MMA is shite: Fury vs Wilder

[wandshogun09]

Didn’t know whether this fight deserved its own thread or what so I’ll just whack this here. In case you didn’t know, there’s a bit of a big heavyweight fight on this Saturday night. 

Deontay Wilder vs Tyson Fury - WBC Heavyweight Title

Jarrett Hurd vs Jason Welborn - WBA/IBF/IBO Super Welterweight Titles

Mark Anthony Barriga vs Carlos Licona - Vacant IBF Minimumweight Title

Luis Ortiz vs Travis Kauffman

Joe Joyce vs Joe Hanks

Chris Arreola vs Maurenzo Smith

Anthony Yarde vs TBA

Isaac Lowe vs Lucas Baez 

Jesse Rodriguez vs Axel Vega

Marsellos Wilder vs David Damore

Wilder vs Fury kind of came out of nowhere. Despite these being two of probably the top 3 heavyweights in boxing right now, at the start of this year this wasn’t a fight people were really even talking about. It didn’t seem like a realistic option. It’s been a strange old journey but we’re just days away now. For once, Fish Eyes never lied to us. IT IS ON! 

Deontay Wilder was born on 22nd October 1985 in Tuscaloosa, Alabama. As a kid he wanted to be a basketball player. He got married young and in 2005 he became a dad to a daughter who was born with spina bifida. He dropped out of college and took on different jobs to support his family, including driving a truck and delivering beer. One day he walked into the Skyy Boxing Gym near where he lived and the rest is history. 

Look at that for a barnet! 

Tyson Fury was born in Manchester on 12th August 1988. He was 3 months premature and only weighed 1lb at birth. Hard to imagine that baby went on to become a 6’8” heavyweight champion. It’s been well documented that his family have a long history in fighting - bareknuckle and pro boxing. He was named after Mike Tyson for fuck’s sake. 

Wilder began his amateur boxing career in October 2005. In 2007 he won the Golden Gloves and the US Amateur Boxing Championship. In 2008 he qualified for the Olympics and took the bronze medal at the Beijing Olympics that summer. He finished up his amateur career with a record of 30-5. 

Fury represented both England and Ireland as an amateur. He didn’t have as much success as Wilder. He won some junior championships but fell short of making the Olympics. David Price repped England instead in Beijing in 2008. Fury won the national championship that year and decided to turn pro. He finished with a 31-4 amateur record. 

So 2008 is when both Wilder and Fury entered the professional ranks. Within weeks of each other actually. Wilder debuted in November, Fury in early December. The collision course began. 

Check out the young babyfaced Fury here, in one of his very first TV interviews. Looks and sounds completely different. 

Wilder fought 8 times in his first year as a pro. Going 8-0 with 8 knockouts, 7 inside a round. Fury fought 9 times in his first year. Going 9-0 with 7 stoppages of his own. 

Around 2011 (I think) Fury did a bit of training with Emanuel Steward and Wladmir Klitschko. This was when Wlad was scheduled to fight Dereck Chisora (that fight fell through) and Fury says he wanted to spar but Klitschko declined. 

Wilder had his own brush with a legend in the early stages of his career. Here he is looking all star-struck and sitting under the Lennox Lewis learning tree. 

Around this time I remember Tyson’s fights were airing on ITV4. By now he had a bit of cockiness to him and I clearly recall thinking ‘who’s this big prick?’ and hoping he’d get chinned. Unfortunately, the closest he came to getting chinned back then was that time when he punched himself in the face;

I really thought Fury was a joke and a bit shit at this time. He seemed a right pillock and looked a bit sloppy and reckless in this stage of his career. At some point he switched to fighting on Channel 5 where he scored his biggest win to date, a decision over Chisora. But my doubts on him were backed up when he got floored by Neven Pajkic. He got off the canvas and stopped Pajkic a round later but it wasn’t a good look, despite promoter Mick Hennessey hilariously describing it as, and I quote, “the British Hagler-Hearns”. Fury won 3 more fights over Martin Rogan, Vinny Maddalone and Kevin Johnson and was 20-0 by the end of 2012. Wilder had continued racking up the knockouts stateside, and was 26-0. 

