UFC 236: Holloway vs Poirier 2 - Apr 13 🇺🇸

[WeeAl]

I'm leaning towards the favourites in both title matches. I don't know if I'll ever doubt Max again. Both are incredibly good fighters, but I'm not exactly sure where I would give Poirier the edge over Max, so Holloway gets the nod for me. Max by UD or else a stoppage in the 5th. Dustin's a warrior, and both men are likely to be there for the duration. 

I'm picking Adesanya against Kelvin. Gastelum has definitely fought the stronger opposition, there's no doubt about that, and he gets way overlooked a lot of the time. He also hits like a Mack truck. Grappling is certainly the way forward for him in this one though. Having said that, I'm not sure his grappling is so good that he'll be able to win three rounds out of five with it. To me, it's just as likely he gets completely pieced up on the feet whilst trying to close the distance. 

Kelvin only needs one really good shot though. That heavy left of his can really put your lights out if it connects cleanly. I don't like his chances of landing it though. I think he'll get a takedown or two and some control time. But in order to win this he needs to be able to take Israel down at will, and I don't think he can. If 50% of this fight is on the feet, then Kelvin is eating way more shots than Adesanya. 

Despite all that, these are two super competitive pairings, at least on paper, and the odds for any of the four getting the win should be fairly close to evens. 

Is it possible that the main event doesn't end up in the top five fights of the year when all is said and done?

[Zebra Kid Mark]

22 minutes ago, WeeAl said:

 

Is it possible that the main event doesn't end up in the top five fights of the year when all is said and done?

If the fight goes the distance I'd say it's a certainty the fight ends up being in the top 5.

[Egg Shen]

gone Gastelum, Holloway, Jouban, Krylov, Rowntree on the betslip

[David]

I've also neglected this card, I've been travelling all week and not had time to watch the build up. Won't catch it most likely until Tuesday or so.

[d-d-d-dAz]

The new pay-per-view purchasing system is a fucking scandal but...boy... when I did get to watch, they were 3 fun fights.

The Adesanya/Gastelum fight was something else entirely, though.

Think the 49/46 gap in the main was too big, but actually think the judges had a good night - a lot of pressure on their shoulders in those last 2 fights, and they got both decisions right imo.

Also, I think any fighter who takes their belt with them to sit in the audience looks a twat. But Cejudo is an extra special gimp. And WTF is his new gimmick where he creepily chats up women? There was the Bella thing, and apparently all night he was trying to get freaky with disinterested ring girls. Dickhead.

[wandshogun09]

That was amazing. Every now and then we’re lucky enough to get a proper 5 round classic but I’m really struggling to think of a card where we got 2 of them on the same show. 

Poirier vs Holloway was tremendous. Holloway is one of my favourite fighters and I really wanted him to win but I can’t lie, I’m happy for Peahead. Talk about taking the hard route. He’s been in war after war and he keeps finding a way to come out with the win. I know we moan about interim belts but I don’t think anybody has earned an interim title as much as Poirier has. With the road he’s taken and the guys he’s beat, it’s got to be about as legitimate a title as any interim belt we’ve ever had. 

The 49-46 did seem wide but then again, as good as the fight was, how many of those rounds did Holloway actually win? He got battered in the 1st, I had that 10-8, but really you could go 10-7. Holloway got smashed to almost Edgar-Maynard round 1 levels. I had Poirier taking the 2nd, Holloway clawed one back and had a strong 3rd but then I thought Poirier took the 4th and probably the 5th too. It was a great fight and even most of the rounds Max lost were competitive and he landed some good shots but scorecard-wise, I thought there was only one winner and it was clearly Poirier. 

If Poirier doesn’t get the next crack at Khabib now it’s complete and utter absolute bollocks. Fuck Conor McGregor. There’s about 4 or 5 top 155ers who are way more deserving of the shot than him at the moment. And in the absence of Tony Ferguson, nobody is more deserving than Dustin Poirier. 

