Paid Members Egg Shen Posted December 30, 2015 Paid Members Share Posted December 30, 2015 that gif. pretty much sums up the Hawaiian shows, it looks like a completely different era. Hawaiian fighters are generally badass too, different breed around those parts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members wandshogun09 Posted December 30, 2015 Author Paid Members Share Posted December 30, 2015 Short clip of Robbie Lawler answering fan questions on Periscope...  https://www.youtube.com/watch?app=desktop&persist_app=1&v=aS-41XwGGjg  "I'd knock out GSP if he comes back."  Now usually if someone asked me how I thought a Georges St Pierre vs Robbie Lawler fight would go I'd pick GSP every time. But at this point, going into 2016, I'm honestly not sure anymore. That sounds mental and I never ever thought the day would come when I'd be giving Lawler a shot against GSP, but it is actually an interesting fight now.  Fights are all about timing. If it happened in 2009, yeah, GSP mops the octagon with Lawler every single day, twice on Sunday. I've always believed that the GSP who dominated Thiago Alves at UFC 100 is as close to an unbeatable fighter as we've ever seen in MMA. If it happened in 2010, 2011, 2012, same result. Now though? Man, I'm not sure at all. GSP was never the same when he returned from that initial knee injury in 2012. He nearly lost to Condit on his return, started complaining about burnout and he was definitely slowing down by the time he fought Hendricks in 2013. Add another two years onto that where he's been inactive and injured again for a while, plus Lawler's improvements and the confidence he has in himself now. The gap has closed considerably, IMO.  Can you imagine though, if GSP did come back and just schooled this version of Robbie Lawler then retired for good? What an incredible moment that would be. Part of me wants to see him try. But really, I'd rather he left it alone. If you've been out of the game for two years, you were losing the love for it when you left, you've been picking up injuries left and right and you don't need the money - leave it alone. Robbie Lawler isn't someone to fuck around with if you're just coming back for a payday or to see if you've still got it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members lambyUK Posted December 30, 2015 Paid Members Share Posted December 30, 2015 I'd go as far Wand as saying Lawler now vs a peak GSP would still have a huge chance of winning. Â His takedown defence is incredible and he has a decent size advantage. Add his unreal knockout power and he's up there with the greatest welterweights of all time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members Egg Shen Posted December 30, 2015 Paid Members Share Posted December 30, 2015 GSP enjoyed making a mug of guys with supposed great takedown defence though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members wandshogun09 Posted December 30, 2015 Author Paid Members Share Posted December 30, 2015 Yeah GSP pretty much made a career out of outgrappling wrestlers. Hughes, Koscheck, Trigg etc. Even Alves was known for his killer takedown defence. I actually was fancying Alves to beat GSP at the time. People forget now because he's inconsistent these days but Alves was a beast back when GSP schooled him. Â It's not even that GSP was a better wrestler than Hughes, Koscheck etc either. But he was really, really, really fucking great at timing his takedowns just right and disguising his takedowns with his strikes. He was a master at that. His grappling opened up his opportunities to strike and his striking opened up his opportunities to grapple. The ultimate mixed martial artist. Â And Lawler has fell foul of strong grapplers before. Now you had to be a seriously high level grappler like Jacare Souza or Jake Shields to catch him but it is possible. IF you can find a way to keep him down long enough. Which is a big if. Especially now he's at 170. Those losses to Jacare and Shields were at 185. Lawler is not only a better fighter now than he was then, he's in a better weight class for him. Â Saying all that, Condit is a fucking animal. Excellent striking, unique movement, accurate as fuck, technical with very little wasted movement, great cardio, unbelievably tough and durable, if it goes to the ground he's very comfortable and always attacking there. This is nobody to overlook. Everyone's high on Robbie Lawler right now, and rightly so, but it's not an easy fight to call by any means. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimufctna24 Posted December 30, 2015 Share Posted December 30, 2015 Fights are all about timing. If it happened in 2009, yeah, GSP mops the octagon with Lawler every single day, twice on Sunday. I've always believed that the GSP who dominated Thiago Alves at UFC 100 is as close to an unbeatable fighter as we've ever seen in MMA To make that performance even more impressive, GSP suffered a groin injury in the middle rounds and still came through with relative ease. He was visibly in distress when the horn sounded to signal the end of the final round.  