, but ultimately to me he comes across as low rent. Not as low rent as Jimmy Havoc, mind. 

[TildeGuy~!]

This Everton fan bellend is gonna be front row for every American show I watch from now on isn’t he? Front Row for every NXT taping, was front row at Fyter Fest too.

 

[ColinBollocks]

1 hour ago, Supremo said:

The venue was absolutely gorgeous. I probably would've aimed the hard camera at the crowd rather than a brick wall, but other than that it was a great looking building that gave off positive early Nitro vibes.

It is such a little thing, but doing cool ideas with their set up instantly makes the show look fresh. We're used to WWE doing the same thing every week so it's nice to see something different.

Edited July 14, 2019 by ColinBollocks

[The King Of Swing]

Supremo hit on what may be my biggest gripe with professional wrestling as a whole. Matches going much longer than they need too.

The women's tag is the perfect example of it, shave at least five minutes off of it and you may have had a more focused contest, and hopefully a less sloppy one. Instead everyone was just doing moves with varying degrees of success.

The main reason I've become a Stardom fan is matches rarely outstay their welcome with only important matches usually getting 15 minutes plus.

I enjoy TJPW but the roster is pretty thin with a lot of green and being blunt, some not very good wrestlers. Even the top talent are prone to sloppy matches from time to time.

Saying that though, I'll take a sloppy match over the comedy shite from previous pre--shows every time.

[Michael_3165]

As others have highlighted I struggle to see why some of these matches go on for as long as they do though I must admit I haven't caught this and the last AEW show. 

Any match that goes over 20 should be a classic and relatively rare. I never understand why they have to have these drawn out stretches in matches. They have gone from one extreme of no selling to loads of selling followed by jumping up and fighting again. They are guilty of this in NJPW where everything has to go over 20 minutes it seems. Less is more. 

[tiger_rick]

Different looking show. Really missed that. Not great looking because it's a weird set up but not bad and very different. I didn't watch the pre-show but caught the end with the subtitles snafu. No complaints about it from me though because I didn't see the rest.

Loved the feel of real faces and real heels in the opener. Particularly the pop for Allin's first tag. Strong opener although it became a bit of a collection of spots on the way home. They played up the Speirs MJF disagreement well and Speirs carried himself well.

Not sure what happened to JR's voice somewhere in the first two matches. 

Brandi and Allie was crap. Brandi isn't good anyway but Allie isn't much better and her facials are awful. Kong not used anywhere near enough to help this thing. Staredown of Kongs better than the match.

I really want to like the commentator's links to camera as it reminds me of good old-school shows but it's not working.

Jungle Boy and Luchasaurus are great. Love those two. That Dark Order thing is shite but Uno was decent. Hated the spot where Grayson ducked under the double team from Luchasaurus and Jungle Boy. That's a babyface 101 spot. What was that? Match was bundles of fun but not a fan of the outcome. 

Fuck off with all the Topes.

Page and Sabian was alright. I like that it didn't feel like everything else but it just didn't get going in the final stretch after that great spot where Page lawn-darted Kip onto the ramp. Post match angle would have been better if it wasn't really obvious it was Chris Jericho. Shouldn't have zoomed in.

Lucha Bros are ace too and I loved the first 3/4 of the match but it fell apart somewhere with Fenix visibly showing frustration with Kaz at one point. Pity it didn't end great. Ladder match should be insane at All Out.

Crowd was a bit dead for all the singles matches. Omega/Cima wasn't great but did get going towards the end. Overly long though. Classic WWE mistake of the last few years. Everything now has to be 20 minutes when 10 will do. Years of people crying about stuff not being long enough is to blame. Go long when you need to. On occasion. 

Enjoyed the Page/Jericho brawl. Mainly because it ended that fucking promo. Jericho will never be half as good as he thinks he is.

JR looked lost by the penultimate link piece. After that Austin podcast, it's clear he loves what he does as much as ever. This was sad.

Main event was good. Enjoyed the pace, Dustin's influence I reckon. Bucks look much better in this sort of match rather than the spotty stuff. Some nice heel schtick from them. Did find some of the double teaming a bit too cute. In fact, their tag matches are littered with double team stuff that feels far too indy. 

Last bit was a bit too back patty for my liking. Fair play if you're into it. Should have been after the show.

So nothing bad (that I saw) aside from Brandi and Allie  but nothing that really, really stood out. A few really fun matches. I enjoyed it but not as much as the previous ones, if I'm honest. There are a load of impressive things about the company but a shit load of rough edges that need smoothing. 

Still looking forward to All Out. Great looking card shaping up and should be a much better environment. 

Edited July 14, 2019 by tiger_rick

[Guest]

Pretty big disappointment, this. Think through all the ups and downs, their last two shows were still firmly "good" to me, and I thought this was average at best.

Sonny Kiss looked good enough in his squash, but the librarian gimmick spoils it by existing.

Riho looked good in the women's tag, Bea and Britt really didn't. Britt tagging the wrong corner was a laugh though.

The 6 man tag was okay, nothing more. You could probably have improved it immeasurably by simply taking Havoc & Guevara out of it - they were afterthoughts that added nothing. Also, the fact that nobody's gone "no, Sammy Guevara, you can't just fucking nickname yourself 'The Best Ever'" yet is one big reason I fear for the future of this company.