In April 2013, Fury fought in America for the first time, facing Steve Cunningham in New York. He made hard work of it again...

Cunningham put Fury on his arse in the 2nd round. Fury rallied back though, brutally knocking him out in the 7th; 

It was the first time Cunningham had been stopped and was an exciting fight but one that again made people question how far Fury could go. If he was hitting the deck against Pajkic and Cunningham, it didn’t bode well. Fury was supposed to fight David Haye in 2013 and 2014 but the fight kept falling to bits like Haye’s body and the idea just got sacked off in the end. 

Wilder finally fought a recognisable name in April 2013. He knocked out Audley Harrison in just over a minute in Sheffield. It wound up being Audley’s last fight. He won 4 more fights by KO, moving to 32-0 and got his first world title shot in January 2015 against Bermane Stiverne. For the first time in his career, Wilder went the distance, but he won comfortably and bagged his first world title. 

Fury beat Chisora in their November 2014 rematch in an absolute snoozer on Box Nation. He followed that up with a February 2015 victory over Christian Hammer. And the stage was set for Fury to get his crack at the gold against his old mate Wlad. 

The fight was made official for 28th November 2015 in Düsseldorf, Germany. Klitschko’s adopted home ground. Fury was the clown in the buildup, trying all sorts of tricks to try to get in Wlad’s head. Most memorably turning up to the press conference as fucking Batman. 

That bemused look on Klitschko’s face is the look he seemed to have throughout the entire promotion of the fight. He didn’t seem to know what to make of Fury at all. And it seemed to carry over into the fight. Going in I was sure Klitschko was going to school him. Yeah he was no spring chicken but it wasn’t like he was looking on the decline going in. He was 64-3 coming in, hadn’t lost in 11 years, had won 22 consecutive fights and barely lost a round. And it wasn’t like he’d been in a load of wars. He was fighting a very intelligent and efficient style and taking minimal damage. He wasn’t your typical 39 year old fighter. And seeing how Fury had plodded his way to beating Chisora and had been knocked down by way inferior fighters to Klitschko, I was convinced this was going to be another routine Klitschko defence. I was wrong. 

Fury rose to the occasion and fought a way better fight than I ever gave him credit for having in him. It seems so obvious with hindsight but Klitschko had never dealt with an opponent like Fury. Someone who was actually bigger than him and also younger and who moved and switched stances so much. It wasn’t a particularly good fight. Not the most exciting to watch. But purely as a performance, it was really something from Fury that I didn’t think he was capable of. He bamboozled Klitschko and Klitschko seemed to just stand there looking at him for large spells as the rounds slipped by. 

Fury not only won, he took a decision of Klitschko in Germany. That’s almost more impressive than a knockout if you know how biased the judging can be over there. 

One of the greatest achievements of a British boxer ever. Up there with those nights when Ricky Hatton beat Kostya Tszyu, when Joe Calzaghe dismantled Jeff Lacy and when Nigel Benn upset the odds and battered Gerald McClellan. 

In January 2016, Wilder defended his WBC title, knocking out Artur Szpilka in New York. He was now 36-0 with 35 knockouts. But it was what happened after the fight that grabbed the headlines as Tyson Fury was in attendance and got in Wilder’s face post-fight. Here’s their first interaction back in 2016. 

But it would have to wait. As always with the Klitschkos, there was a rematch clause. Fury vs Klitschko 2 was supposed to happen. It was officially announced for July 2016 in Manchester but it never materialised. Fury originally pulled out injured but then he failed a drug test. He later admitted he was battling depression and using cocaine at this time. He relinquished his belts and disappeared for a bit. 