Adesanya vs Gastelum was fucking insane. Even better than the main event. So many twists and turns. Like I said going in, this answered a lot more questions about Adesanya than all his other fights combined. In Gastelum he was in with a young, in form, elite championship level fighter and he passed the test. Survived some bad moments along the way but that’s what you have to do sometimes at that level. Incredible fight. FOTY so far for me now. After that 1st round I really thought Adesanya might be in over his head. Gastelum was closing the distance well, connecting constantly and even dropped him. Adesanya rebounding with that big 2nd round, scoring a knockdown of his own, set the table for the war to come. And the last couple of rounds were nuts. That brief grappling exchange in (I think) the 4th was crazy and made me wish we got to see more of them on the ground. I had them 2-2 going into the last round and Adesanya dug deep and had probably his best round of the whole fight, had Gastelum wobbling all over the shop and right up until the last second I thought he was going to get the stoppage. Brilliant fight. 

This is how I had it scored; 

Round 1: Gastelum 10-9

Round 2: Adesanya 10-8 

Round 3: Adesanya 10-9

Round 4: Gastelum 10-8

Round 5: Adesanya 10-8 

So I had it 47-45 for Adesanya overall. 

Who would’ve called Khalil Rountree to turn up fighting like a black Tong Po? I know they never shut up about it on the commentary but in all seriousness, he really has never looked that sharp before has he? Anders is granite tough to see the final bell but man he got fucked up. 

Thought the way OSP vs Krylov 2 played out was a bit surprising. What happened there? OSP gassed quick which is unlike him. Never would’ve predicted Krylov to submit him. 

Prelims had their moments but if you missed them it’s not the end of the world or anything. Those 2 title fights are a must though. 

[jimufctna24]

Well that was fun. When MMA is great, it's really great. 

I think the first three rounds of Poirier vs Holloway were pretty straight forward to score. Poirier won rounds 1 and 2, and Max took round 3. The final two rounds were tougher to score. I would be tempted to give round 4 to Max, and round 5 to Poirier. Regardless, I think Poirier was the marginally better fighter over the 25 minutes. I think Holloway struggled to wear down the bigger man and absorb shots in the same way as he did against Aldo, Ortega and others at 145lbs. But Poirier was superb in his own right, especially in the early rounds and the last round where Max had come back into the fight. 

Quite a few felt that Gastelum would fade against Adesanya in the later rounds. As it stood, he had his best round in the 4th, and actually looked the slight favourite to win the entire fight going into the 5th. Adesanya gave him one hell of a beating in the 5th though. I was urging Gastelum to survive in the closing moments. He deserved to see the final bell. It was an easy fight to score in terms of rounds. It was a bit more difficult to determine which rounds should be scored 10-8. Regardless, the lopsided final round left the outcome beyond doubt. 

 

 

Edited April 14, 2019 by jimufctna24

[d-d-d-dAz]

He needs to fuck off now. His whole act is terrible, but this newfound ‘sage of the sport’ spin is fucking atrocious.

It’d be absolutely criminal if they do anything but Khabib/Dustin next.

[wandshogun09]

MMAJunkie’s Fernanda Prates summed it up perfectly for me; 

[WeeAl]

Goodness, gracious me. How on earth did we end up seeing two fights like that, back to back. Adesanya Vs Gastelum really was something to behold. What a war of attrition that was. 

Poirier really gave Max a lot of damage accross that fight. The power difference really showed and made the difference. 

Four absolute warriors fought in those two title fights, and each and every one of them showed the heart of a lion by making it through to the end. Career making fights from all involved, win or lose. 

Khalil Rountree was just different gravy. Gone was the guy that three with power and speed but tired after the first 90 seconds of the round. He absolutely battered Anders, especially in that second round, which I'd easily have given a 10-7. I'm really interested to see how he fares in his next outing. 

Jouban Vs Grant wasn't particularly exciting. OSP Vs Krylov really surprised me. The first round went exactly as I expected, but the second most certainly didn't. A big win here for Krylov, especially being able to make a statement by finishing it on the floor. 

[ColinBollocks]

We've had a very good year if this show isn't in the top 3 Event of the Year list. Both main events were just a lovely/brutal combination of skill, damage and heart from all 4 fighters involved.

I was surprised Holloway made the full 5 rounds, considering how burst he looked after the 2nd, but there he is still standing and throwing with Krystal Steele's battered fanny on his face. Poirer did him right savage. Dana said after the fight that he was surprised at how small Holloway looked in there and is telling him to fight back at FW once more, which is definitely the move. Poirer v Khabib, though, eh? Phwaor!