Allie v Brandi was pretty bad. Confusing what they were going for with Brandi's blubbering video package then immediately becoming an 80's heel. Was terrified they'd ruined Awesome Kong by just making her muscle for Brandi, but Aja Kong coming out put most of those fears to bed for now at least. Two of my favourite wrestlers ever and a natural match to book. Well up for it. Awesome Kong has been fairly inactive the past few years so we'll see how much she still has in the tank, but Aja still manages to churn out very good matches semi-regularly so I have pretty high hopes.

Three way tag match was pretty bonkers and a lot of fun. Jungle Boy & Luchasaurus are a very good pairing. Jack Evans was the most fun I've seen him be since ROH's glory years. The "Dark Order" gimmick clearly needs some work, but they showed that they're not just a shitty Wyatts rip-off here. Easy match of the night for me.

Then the show got boring and never really got me back. I have seen Kip Sabian live, on crappy British family shows, and he is an adequate entertainer in those surroundings, but as a TV wrestler? Christ, he is near Magnus levels of bland. Nineteen fucking minutes. Page is very solid but does not have the kind of outward charisma to counter just how fucking BORING the way they're presenting this Sabian lad is. Makes fucking Balor look like The Rock in his pomp. The fact it took nearly the entire time limit for their big young prospect to beat a guy who seems lucky to get even a pre-show match is not a good look. Bland bland bland.

Jericho looked like an alcoholic dad as usual. At this point him, and his Judas Effect is just very funny to me. His segment/s were generally good though. That Sabian match could have killed Page dead for me, but seeing him come out with a busted eyebrow all full of intensity for a fun little brawl saved him. Their match at All Out should be brawling orientated and this is the first time I've felt an actual sense of anticipation for it.

SCU v Lucha Bros was okay. Got some of my energy back eventually anyway. Didn't need the slow start with the posing but it got quite fun. Need Penta in singles setting eventually though, he's just way more fun when he's making someone bleed. I've seen Penta have multiple great hardcore matches with Sami Callihan, who I think is crap, and fucking 2015 Vampiro in the only Lucha Underground match I ever really cared for - deathmatches are clearly what he's best at. Bored of Bucks v Lucha Bros but a ladder match sounds definitive and the Bucks will be in their element there.

CIMA v Kenny was a Kenny match. Kenny fans loved it. For me it was another match from him that started out completely uninteresting until they ramped up the pace a bit. Some fun moments once it got going, but they're going for an epic that I just didn't need or want to see. Maybe here this is fine, but eventually Kenny will have to have singles matches that aren't paced like NJPW main events. I am VERY curious if he'll still be regularly called the best in the world when that happens

Show needed Bucks v Rhodes Bros to be great to save it. I've been looking forward to it but it was a giant letdown. I'm not sure what they were going for but it dragged and the crowd didn't seem all that into it either. It was slower paced than most Bucks matches, which I wanted, but it just wasn't all that engaging. There were moments it looked like the Bucks could push things into another gear by being little pricks and bringing extra out of the Rhodes', but it never really materialized. The most fun I had with this were the moments where Dustin actually flew around like a Young Buck. Sometimes it felt like the two teams wanted to prove that they could work the other guys' style, but they didn't actually settle on a style to make this match feel coherent and as good as billed.

Quite the buzzkill show overall really. I'll still watch All Out and the start of their TV (it definitely looks like their tag tournament will be worth following at the very least, even if it's been set up like shit) but that might be me done after that. Don't like Kenny nearly enough to give this shit a pass, and some of their decisions are as baffling as WWE's.

Edited July 14, 2019 by sj5522

[IANdrewDiceClay]

Not a very good show, which is a shame, because you want these shows to be used to wipe out all the bullshit, and they havent. Alex Marvez needs to go, he might be the worst commentator I've ever heard. He cant do anything. And they need to stick with the one direction. You cant have Brandi tugging at the heartstrings in the pre-tape and then have her working sly heel in the next match. Jericho reminds me of Roddy Piper in his 50s. A parody of a former great. That promo was brutal.

But as they say, these last two shows were just sold spot show type deals, All Out is where they need a home run.

[RedRooster]

6 hours ago, digitalversicolor said:

I'm trying to watch this on FiteTV on my Fire Stick but the stream keeps lagging or pausing for a millisecond all the time and it's really quite annoying. Any idea how to solve this?

I had some issues with FITE TV too, it skipped from the end of the Brandi/Allie match until part way through the subsequent tag match. No matter what I did I couldn’t get the tag match to play right through. 

Overall though I enjoyed the show and thought the pre-show was far better than previous efforts. The Librarian gimmick is still terrible though, it’s the worst thing I’ve seen in wrestling in some time.

I wonder how much the wrestlers were affected by the heat? At various points you could see members of the crowd fanning themselves and I can only imagine how bad it must have felt for wrestlers during matches.

I thought the show was far superior to Fyter Fest and I enjoyed most of the matches. I do agree that some went on too long, particularly the main event.

Brandi/Allie was pretty bad. I’m not sure either of them should have a prominent role in ring, particularly given the high standard of female wrestler in that company.

I thought the commentary has improved since All In, although, as has been pointed out, Jim Ross really seemed to be annoyed with Marvez at times. I’m a fan of Excalibur, I actually think he’s better than the team he’s part of. 

I should add, ‘improved’ obviously doesn’t mean ‘good’.