Wilder wiped out Stiverne in a round in their rematch in November 2017. Just crushed him. 

Fury had been looking like this...

He’d show up from time to time at shows or in interviews with IFL or whoever. Each time looking fatter than the last. “Fat as a pig” is how Tyson himself describes himself from this period. But he was in even worse shape mentally. He’s talked a lot about being suicidal at his lowest points. 

Wilder took on Luis Ortiz in March 2018. It turned out to be Wilder’s toughest night yet. Ortiz gave him all he could handle and was probably up on the scorecards. Wilder had to dig deep but ultimately his ridiculous power got him out of trouble and he eventually put Ortiz down for a 10th round TKO. 

Wilder was still on the throne. Now 40-0 with 39 knockouts. 

Fury declared in 2017 that he would fight again. In January 2018, he reapplied for his license. With all the ups and downs in his career, I’m not sure how seriously people took him. Month by month though, pictures started appearing of Fury in the gym again. And all that weight started dropping off him. 

He went from this...

To this...

In the space of about 8 or 9 months. Reportedly losing around 9st. 

In April, after talks with both Frank Warren/BT and Eddie Hearn/Sky, it was announced he’d signed with Warren and BT and would be returning to the ring in June in Manchester. 

Return of the Mack. He faced 39 year old Albanian cruiserweight Sefer Seferi. The choice of opponent brought mocking and criticism but after so long out of the game plus the mental problems and weight he’d had to lose, I had zero problems with this. The fight itself turned out to be a bit of a farce, with Fury fucking about for a few rounds before Seferi quit on his stool. But it wasn’t really about that. This was just about Fury getting back in there. 

His second fight back would be in August in Belfast. He’d be up against Francesco Pianeta. A bigger and better opponent than Seferi but still another warm up squash match. Tyson won a comfortable decision that didn’t exactly set the world alight but he got a valuable 10 rounds in. 

But the big story coming out of Belfast was that Wilder showed up and, according to Frank Warren, the fight was “ON”. 

Talks for Wilder vs Anthony Joshua had crumbled yet again and Fish Eyes swooped in. 

IT’S ON! That’s what Warren assured us. Despite there being no date or venue. IT’S ON! After a few weeks and no further announcement from Shoulder Roll Frank, people started getting sceptical. But...

It WAS on. He came through in the end, beige suit and all. It’s ON! 1st December is the date. The Staples Center in Los Angeles is the venue. It’s fucking ON! 

You know these lads will be watching. Even though they’ll pretend they’re not bothered. 

Watch this promo; 

Some fight this is. I’m not selling you that it’s going to be Corrales vs Castillo 1. Course not. In fact, if Tyson has his way there’s every likelihood that this is a bit lacklustre. But it’s such a rare thing that you see two top of the top heavyweights actually fight each other in or near their prime. It happened all the time in the 70s, 80s and early 90s but it’s almost alien these days. Especially two undefeated heavyweights. And the fact that they’re so opposite in styles makes it even more interesting. Can Wilder land the bomb on someone who moves like Fury? Is Fury far enough along in his comeback to be ready for Wilder? Can Fury avoid the haymaker for 12 rounds? Do we finally see the winner face AJ in 2019? 

Undercard looks decent as well. 

Jarrett Hurd is a top undefeated American prospect. 22-0 with 15 knockouts. He’s beaten Austin Trout and Erislandy Lara already. 

Luis Ortiz is back. The old fuck. I like watching the big man fight. 

Joe Joyce back out too. 6-0 now. People always seem down on Joyce but I quite like him myself. Don’t see him ruling the division or anything but he’s just another guy you can throw in the mix to strenghthen the division and that’s always a good thing. 

Anthony Yarde will no doubt be fighting some Latvian bin man and screaming about ‘lions in the camp’ again. 

And Marsellos Wilder is, you might’ve guessed, Deontay’s younger brother. He’s a cruiserweight currently 2-0 with 2 knockouts. 

