Paid Members ColinBollocks Posted November 28, 2017 Paid Members Share Posted November 28, 2017 Pray for 'Reem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimufctna24 Posted November 28, 2017 Share Posted November 28, 2017 I am well up for this one. I will be setting my alarm for 3am sharpish. I am firmly in Ngannou's corner against Overeem. Heavyweight is in dire need of a new legitimate contender. Frankly, the whole division could do with a new era. Miocic is a fine Champion, there is no problem with him at all. The issue is what lays beneath him. Heavyweight is the division of the living dead. Arlovski, Hunt, Struve and others looked on the chopping block years ago; but have stuck around to mixed success. Werdum has just turned 40, and while he probably has a good few fights left in him, he's not someone who is likely to be around in 3 years. Browne ended up being a bit of a bust. For various reasons, the Cain/JDS era was sadly short-lived. These two were meant to be the start of a new era for Heavyweight MMA, yet it hasn't quite panned out as expected.They are still about - such is the current low-turnover rate at Heavyweight - but neither are likely to thrive as they did from 2009-2013. Cain just might, but as time goes on, the more cynical I am becoming about him (there are rumblings that a fight with Miocic is in the works, which is promising) If Ngannou stops Overeem on Saturday night, the division will be freshened up significantly. Beyond Cain, is there anyone fresh for Miocic to face? He's already beaten Werdum, Overeem and Hunt (aged between 37-43). Derick Lewis wouldn't be a serious threat. Minakov isn't under contract to the UFC. The rest are either journeyman or prospects. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members Egg Shen Posted November 28, 2017 Paid Members Share Posted November 28, 2017 yeh, it's massive for Ngannou. He seems to have that certain something special about him, he's got an aura that leads me to believe he become abit of a star despite being foreign and not being able to speak the language. It's a massive fight for him, i do feel Overeem fights safe, frustrates and ultimately wins the fight though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members Dead Mike Posted November 28, 2017 Paid Members Share Posted November 28, 2017 1 hour ago, jimufctna24 said: I am firmly in Ngannou's corner against Overeem. Heavyweight is in dire need of a new legitimate contender. Frankly, the whole division could do with a new era. Miocic is a fine Champion, there is no problem with him at all. The issue is what lays beneath him. Heavyweight is the division of the living dead. Arlovski, Hunt, Struve and others looked on the chopping block years ago; but have stuck around to mixed success. Werdum has just turned 40, and while he probably has a good few fights left in him, he's not someone who is likely to be around in 3 years. Browne ended up being a bit of a bust. Was thinking about this during the Fight Night bout with Junior Albini's bad shorts. You'd think they'd be stacking these smaller shows & prelims with heavyweights. People always like a HW bout & it's the division in need of new contenders. Maybe the talent pool from smaller companies just isn't there? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimufctna24 Posted November 28, 2017 Share Posted November 28, 2017 Yeah. Tim Sylvia made a decent point years ago that there are less 250lbs men in the world than there is 180lbs men. Also, a lot of athletes of that size in America will end up in the NFL or NBA. Therefore, naturally the talent pool is quite small. It also doesn't help that a lot of MMA Heavyweights are not suited for public viewing. Many moons ago, I used to watch King Of The Cage highlight shows on SKY channels. I can't imagine Dana watching some of the Heavyweights featured on those shows on his prelims, such was their lack of ability. I can imagine it's the same today. The big men at the lower-end of the talent pool are prone to stinking up the joint, and generally making a mockery out of the game. I don't think all hope is lost though. There was a 5 year period in the early 00's that saw the following Heavyweights burst on to the scene: Fedor, Nog, Arlovski, Cro Cop, Kharitonov, etc. There was also Werdum as well, even if he wasn't a fraction of the fighter he later became. Maybe history will repeat itself, and an influx of fighters from Eastern Europe and Brazil will eventually lift the Heavyweight division out of its rut. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members Carbomb Posted November 28, 2017 Paid Members Share Posted November 28, 2017 I can't say for certain, having not done any particular study on the subject, but I would venture to guess that a big part of why there are so few HWs from around the world as well as the US is because, given how relatively young MMA is compared to older, more established professional sports, it's losing out to those because there are already culturally and economically very well-established frameworks for men of that size to get on a smooth path to said sports, in addition to numerous other outside factors. Prime example would be Iran: they already do very well in wrestling and weight-lifting, so that's already seen as a comparatively trustworthy way for a big man with some talent to earn a living and get a decent public profile. There's no incentive for them to go into MMA, and especially not with US-Iran relations the way they are. Russia has combat sombo and amateur wrestling, and again - Russia-US relations aren't what they used to be. Central Asia, like the various -stans and Mongolia, would have the talent pool, but they too already have well-established career paths into wrestling and weight-lifting, and, in Mongolia's case, sumo-wrestling too. In Japan, big men tend to go into sumo or judo, even with the popularity of MMA and K-1 (they're sort of seen as low-brow in comparison to the more traditional sports, because of the whole spectacle aspect, and the yakuza taint). I'm thinking that the best