jimufctna24 Posted November 25, 2018 Share Posted November 25, 2018 On 11/24/2018 at 10:48 AM, David said: You need to remember that Chuck didn't start to earn anywhere close to decent coin until his first fight with Couture at UFC 43, and by then he was already 34 years old. He didn't start making good money until relatively late in his fighting career, so to expect him to call it a day so early is a bit off. From his real breakout fight against Tito in their first encounter to the point where Rashad sparked him and handed him his third loss in four fights only four years had passed. Indeed, Chuck's peak was relatively short. He hit his stride in 2004 and started to waver in 2007. His first win over Ortiz was his coming out party. He was a bit of an underachiever before that fight. He held wins over quality fighters like Sobral, Mezger, Overeem and Belfort; but he didn't always getting the best out of himself. He didn't commit to training as much as he should have done. Had he taken his craft more seriously, it's possible that he would have remained undefeated up until his late 30s. The losses to Couture and Rampage perhaps wouldn't have happened. Although there is the argument that Rampage was a horrible style match-up for him. His reputation before the first fight with Ortiz wasn't the best. He wasn't even considered to be a top 3 Light-Heavyweight. Couture, Rampage, Wand were all considered to be better than him at the time. In fact, he started as a slight underdog against Ortiz. After he blitzed Ortiz in impressive fashion, his reputation skyrocketed alongside the UFC's first boom period. More importantly, Chuck started getting the best out of himself on a more consistent basis. He went on the run that would define his legacy by definitively beating the likes of Couture x2, Horn, Sobral. and eventually Ortiz again. However, he did turn up to the Sobral rematch with a massive gut if memory serves correctly. He was done by 2008/2009. Which was understandable given that he was pushing 40. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members wandshogun09 Posted November 25, 2018 Paid Members Share Posted November 25, 2018 Yeah, I think Rampage was always a bad fight for Chuck myself. He had the power in his hands to keep Chuck off and, as we saw in both fights, the power to hurt Chuck. He had enough wrestling offensively to make that something Chuck had to be wary of, as shown in their Pride fight. And also enough wrestling defensively that Chuck wouldn’t easily be taking him down if he wanted to mix it up (like he did against Wandy). On top of that, Rampage had a rock head so he, while he wasn’t knockout proof, wasn’t going to go away easily or fold under the first dig Chuck gave him. He also wasn’t going to panic charge at Chuck like we saw Tito, Babalu and, to an extent, Randy do at times allowing Chuck to time them with counters coming in. Rampage had enough about his striking and was confident enough that he could switch between being the bull and the matador and actually had some head movement at a time when it was pretty much non-existent in MMA. All added up, he was always a hard matchup for Chuck. Funnily enough, I think the best time for Chuck to beat Rampage was probably around 2003ish when they fought in Pride. Rampage still had many of the above attributes then but it wasn’t until after the Shogun loss in 2005 that he really started tightening up his boxing. By the time they rematched in 2007, Rampage had clearly improved his hands and it showed in their fight. He was just quicker on the draw and able to slip Chuck’s loopy haymakers and bang in his hard and short hooks. Back in 03, I think Chuck could’ve beat him but maybe it was a combination of looking past Rampage and towards the more talked about clash with Wanderlei, the fact he was coming off the loss to Randy, the fact it was on Rampage’s home turf in Pride, maybe a bit of all the above, fuck knows? Or Rampage just always had his number. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tamura Posted November 25, 2018 Share Posted November 25, 2018 10 hours ago, Keith Houchen said: It was like when you do a fight with two figures but one of them has no moving parts. I suppose the production was top notch and Chuck will get his 200k or whatever it was but it was like your uncle who was hard in his day getting beat up in the pub car park. From this: To this: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members tiger_rick Posted November 26, 2018 Paid Members Share Posted November 26, 2018 That was like the time someone videoed Man v Fat and I saw myself on Facebook and realised that while I felt like a Messi/Maradona clone, I really move like a messy Jan Molby clone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members wandshogun09 Posted November 27, 2018 Paid Members Share Posted November 27, 2018 John Hackleman on Helwani’s show talking about Chuck getting knocked out by Tito. And as suspected, he was dead against the fight happening from the off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members Egg Shen Posted November 27, 2018 Author Paid Members Share Posted November 27, 2018 Id avoided the results until today and just watched the entire show. The actual show was pretty good, it looked great and it felt like an event which was pretty cool, but main event was nothing short of sad. Id sort of got sucked into the hype going in but from the moment they showed Chuck get out his car on entrance and limp into the arena i had a real bad feeling, he looked worse than i ever could have expected, just shocking. It was pretty cool to see how happy Chuck was going in though, you could see how much it meant to him to go at one more time, that may be the only positive. It'll go down as a low point in modern MMA for sure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members wandshogun09 Posted November 27, 2018 Paid Members Share Posted November 27, 2018 Dana going in on De La Hoya; The usual Dana rant. Right on some stuff, shouty manchild on others. I agree with pretty much everything he says regarding Chuck. But