IT’S (allegedly) ON!

[Keith Houchen]

Was really hoping you'd have used that pic of @tiger_rick for the "Now" photo.  Perfick post there, wand, because I'm old, I'd have in the "Best of British" nights of boxing Lloyd Honeyghan smashing the absolute shit out of Don Curry.  Couldn't believe it when that happened.

@neil @Chest Rockwell @Astro Hollywood @PowerButchi any chance of splitting this into its own thread?

[jimufctna24]

2 hours ago, wandshogun09 said:

I really thought Fury was a joke and a bit shit at this time. He seemed a right pillock and looked a bit sloppy and reckless in this stage of his career. At some point he switched to fighting on Channel 5 where he scored his biggest win to date, a decision over Chisora. But my doubts on him were backed up when he got floored by Neven Pajkic. He got off the canvas and stopped Pajkic a round later but it wasn’t a good look, despite promoter Mick Hennessey hilariously describing it as, and I quote, “the British Hagler-Hearns”. Fury won 3 more fights over Martin Rogan, Vinny Maddalone and Kevin Johnson and was 20-0 by the end of 2012. Wilder had continued racking up the knockouts stateside, and was 26-0. 

So did most people. Most observers felt he was very lucky to get the decision over John McDermott in 2009. The 98-92 scorecard that referee Terry O'Connor turned in is considered to be one of the worst in boxing history. It was so bad that the British Boxing Board of Control ordered an immediate rematch and decided to change the rules and introduce three judges instead of just the referee scoring the bout.

David Price was considered to be a better prospect than Tyson around that period. Most felt that Fury was ducking Price to preserve his unbeaten record. Yet, both of their careers eventually went in the opposite direction of most observer's expectations. It was the rematch with Del Boy in 2014 where Tyson won me over. It wasn't a great fight to watch. But he absolutely mauled Derek, who came into the fight off the back of the best run of his career. I recognised that he was a very good heavyweight after that performance. However, I still didn't expect him to dethrone Wlad. Even ifm as you say Wand, it seems pretty obvious in retrospect that Tyson was well-equipped to do the job. 

In a straight boxing match there is only one winner on Saturday night. I have seen middling heavyweights take a lot of rounds off Wilder. However, Wilder's knockout power is his get out of jail free card. I will not be surprised if Wilder, well behind on the cards, catches Tyson between the 7-9th rounds. But with some trepidation, I am banking on a Fury decision victory at the weekend. 

"Dosser" 

[David]

I'm 100% hoping for a Fury win here, because him against Joshua is the fight I eventually want to see, and I have faith he'll get the job done here, probably with a few scares along the way.

I fully expect Wilder to catch Fury at some point, but the difference between Fury and those other guys that Wilder knocked down and went on the decimate is that Fury doesn't lose all sense of what he's doing after getting dropped. I can see him hitting the floor, Wilder doing what he usually does and trying to follow up for the big finish only for Fury to tie him up and recover, box on the back foot for a bit, all the while Wilder is wondering why he can't put this guy away like he did his previous opponents.

I see a decision win for Fury, or even a late stoppage depending on Wilder's gas tank. 

I thought that aside from a bit of ring rust, Fury's issue recently was getting himself back into boxing shape. He's spent his camp for this fight in Big Bear, California, which is known for its altitude, so hopefully that has helped him.

He looks like he's taking this fight deadly serious, which is when Fury is usually at his best. He boxes to the level of who he's fighting most of the time I think.

[Porkchopcash]

I just cant see Fury not getting caught and  ko’d. Furys timing cannot be right having been out for so long. Even if he runs and trys to bamboozle Wilder he is going to have to put himself in the firing line to rack up a few points, he is the away fighter afterall. As Wilder said in that promo, he dont know when it’s coming but it is coming.

i’d love nothing more than Tyson to do it, but unfortunately i see him getting flattened. 

Top post Wand.