If we are talking fantasy match-ups, put the Robbie Lawler of today in there against the 2008 version of Thiago Alves. Now that would be interesting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members lambyUK Posted December 30, 2015 Paid Members Share Posted December 30, 2015 GSP enjoyed making a mug of guys with supposed great takedown defence though. He enjoyed great success against other wrestlers true, but other wrestlers don't necessarily possess great takedown defence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members wandshogun09 Posted December 30, 2015 Author Paid Members Share Posted December 30, 2015 He enjoyed great success against other wrestlers true, but other wrestlers don't necessarily possess great takedown defence. That's true. I guess Dan Henderson is the best example of that. Great wrestler but he was never all that good at defending takedowns. Even Wanderlei was taking him down in their first fight way back. And that was when Hendo was early on in his MMA career when you'd think he'd be more wrestling minded. Â A more recent example is Yoel Romero. An Olympic silver medalist yet surprisingly susceptible to being taken down. With Hendo's susceptibility to the takedown, I always kind of chalked it up to the fact that he was from a Greco background which is all upper body clinching. But Romero was a freestyle Olympic silver medalist. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members lambyUK Posted December 30, 2015 Paid Members Share Posted December 30, 2015 I think this era has fucking monsters that GSP never had to face. At the time Alves was considered the beast but we've moved into a whole new ball game with Lawler, Hendricks, Woodley, Maia, and Condit somehow making 170. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members Egg Shen Posted December 30, 2015 Paid Members Share Posted December 30, 2015 I think that's a little unfair. GSP still dominated and beat an incredible bunch of fighters. It's always easy to look back in hindsight and pick things apart but i think prime GSP would still probably be the no. 1 guy in the world if he was competing now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members lambyUK Posted December 30, 2015 Paid Members Share Posted December 30, 2015 Its completely fair Ebb. Its a fact that welterweights are much bigger these days. Even GSP has come out and said the same. Â This isn't having a go at GSP's legacy, he faced great opponents, but you can't deny there's far bigger fuckers making welterweight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members Egg Shen Posted December 30, 2015 Paid Members Share Posted December 30, 2015 Not all of them, Thiago Alves was a fucking tank of a welterweight back in the day. He was cutting 25-30lb to make the weight. Â ...and regardless, all of the guys you mentioned were active when GSP was competing. It aint like fighters got a that much bigger once GSP left, and besides, GSP beat two of the guys you listed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members wandshogun09 Posted December 30, 2015 Author Paid Members Share Posted December 30, 2015 Yeah, all the divisions have become bigger over the last few years. You look at middleweight now and the top guys are every bit as big as the top light heavyweights of years ago. Put Weidman, Rockhold and Romero next to Liddell, Ortiz and Couture, for example. You've got the likes of Brandon Thatch making 170 and looking like a 205er. Â 205 is much more a 'bigger man's weight class' now. Tito Ortiz and Forrest Griffin used to be considered monster light heavies. Now you've got Jon Jones, Alexander Gustafsson, Jimi Manuwa, Glover Teixeira, OSP. These are big fuckers. It's nuts when you see Cormier in there who was a top heavyweight and he's getting dwarved by these guys. I know he was a tiny heavyweight but still. It's a division that not that long ago was ruled by guys like Machida, Evans and Shogun. They're all smaller than the top middleweights of today. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members Egg Shen Posted December 30, 2015 Paid Members Share Posted December 30, 2015 The IV ban may put a stop to some of that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members lambyUK Posted December 30, 2015 Paid Members Share Posted December 30, 2015 Not all of them, Thiago Alves was a fucking tank of a welterweight back in the day. He was cutting 25-30lb to make the weight. Â ...and regardless, all of the guys you mentioned were active when GSP was competing. It aint like fighters got a that much bigger once GSP left, and besides, GSP beat two of the guys you listed. I've already addressed Alves and look at Alves in comparison to today's welterweights. Â Just look how Alves looked against Condit in terms of size. Â You seem to be taking offense despite me saying I'm not taking away anything of gsp's achievements. Â As Wand says everyone is bigger in all weight classes. Â You say they were active when GSP was fighting, but look at the two fights where he faced these bigger fighters. Â He was battered to a pulp against Hendricks (despite winning), and came close to being finished by Condit. Against the bigger guys he took far more punishment. This is a testament to how good GSP is, but the point is, going back to where it started, Lawler is a huge fucker and is a different beast for a GSP, even in his prime. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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