when Dana trots out the ‘I don’t want to make a dollar of that kind of money’ it makes me laugh. While it’s commendable and noble and all that good stuff that he looked out for Chuck’s safety when he absolutely could’ve made more money off him, you didn’t hear him going mental when a clearly shot to fuck Rashad Evans kept being booked to fight as recently as this year. You didn’t hear Dana say ‘wait a minute, maybe we shouldn’t let Bigfoot Silva plod into another KO punch here’ when he was routinely getting flattened every few months. Nor does he bang the drum when the empty shells of Shogun Rua and BJ Penn are trotted out there for another beatdown. In fact, both guys have fights coming up in the next few weeks. So it’s all fine and dandy to shout about ethics from the moral high ground on this, and in this Chuck example he’s absolutely right. But it seems it’s only “disgusting” and “the kind of money he’s not interested in” when it’s his buddy getting laid out stiff and it’s not in the UFC. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members Egg Shen Posted November 27, 2018 Author Paid Members Share Posted November 27, 2018 Dont disagree with that, it was always the personal relationship between Dana and Chuck that set that one apart. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Posted November 27, 2018 Share Posted November 27, 2018 I'm actually surprised that no one mentioned this, or if they have I've totally missed it. Chris Leben refereeing! He sounds as though he did a good job to be fair, and it would be good to see more former fighters go down this route. They're as well placed as anyone to know when a fighter is in trouble or if a fight needs stopped. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members wandshogun09 Posted November 27, 2018 Paid Members Share Posted November 27, 2018 Yeah, Leben’s been judging and reffing for a bit now. I had no idea until he popped up on this show. There was a piece on MMAJunkie about it that was a good read. Here’s a bit from it; Quote Two years ago, Leben attended Dean’s referee certification course – a requirement for working with the California State Athletic Commission – and was shocked at how difficult it was to oversee the action. “I thought I would just breeze through it, being that I’ve been fighting my whole life,” he said. “But you’ve really got to know the ins and outs of the game.” Leben got his start with the California Amateur Mixed Martial Arts Organization (CAMO), which regulates amateur fights alongside CSAC. For the first 10 events, he worked for gas money. “I started shadowing referees,” he said. “Eventually they started letting me ref and judge. I’ve been doing that for at least a year-and-a-half. I’d have to add it up, but I’ve probably done 100 fights.” This past Saturday, he was working as a CAMO official and was an official part of the event. He judged several fights and stood cageside to check fighters before they competed. Unofficially, the CSAC requires prospective referees to have at least 100 fights, though recommendations and experience in other states also determine the selection of officials. Leben is nonetheless holding off on making the jump to big shows. He wants more experience. As a fighter, Leben knows his decisions can have a profound effect on someone’s career. “Scoring a fight, versus watching it for fun, versus watching it as a coach, those are three completely different things,” he said. “If I’m coaching a fighter, I’m watching to see what’s working and what’s not working. If I’m watching a fight for fun, I see an exchange, and I go, ‘Whoa that’s awesome.’ If I’m judging, there’s no emotion. It’s check marks – he’s doing this, he’s doing that.” Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members Egg Shen Posted November 27, 2018 Author Paid Members Share Posted November 27, 2018 i saw Leben sitting cageside, didnt realise he was reffing the show. He didnt ref a fight on the main card, Frank Trigg was back in there though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ironic Indie Lad Posted November 28, 2018 Share Posted November 28, 2018 Dana's promo on the UFC Unfiltered Podcast about this whole pathetic mess was incredible. Absolutely vintage Dana White right down to the laugh from the classic "ha ha...I don't give a FUCK!" line from TUF back in the day. Highlight for me was him advising "Oscar De La Weirdo" to check into rehab immediately for being a "cokehead". Also pleaded with the listeners to Google De La Hoya and find out for yourself what a weird guy he is. I also had a good lol at Tito doing the media rounds and claiming this has done over 200,000 buys. Has it fuck pal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Posted November 28, 2018 Share Posted November 28, 2018 I'm kind of hoping that this whole carry-on results in Dana breaking out the boxing gloves and challenging De La Hoya to a boxing match, like he did Tito back in the day. If I was Oscar I'd be all over that promo, using it to create "beef" and get yourself some publicity. Shoot an interview addressing it, asking Dana to call you a cokehead to your face, rather than from the safety of his golden throne, which has been paid for by the concussions and broken bones of his underpaid fighters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members Egg Shen Posted November 28, 2018 Author Paid Members Share Posted November 28, 2018 2 hours ago, Ironic Indie Lad said: I also had a good lol at Tito doing the media rounds and claiming this has done over 200,000 buys. Has it fuck pal. i might have dreamt it but didnt Tito initially claim they'd do a million? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimufctna24 Posted November 28, 2018 Share Posted November 28, 2018 On 11/28/2018 at 5:32 PM, Egg Shen said: i might have dreamt it but didnt Tito initially claim they'd do a million? 1.5 million according to what you posted in the first page of this thread. Tito might just be the world's most delusional man. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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