[David]

Personally, I doubted Fury in the Klitschko fight and I ended up wrong, so I'm not ready to doubt the guy again. I think he will get caught, and possible hit the floor, but I think he' has more boxing IQ than the rest of Wilder's opponents combined, and he knows how to stretch a fight to recover and regather himself after being caught clean. He's done it a number of times before.

The bigger question for me is, what does wilder do if he puts Fury down but can't do what he usually does, which is go all in all crazy and finish the fight? What if he uses that energy up and doesn't get the finish?

[Egg Shen]

Echoing Porkchop, im the same. I see Fury having some success but Wilder will land at some point and close the show. Wilder has been outboxed before but he always finds that shot. Fury's awkwardness and gamesmanship will only get him so far here. Whereas Klitschko just froze and refused to throw any punches against Fury, Wilder will go after Fury and get crazy. You can have all the technique and defensive savvy in the world but when a power puncher like Wilder comes in throwing windmills something is gonna land. Plus as much weight as Fury has lost, i cant see him recreating what we saw in the Klitschko fight. 

[David]

31 minutes ago, Egg Shen said:

Echoing Porkchop, im the same. I see Fury having some success but Wilder will land at some point and close the show. Wilder has been outboxed before but he always finds that shot. Fury's awkwardness and gamesmanship will only get him so far here. Whereas Klitschko just froze and refused to throw any punches against Fury, Wilder will go after Fury and get crazy. You can have all the technique and defensive savvy in the world but when a power puncher like Wilder comes in throwing windmills something is gonna land. Plus as much weight as Fury has lost, i cant see him recreating what we saw in the Klitschko fight. 

Yeah, I figured you'd see it the same! We all know your opinion of the big man, Ebb! 😉

[Carbomb]

It's an odd one to call, isn't it? I get what's being said about Wilder, but it's not like Klitschko didn't have bombs of his own, and if somebody with his level of sheer skill and technique was hesitant to pull the trigger, there's nothing to say Wilder won't be either. But then maybe Wilder's still got that fearlessness from not having been defeated; perhaps that lack of necessary caution will give him more of an edge against Fury than Klitschko had.

[David]

1 hour ago, Carbomb said:

It's an odd one to call, isn't it? I get what's being said about Wilder, but it's not like Klitschko didn't have bombs of his own, and if somebody with his level of sheer skill and technique was hesitant to pull the trigger, there's nothing to say Wilder won't be either. But then maybe Wilder's still got that fearlessness from not having been defeated; perhaps that lack of necessary caution will give him more of an edge against Fury than Klitschko had.

Thing is, boxing has always had its fair share of wild heavy hitters, and while they see success to a certain level, I'll always favour an actual skilled boxer over them every time. If Fury boxes anything like he did against Klitschko he should win, barring a punchers chance catching him.

[Factotum]

This is utterly intriguing as there's so many ways this could go. I think Fury at his best can frustrate Wilder. Tactically he's the better boxer and he'll need to play a blinder here. A frustrated Wilder plays right into Fury's hands. I can see him winning on points. Alternatively I can see Wilder just landing that big punch, but as someone mentioned, I think Fury has enough about him to get up and still stick to his gameplan (unless..you know...he's out of it)

Anyway having talked both, I'm backing Fury. Exciting fight!

[Egg Shen]

2 hours ago, David said:

Yeah, I figured you'd see it the same! We all know your opinion of the big man, Ebb! 😉

despite what you may think, im actually a Fury fan

[Rey_Piste]

I'm just waiting to see if Fury busts out the Karaoke machine again at the end of this fight.

[wandshogun09]

I feel I’ve been maybe, slightly, just a tad, somewhat misrepresented by that thread title 🤔

[Keith Houchen]

14 minutes ago, wandshogun09 said:

I feel I’ve been maybe, slightly, just a tad, somewhat misrepresented by that thread title 🤔

I'm going to hazard a guess at Butch doing the splitting?