chance the UFC has of re-invigorating the HW division is by either raiding Bellator or One FC or whatever, or using whatever connections they have through their Polish or Scandinavian roster to encourage interest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members Egg Shen Posted November 28, 2017 Paid Members Share Posted November 28, 2017 Heavyweight is a weird one because like previously stated, American's in particular who are that big and that athletic go into the NFL. Id imagine if the athletes that play American Football all started off doing MMA or Boxing there would be some unbelievable fighters about. It's a division that comes and goes in waves though, boxing is in a better shape than it has been in a while and MMA will likely go the same way. Heavyweight's always get my attention though, if i scan a prelim card, a heavyweight fight will jump out at me even if im not really familiar with the fighters involved. I do find it odd that certain promotions don't have heavweight divisions too, Cage Warriors for example have only just brought it back after 5 years, im off the thinking that even if the stanard in the division is lower than the rest of the promotion, there's always gonna be an interest in seeing two big blokes battering each other. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members Carbomb Posted November 28, 2017 Paid Members Share Posted November 28, 2017 I will admit that, whilst I understand the fascination with heavyweights on the surface of things, I don't understand why more discerning fans like them so much. It strikes me that the percentage of fights showcasing good technique and elite ability at HW is much lower than those at lower weights. I always found the lower weights to be much more exciting, even in boxing, partly because they go at 100mph and there's usually a lot more high-level technique on display. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members ColinBollocks Posted November 28, 2017 Paid Members Share Posted November 28, 2017 A lot of great points already made, but I think the top 5 standard at HW is bloody terrifyingly high, if general buzz for the division isn't. I mean, you've got Stipe, 'Reem, Cain, Werdum, Ngannou and Hunt all in there - 5 of them are undoubtably some of the best of all time, with Ngannou playing the part of king in waiting. In general, HW seems to be an old man division, for some reason, which definitely never helps the old freshness part of the match ups. There is talk of the likes of Jones, DC and Rumble fighting in the division, which needs to happen, because it freshens up both HW and LHW. I think if Ngannou shows he's worth the hype, then you've got all manner of fresh match ups for a couple of years. LHW is really where the pain is at. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members Bus Surfer Posted November 28, 2017 Paid Members Share Posted November 28, 2017 10 minutes ago, Carbomb said: I will admit that, whilst I understand the fascination with heavyweights on the surface of things, I don't understand why more discerning fans like them so much. It strikes me that the percentage of fights showcasing good technique and elite ability at HW is much lower than those at lower weights. I always found the lower weights to be much more exciting, even in boxing, partly because they go at 100mph and there's usually a lot more high-level technique on display. I guess it just comes down to people enjoy seeing the big guys go at it. There's a certain intrigue watching two 'bigger than your average man' blokes throwing down. Theres an aura of unpredictability and spectacle about it. It's a Cliché, but I can only take one punch at that kind of weight. I'm the same. These days I'll scan through the Prelims for any names I know. But I'll always watch the heavyweights go at it, regardless of who's fighting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members wandshogun09 Posted November 28, 2017 Author Paid Members Share Posted November 28, 2017 Ngannou is the man. Whether he wins or loses on Saturday he's probably my favourite heavyweight now Big Nog's retired and JDS is winding down. He's got everything you could want in a heavyweight - the look, the fighting style, the KO power, the aura - and he's really likeable with it, has a really cool backstory coming from being homeless to where he is now. There's literally nothing to dislike about big Francis. I hope he knocks Overeem's face off and goes on to win the title. Stipe's a tremendous fighter but I've never really warmed to him for some reason. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members ColinBollocks Posted November 28, 2017 Paid Members Share Posted November 28, 2017 I dig Stipe, but he's another Mighty Mouse, innit. Brilliant fighter, but pretty much nothing resembling charisma. The fact he's such a good HW and is not even slightly a decent draw speaks for itself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OzExile Posted November 29, 2017 Share Posted November 29, 2017 10 hours ago, ColinBollocks said: I dig Stipe, but he's another Mighty Mouse, innit. Brilliant fighter, but pretty much nothing resembling charisma. The fact he's such a good HW and is not even slightly a decent draw speaks for itself. The Heavyweight belt is a draw though. I'd be made up if they chose that belt as a main event for a PPV I was attending. I wouldn't give up on Stipe just yet. GSP has to be the blueprint for him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members ColinBollocks Posted November 29, 2017 Paid Members Share Posted November 29, 2017 You type that, but the belt on Stipe hasn't been much of a draw at all. Belts mean nothing, tis the cock/fanny that hangs below the waist. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimufctna24 Posted November 29, 2017 Share Posted November 29, 2017 I'm pretty neutral to Miocic as a person. I enjoy watching him fight though. He hasn't been in a stinker in years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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