Gastelum v Adesanya felt special during the walkouts, then what unfolded is something I'll never forget. If you're trying to build your myth as a great, that 5th round performance by Adesanya is how you go about it. He clearly had a word with himself and seemed unyielding in his desires to be a champion. It was the perfect finish, really, with Adesanya showing just how good he is at his craft and Kelvin refusing to stay down, even if his opponent suddenly decided to go last level boss on him.

Also, Dana said after the fight the plan is to do Khabib v Dustin next (I know), and Bobby Bollocks v Adesanya in Australia.

[Egg Shen]

Two incredible main events. 

Gotta give some proper to Khalil Rountree as well though. Thought the 3rd round let down what was a real breakout performance, a finish would have cemented it but thats nitpicking a bit, he looked great.

The two mains though... just great fights showcasing everything thats great about MMA. Not alot more to add really outside of the obvious assessment that Holloway lacks power to compete at very top of 155lb. He's in abit of a weird spot now because theres no guarantee he can get back to 145. Poirier though, what a rise. I think at one point he was destined to sit in that 145lb #5-#10 space, what a turnaround.

Adesanya/Kelvin was just mental. I had to scoring a simple 2-2 going into the 5th then Adesanya winning the last round big. Kelvin shooting for a takedown when he Adesanya wobbled against the fence was the headscratcher of the night though.

Needed that though tonight. I struggled to musture up any sort of excitement for Wrestlemania weekend, it was sort of fun following along from the outside without actually taking in much of the action but after seeing those two title fights it reaffirmed why i find it difficult to have any sort of emotional response to watching a pro wrestling match, it just doesn't come remotely close does it?

[jimufctna24]

This weekend served as another example of how hard it can be for fighters to move up and win a title. 

The likes of McGregor, DC, Couture and GSP are the exceptions to the rule. Out of those, only DC beat an absolute top-level fighter to win gold. The other three beat top 5 opponents, but not quite elite-level fighters. In fact, Couture and McGregor both lost after when they squared off against elite-level competition. McGregor lost to Khabib, and Couture lost to Brock and Nog. GSP also never defended against Rockhold, Romero and Moose, and for good reason. It's especially hard to move up in the lighter divisions and win gold. The talent pool in those divisions are massive and it's easier to get caught out. As the likes of Penn, Rory and others found out. 

Poirier is a massive 155er. He's even talking about fighting at Welterweight eventually. Whereas Holloway is naturally on the border of Featherweight and Lightweight. He's either a big 145er or a small 155er. A tough place to be in. That said, there might still be some decent fights on the horizon for Holloway if he returns to 145lbs. There is Volkanovski if he beats Aldo, a rematch with Ortega, and an eventual meeting with Zabit. 

[wandshogun09]

You can add Amanda Nunes moving up and dethroning Cyborg to that list, although obviously women’s 145 is a bare bones division, the achievement itself was great given Cyborg’s previous dominance. 

I agree with your point and it’s something I thought about myself watching the Poirier vs Holloway fight play out. I think all this ‘champ champ’ shit has sort of blinded people to the fact that weight classes are there for a reason. While we’ve seen a select few go up and win a second title, there’s a reason it was considered a special and rare accomplishment before every champion and their nan got a crack at holding 2 belts. I’m guilty of that myself. I touched on Poirier being the more acclimatised to fighting at 155 and that possibly being a factor going in but in the end I was predicting Holloway based on him taking Ortega and Aldo apart at 145. Thing is, 10lbs is big when you’re fighting at this level. Look at the fuss that’s made when 2 elite boxers are matched up and one of them has to concede giving up a few lbs or boiling down a few extra. And boxing weightclasses are only a few lbs apart. Holloway went up 10lbs here and while Poirier was a 145er himself years ago he’s had a few years now to grow into 155 and, as you say, he’s big at the weight now. He looked bigger next to Holloway than I expected he would come fight night.

Saying that, I think there’s still a lot of lightweights Holloway would look great against. I think the extra weight definitely came into it Saturday night but also Poirier is an animal and he’s peaking and motivated as fuck right now. 

Edited April 15, 2019 by wandshogun09

[Egg Shen]

yeh, Holloway will no doubt compete at in or around the top level of 155lb, he needs to address his power in the division though. It reminded me a little of the Diaz brothers where they've fought in higher weight classes and whilst still effective, just lacking that sheer physical strength to compete with certain guys.