Paid Members Supremo Posted November 21, 2018 Paid Members Share Posted November 21, 2018 Remember when they were adamant on not pulling the trigger on Daniel Bryan, so had people like Big Show doing the Yes chant? Deja vu. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MVP RULZ Posted November 21, 2018 Share Posted November 21, 2018 Bit of a disappointing Smackdown on the whole, the fact Smackdown got Swept/lost 6-1 I was expecting some repercussions and having the whole roster in the ramp or in the ring to start the show and give them a dressing down for that showing on Sunday but it was only mentioned in passing. We know the whole Raw vs Smakdown premise is pretty pointless but at least put some effort into getting stories from it. Why should anyone care next year? If even a sweep for one show is pretty much an afterthought come 2 days later. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members tiger_rick Posted November 21, 2018 Paid Members Share Posted November 21, 2018 It wasn't like they ignored it given Xavier Woods had a 6-1 on his dress and Paige pretty much congratulated Charlotte for battering Rousey with a chair. There just wasn't any storyline progression because of it. Instead you had the Commissioner working a cmedy tag match with Miz (which I enjoyed actually). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members Fatty Facesitter Posted November 21, 2018 Paid Members Share Posted November 21, 2018 This obsession with heel turns and mixed messages at the moment is 2000 WCW levels of odd. You've got Bryan going heel last week on Smackdown, effectively wrestling babyface at Survivor Series, then cutting a heel promo where's talking about the Yes movement dying, yet he's got the fucking YES YES YES plate on the belt and he's talking about fighting for his dream and how it came true? Didn't he then face Miz post-tapings as well? I don't even know what they're going for with Charlotte. Again, you have the apparent heel turn at Survivor Series, a heel promo to kick off Smackdown and then she goes up against...two heels? I appreciate that it's perfectly plausible for babyfaces to fight babyfaces and heels to fight heels from time to time, but if they're going with these two turns in particular at least have the balls to go full throttle with them. Their obsession with heel turns at the moment is bizarre. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeronimoJacksBeard Posted November 21, 2018 Share Posted November 21, 2018 Yeah, I loved Ronda vs Charlotte at Survivor Series. I’m not usually that much of a fan of Charlotte, as talented as she is, but I was completely into that match and loved the scrappy, real feeling of it. I like my wrestling like that. Started to occur to me that this is how the Becky match should have been. Then the turn and beat down occurred and not to sound like Bret Hart, but felt as though Charlotte had just completely taken all of Beckys heat and that this was definitely setting up a rematch at ‘Mania. All a bit backwards if Becky has lost her spot now, whist Jax is getting pushed. Be a shame if Beckys momentum is all but lost once she’s back in the picture, got faith in her making good of this too though. As it’s funny that this turn of events pretty much mirrors the initial Becky turn/situation from the summer (except that in storyline she picked Charlotte herself). Not entirely sure how exactly you get there with Becky still holding the belt, unless you just strip her of it in the meantime due to the injury, but Becky and Charlotte should really be the final two in the Rumble. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members BomberPat Posted November 21, 2018 Paid Members Share Posted November 21, 2018 14 minutes ago, Fatty Facesitter said: Their obsession with heel turns at the moment is bizarre. In fairness, their hand has been forced by the absence of Roman Reigns (and to a much lesser extent Becky Lynch). There's probably been a lot of panicked rushing around to redress the balance, and get things in place for a wholly restructured Wrestlemania card. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members Supremo Posted November 21, 2018 Paid Members Share Posted November 21, 2018 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members Fatty Facesitter Posted November 21, 2018 Paid Members Share Posted November 21, 2018 44 minutes ago, BomberPat said: In fairness, their hand has been forced by the absence of Roman Reigns (and to a much lesser extent Becky Lynch). There's probably been a lot of panicked rushing around to redress the balance, and get things in place for a wholly restructured Wrestlemania card. The Raw changes I understand to a degree due to the Reigns situation, but the Smackdown changes are still pretty baffling. It isn't so much the turns themselves that I find confusing, but the actual dynamics of how they've been booked and their actions since then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members BomberPat Posted November 21, 2018 Paid Members Share Posted November 21, 2018 5 minutes ago, Fatty Facesitter said: The Raw changes I understand to a degree due to the Reigns situation, but the Smackdown changes are still pretty baffling. It isn't so much the turns themselves that I find confusing, but the actual dynamics of how they've been booked and their actions since then. The Smackdown changes will still likely have had a knock-on effect from injuries; obviously the situation with Becky Lynch forced their hand to some extent with Charlotte, but even with someone like Daniel Bryan, they've probably had to reconsider the lay of the land for shows like the Rumble and Wrestlemania in a way that covers both shows. I agree that, from the sounds of things, they've not been handled well. I don't know if they're trying to work it in such a way that they can try and have their cake and eat it too, by booking someone as a heel but not risking losing any merch sales or whatever from their hardcore fans, or if they're genuinely deep in the "there's no such thing as a face or a heel any more" logic that Triple H occasionally espouses (and which is utter bollocks). I think part of the problem with Charlotte's turn isn't that - as a lot of people are suggesting - they're trying to turn her into Becky Lynch, but that the product is so stale and so repetitive that the audience will cheer any change at all. I can't remember the last time a heel turn happened in main roster WWE that wasn't met with applause and cheers, either because it's a turn people have long been expecting and looking forward to, or because people are just happy they saw something fucking happen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members Bus Surfer Posted November 21, 2018 Paid Members Share Posted November 21, 2018 3 minutes ago, BomberPat said: the product is so stale and so repetitive that the audience will cheer any change at all. This is it really, isn't it? There's only so many times you can see the same people wrestle each other over and over without any real progression or change to their character, before absolutely any change will do. I guess it wasn't really an issue years back without the monstrous TV schedule they have today. Over exposure and treading water don't mix. