FFTHEWINNER Posted May 26, 2017 Share Posted May 26, 2017 Raven in that return should have primarily acted as a manager IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members BomberPat Posted May 26, 2017 Paid Members Share Posted May 26, 2017 On paper I agree with you, but for who? I can't think of anyone in the promotion at the time that I'd have stuck him with. I remember an article in the old WWF magazine suggesting that Raven was looking to form a new version of The Flock in the WWF - I can't remember exactly who was purported to be in it, but I definitely remember they suggested that The Godfather would go back to being Papa Shango to become a member, and I suspect Perry Saturn and maybe Stevie Richards were involved through their history with Raven, can't remember if there was anyone else. Hardly sounds like a menacing heel threat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liam O'Rourke Posted May 26, 2017 Share Posted May 26, 2017 I remember there was talk in late 2000 on the TELETEXT WRESTLING HOTLINE that a new group led by Raven would include Tazz, Saturn and the Dudleyz. But he just did clean jobs to Steve Blackman on Raw instead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daaaaaad! Posted May 26, 2017 Share Posted May 26, 2017 I still remember thinking the match that summed up the Invasion more than any was on Heat - Kaientai vs. Raven & Justin Credible. Two perennial jobbers in WWF against two former ECW Champions. Kaientai won handily. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members bAzTNM#1 Posted May 27, 2017 Paid Members Share Posted May 27, 2017 On 5/23/2017 at 2:48 PM, LaGoosh said: Heel Stone Cold vs Spike Dudley is maybe my favorite mini-fued ever. If only for the following brilliant quotes:  Austin: You sign this petition and then pass it to your bimbo girlfriend. Spike: What did you call her? Austin: Molly? She's a bimbo, ain't you heard? Spike: You can't talk about her that way! Austin: Of course I can, I'm Stone Cold Steve Austin! and "YOU AIN'T GETTING NO TITLE SHOT, YOU LITTLE BASTARD!"  Yeah and the match is absolute peach too. Must be on the Network now in the Smackdown section. Whatever happened to Spike Dudley? Cheers! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Van Dammer Posted May 27, 2017 Share Posted May 27, 2017 I find the Steve Austin heel turn to be one of the most overly criticised decisions in wrestling. I'm even more amazed that alot of this criticism seems to come from Austin himself, who seems to ignore all of the obvious reasons for the turn and instead worries about his legacy as a fan favourite being tarnished. From what Austin says, the main reason for the turn was that his body was breaking down and he couldnt wrestle with the same babyface style and have anymore than a short run left. He needed to wrestle less and take less bumps when he did, so a heel turn is the only option other than retire. Then theres the fact that he'd been a full on face for 4 years by this point at a time where turns were a weekly occurance and as has been mentioned, The Rock had firmly taken on the role of number one babyface in his absence and possibly even surpassed him upon his return. Then factor in the fact that he effectively turned face again shortly after when the invasion kicked on only to turn heel again, which youd have thought that if Austin felt it was falling as flat as it was he wouldve remained face at this point. On top of that, he was virtually retired just over a year later and eventually fully retired a year after that due to his health. Personally though, I remember enjoying it at the time, it seemed like logical character development in that the dominant champion who starts to decline ends up doing everything he can to cling to what he once was and loses the plot int he process. If anything, what seemed odd is that he would turn face again after the WCW angle had ended. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members BomberPat Posted May 27, 2017 Paid Members Share Posted May 27, 2017 28 minutes ago, Van Dammer said: Â The Rock had firmly taken on the role of number one babyface in his absence and possibly even surpassed him upon his return. Then factor in the fact that he effectively turned face again shortly after when the invasion kicked on only to turn heel again, which youd have thought that if Austin felt it was falling as flat as it was he wouldve remained face at this point. The Rock left the day after Austin turned heel, though, so him being number one babyface didn't really play into it any more - and there was no one else at Austin or Rock's level to step up. Austin never really turned face in the Invasion angle - he was a "face" for one segment on the last RAW before the Invasion PPV, then turned on Team WWF six days later. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 27, 2017 Share Posted May 27, 2017 10 hours ago, bAzTNM#1 said: Whatever happened to Spike Dudley? I believe he's a teacher now. Was gutted that during the Dudleyz return the other year that Spike didn't return during the New Day feud to cancel out Xavier. I'd have popped huge for that, Spike was one of my favs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members wandshogun09 Posted May 28, 2017 Paid Members Share Posted May 28, 2017 On 27 May 2017 at 1:28 PM, Van Dammer said: From what Austin says, the main reason for the turn was that his body was breaking down and he couldnt wrestle with the same babyface style and have anymore than a short run left. He needed to wrestle less and take less bumps when he did, so a heel turn is the only option other than retire. Surely he took more bumps as a heel though? As a babyface he was brawling a lot but when he turned heel he was forever bouncing around for Undertaker and Kane, getting suplexed all over the shop by Benoit and Angle, bumping for Jericho and RVD and guys like that. I thought a lot of his in ring work as a heel in 2001 was closer to his stuff in WCW as Stunning Steve, which made for some really good matches but looking back probably shortened his career that bit more. No wonder he was physically shot and burnt out by early 2002. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members Arch Stanton Posted May 28, 2017 Paid Members Share Posted May 28, 2017 Yeah that's nonsense about turning heel to work a less physical style, Austin bumped like mad in his heel run. He has said numerous times on his podcast that the reason for the turn was because he felt that his character was becoming stale and that he wanted a change of scene creatively. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 29, 2017 Share Posted May 29, 2017 Austin was stale when he came back. He seemed almost out of place as the rock/hhh had led a great year. Coming back to feud with rikishi was weird, then the weirder HHH feud which probably should have been the first. Character needed changed and freshened up Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snitsky's back acne Posted May 30, 2017 Share Posted May 30, 2017 Heel Austin gave us the 'What!?' chant and for that reason alone it was a terrible decision. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 30, 2017 Share Posted May 30, 2017 23 minutes ago, Snitsky's back acne said: Heel Austin gave us the 'What!?' chant and for that reason alone it was a terrible decision. Alexa had the best comeback I've heard to that chant last night Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snitsky's back acne Posted May 31, 2017 Share Posted May 31, 2017 11 hours ago, sj5522 said: Alexa had the best comeback I've heard to that chant last night She absolutely did. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted June 1, 2017 Share Posted June 1, 2017 On 2017-5-27 at 5:31 PM, sj5522 said: Was gutted that during the Dudleyz return the other year that Spike didn't return during the New Day feud to cancel out Xavier. I'd have popped huge for that, Spike was one of my favs. They even stood in the ring and introduced a returning buddy of theirs to even up the odds, extreme style, and out walked... Tommy Dreamer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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