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UK Kat Von D

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3 minutes ago, David said:

Yeah, I also think that he probably isn't doing a great job in convincing anyone to change their minds. The approach he takes isn't going to win many people over to his way of thinking.

If he let her say things which are false it wouldn’t do much either? Is anyone going to turn Vegan because someone on the tele was polite about not killing animals? 

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Just now, UK Kat Von D said:

If he let her say things which are false it wouldn’t do much either? Is anyone going to turn Vegan because someone on the tele was polite about not killing animals? 

I'm just saying that shouting someone down on any matter doesn't tend to work if your end game is to convince people to your side of the argument. If the end game is believing you're "right" then I guess it's a fine approach. 

I don't know what his approach should be, but the borderline aggressive approach of not just him, but other campaigners, isn't going to make anyone who eats meat think "gee, this guy who's shouting at me and calling me names actually has a point."

I know you're vegan now, but I very much doubt you would have received that kind of approach all that well back when you used to eat meat. Your response would probably have been to tell him to fuck off and stop giving you shit, which is how most people would deal with that type of engagement.

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18 minutes ago, David said:

I know you're vegan now, but I very much doubt you would have received that kind of approach all that well back when you used to eat meat.

I do remember what made me go vegan, it was other vegans being honest with me. Sometimes brutally honest. 

I know absolutely loads of Vegans and what made them go Vegan. Most of my friends are. Unless you are one I don’t see how you know what will and won’t work?  

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39 minutes ago, UK Kat Von D said:

Unless you are one I don’t see how you know what will and won’t work?

I was vegetarian for around 18 months a while back, but veganism was a step too far for me in all honesty. 

Edited by David

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15 minutes ago, David said:

I was vegetarian for around 18 months a while back, but veganism was a step too far for me in all honesty. 

So you don’t know anything about how to get people to go Vegan then? 

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Just now, UK Kat Von D said:

So you don’t know anything about how to get people to go Vegan then? 

I know that in life in general, shouting people down, cutting them off when they're trying to make a point, and using an aggressive tone won't work. My job consists of convincing people to do and buy things, and that kind of approach would never work. There's a reason that those tactics are rarely if ever employed by any successful company or organisation. 

Off the top of my head, rather than organise a protest in a city centre where everyone shouts, chants and angrily displays placards banging on about how eating meat is murder and how everyone who doesn't think or act like them is complicit, I'd maybe look at doing something like a "vegan cookout," where the angry, confrontational approach is replaced with a more approachable, friendly outlook. Grill up some of the fantastic vegan alternatives to hamburgers and hotdogs and give them away to passers-by. 

Come on over, get a free vegan burger, try something you'd maybe never buy from the supermarket. Got a question? Ask away. You enjoy that burger? Tastes like the real thing, doesn't it? Well, maybe look to buy them instead next time you're in Tesco.

That kind of approach is how I'd do it. But then again, I could be wrong. Maybe shouting at people will get the job done.

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5 minutes ago, David said:

That kind of approach is how I'd do it. But then again, I could be wrong. Maybe shouting at people will get the job done.

Yeah, that kind of thing happens. There are loads of different methods people use. I’m currently doing £100 off full day sessions for anyone doing Veganuary. Also posting loads of stuff on my Instagram story about all the new food out at the moment.

The only way people will commit to it is if they come to terms with what they are doing. Being blunt about it makes that happen rather than being protective of other people’s feelings. We aren’t selling a product, we are trying to change a lifetimes worth of conditioning.

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5 minutes ago, UK Kat Von D said:

 We aren’t selling a product, we are trying to change a lifetimes worth of conditioning.

Na na na na na na BATMAN...I mean Vegan!

the-joy-of-sect19.png

I had the Fry's Vegan Sausage Roll today from Sainsbury's. Pretty decent. Also, the cafe across from my flat isn't charging for dairy alternatives in coffee this month, which is a nice touch. Still ÂŁ12 for breakfast though! Bloody Surrey...

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Just now, UK Kat Von D said:

Yeah, that kind of thing happens. There are loads of different methods people use. I’m currently doing £100 off full day sessions for anyone doing Veganuary. Also posting loads of stuff on my Instagram story about all the new food out at the moment.

Great stuff, I'd be willing to wager that your approach probably works better than shouting at them. 

Just now, UK Kat Von D said:

The only way people will commit to it is if they come to terms with what they are doing. Being blunt about it makes that happen rather than being protective of other people’s feelings. We aren’t selling a product, we are trying to change a lifetimes worth of conditioning.

It's not about protecting anyone's feelings, it's about getting results. Or at least it should be. You'll maybe be able to convince a young adult who's looking to rail against the system that veganism is the way forward, especially if you convince them that by doing so they'll be able to join in the placard-waving, shouting and "I'm better than you" lifestyle, but that won't be enough to make any real difference. To make a real difference you'll need numbers. The mainstream.

The people who need convincing are the general public, and my experience is that you'll never manage to convince the average Joe to switch lifestyle by throwing it in their face that they're evil, responsible for murder of baby animals and so on.

What will make the changes needed is a proactive approach like the one I mentioned above, and your tattoo thing. As much as you may not like it, you are selling a product. You're selling a lifestyle change, and you'll not see much success using the confrontational approach.

It's like trying to sell people on healthy eating by shouting at them and calling them fat cunts. It won't work. 

 

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I took a manic walk out to KFC earlier, the "chicken" is really nice and tastes pretty damn similar to the normal burgers. They could really do better than a couple of damp bits of lettuce on it tho, especially when it's like ÂŁ4.50 for that and a drink.

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5 minutes ago, UK Kat Von D said:

The only way people will commit to it is if they come to terms with what they are doing. Being blunt about it makes that happen rather than being protective of other people’s feelings. We aren’t selling a product, we are trying to change a lifetimes worth of conditioning.

Agree with this.  My girlfriend has been vegetarian (now moving towards vegan) for 2 years now and that was almost entirely down to an encounter with one of the aformentioned angry protest mobs and them managing to get their points across enough for her to take some of their leaflets and start reading up on things.  So completely agree that sometimes the blunt approach is the best approach.

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29 minutes ago, David said:

Great stuff, I'd be willing to wager that your approach probably works better than shouting at them. 

Time will tell, but I’ve gotten a very large number of people to go Vegan with the “aggressive” approach.

James Aspey is basically Joey Carbstrong but with a more polite tone. This Morning use Joey because they know he’ll cause a stir. 

Edited by UK Kat Von D

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38 minutes ago, UK Kat Von D said:

This Morning use Joey because they know he’ll cause a stir. 

When you're a vegan going on these shows, you're like someone defending video games.  You're being brought in as the bad guy.  I think I mentioned it at the start of the thread but one of my favourite 'debates' featured a farmer saying how they do school tours and show how ethical and healthy the whole process they use is.  The vegan calmly asked if he took the tour to the abattoir because that is part of the process after all.  He spluttered towards a "No".  It was pretty funny.

Regarding shouting people down and all that, it's about the long game.  Older people aren't going to stop eating meat because some of them see it as defiance against new world that confuses them what with all the PC nonsense and foreign accents that have changed society from when they were young.  It's young people who will make the difference and the rise in veganism amongst the young is what will make the societal shift away from eating meat out of habit.

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How can you be Vegan eating at KFC? You're still sponsoring a company that slaughters hundreds of thousands of chickens each year. Plus, you can guarantee someone who prepared your vegan burger only moments ago was handling a chicken product. 

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