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members BomberPat Posted November 21, 2018 Paid Members Share Posted November 21, 2018 7 minutes ago, Silky Kisser said: I guess it wasn't really an issue years back without the monstrous TV schedule they have today. Over exposure and treading water don't mix. Absolutely this. I rewatched some WWF PPVs from 2001 not that long ago, and what shocked me was the sheer rate of change. Even being out of the rapid fire "crash TV" of the Attitude Era, the month between PPVs felt like a lifetime in terms of storytelling - in a good way. And that's with considerably less TV time than they have now. Admittedly, 2001 is an anomaly with the influx of WCW talent, but even so, consider this... At Wrestlemania 17: Jericho is IC Champion, Kane wins the Hardcore Title, Eddie Guerrero wins the European Title, Chyna wins the Women's Title, Edge & Christian win the Tag Titles, Austin wins the WWF Title from The Rock (and turns heel, obviously), Undertaker beats Triple H. By Backlash, less than a month later: Triple H has turned heel and won the Intercontinental Title, Matt Hardy is European Champion, Kane and Undertaker are Tag Team Champions, but they lose them on this show to Austin and Triple H. At Judgment Day, again less than a month later; Kane beats Triple H for the Intercontinental Title, Austin beats The Undertaker, Jericho & Benoit become number one contenders for the tag team titles. By King of the Ring, the following month; The Dudley Boyz retain the Tag Team Titles against Kane & Spike Dudley. So not only have Austin & Triple H dropped the tag belts, the team that beat them have subsequently dropped the tag belts, and are now facing a mismatched team where Kane is a token big man partner for Spike Dudley, because his partnership with The Undertaker has come to an end. The next show is Invasion, at which point it all goes mental, but look how much was going on in the midcard back then. Compare it to now, where - current spate of heel turns aside - every show looks and feels exactly the same, and half the roster feel like they've been working the same gimmick, and wrestling the same matches, for 20 years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members air_raid Posted November 21, 2018 Paid Members Share Posted November 21, 2018 4 hours ago, BomberPat said: they're genuinely deep in the "there's no such thing as a face or a heel any more" logic that Triple H occasionally espouses (and which is utter bollocks). His booking of NXT indicates strongly that he doesn't believe that. If he's said it, it's because it's what he thinks Dad wants to hear him say 4 hours ago, BomberPat said: I can't remember the last time a heel turn happened in main roster WWE that wasn't met with applause and cheers, either because it's a turn people have long been expecting and looking forward to, or because people are just happy they saw something fucking happen. .I might be wrong but I think Seth leaving The Shield by thumping Deano with a chair was met by loud boos. That was a change nobody wanted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators PowerButchi Posted November 22, 2018 Moderators Share Posted November 22, 2018 13 hours ago, BomberPat said: Absolutely this. I rewatched some WWF PPVs from 2001 not that long ago, and what shocked me was the sheer rate of change. Even being out of the rapid fire "crash TV" of the Attitude Era, the month between PPVs felt like a lifetime in terms of storytelling - in a good way. And that's with considerably less TV time than they have now. Admittedly, 2001 is an anomaly with the influx of WCW talent, but even so, consider this... At Wrestlemania 17: Jericho is IC Champion, Kane wins the Hardcore Title, Eddie Guerrero wins the European Title, Chyna wins the Women's Title, Edge & Christian win the Tag Titles, Austin wins the WWF Title from The Rock (and turns heel, obviously), Undertaker beats Triple H. By Backlash, less than a month later: Triple H has turned heel and won the Intercontinental Title, Matt Hardy is European Champion, Kane and Undertaker are Tag Team Champions, but they lose them on this show to Austin and Triple H. At Judgment Day, again less than a month later; Kane beats Triple H for the Intercontinental Title, Austin beats The Undertaker, Jericho & Benoit become number one contenders for the tag team titles. By King of the Ring, the following month; The Dudley Boyz retain the Tag Team Titles against Kane & Spike Dudley. So not only have Austin & Triple H dropped the tag belts, the team that beat them have subsequently dropped the tag belts, and are now facing a mismatched team where Kane is a token big man partner for Spike Dudley, because his partnership with The Undertaker has come to an end. The next show is Invasion, at which point it all goes mental, but look how much was going on in the midcard back then. Compare it to now, where - current spate of heel turns aside - every show looks and feels exactly the same, and half the roster feel like they've been working the same gimmick, and wrestling the same matches, for 20 years. That looks like a whole lot of hotshotting to me, that wasn't healthy at all was it. NO wonder WWF declined so much that year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members tiger_rick Posted November 22, 2018 Paid Members Share Posted November 22, 2018 2 hours ago, PowerButchi said: That looks like a whole lot of hotshotting to me, that wasn't healthy at all was it. NO wonder WWF declined so much that year. Of course it wasn't healthy long term but it was interesting. More interesting than they've been since someone saw some mid-South tapes in 2002 and decided that's how you book pro-wrestling. Then never worked out how you do that with 3/4/5/6 hours of TV a week and 18 PPVs a year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators PowerButchi Posted November 22, 2018 Moderators Share Posted November 22, 2018 I wish WWE was booked like Mid-South. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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