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Raw, 19/11/12


NEWM

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It's hard to know whether people are really into Ziggler, or if they just like the fact he gets thrown around and gives a damn good bump. As you say, he's not had any real consistency at the top of the card to give any indication that he belongs there.

 

They need to at least give it a shot and see if the crowd really take to him - and I mean regular crowds, not just the occasional smarky ones.

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Stupid question, but how often is Monday Night Football boradcast in the States? Being involved in the same timeslot must be a bigger kick in the knackers at the moment. It seems unthinkable given that it's a Monday institution, but would a move to a Tuesday night slot be viable? Smackdown used to cope well in it's original run on a Thursday night too on UPN.

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MNF isn't the reason the viewership numbers are at 15 year lows. Its keeping viewers WWE has a problem with. There's something drastically wrong with the shows if 800,000 people can leave and then comeback in half an hour to see if its any better. The quarter hour patterns are quite ridiculous, when you look at them. Moving nights wouldn't be any better. It would be a killer for moral and send out the wrong message. If they put on something people want to watch, they will watch it. But that hasn't been the case for a while now.

 

We also live in a world where there are fewer wrestling fans than ever now. In the mid-90s, as bad as things were there seemed to be an audience out there to bring back. It doesn't seem that way anymore. People seem to have moved on. Its not like this is a start of a decline or anything either. Few and fewer people have been watching since late 2000. Its an almost 13 year decline.

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MNF isn't the reason the viewership numbers are at 15 year lows. Its keeping viewers WWE has a problem with. There's something drastically wrong with the shows if 800,000 people can leave and then comeback in half an hour to see if its any better. The quarter hour patterns are quite ridiculous, when you look at them. Moving nights wouldn't be any better. It would be a killer for moral and send out the wrong message. If they put on something people want to watch, they will watch it. But that hasn't been the case for a while now.

 

We also live in a world where there are fewer wrestling fans than ever now. In the mid-90s, as bad as things were there seemed to be an audience out there to bring back. It doesn't seem that way anymore. People seem to have moved on. Its not like this is a start of a decline or anything either. Few and fewer people have been watching since late 2000. Its an almost 13 year decline.

 

I quite agree, and you're point about the 800,000 people switching off is what prompted my thread about rebuilding in five ways or less. Here I was thinking more along the lines that it might be another drastic measure they might want to consider. If so many people are watching MNF during the same timeslot, even the smallest fraction of that combined with the hardcore audience who are staying put might be enough to paper over the cracks for a bit.

 

That picture of all the empty seats really is depressing.

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That picture of all the empty seats really is depressing.

 

It's probably a good thing if it gets WWE's arse into gear. It's time to go back to basics and remember what made wrestling fun, and that isn't Touting and trending on Twitter. It's putting on solid storylines with characters people can invest in. Scripting everything beforehand is just killing off any creativity and allowing someone to make that breakthrough.

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The number they got for the 1000 Raw episode shows that there are still a healthy chunk of fans out there, but it's clear they don't really care much for the current roster/product, as they pissed off once the proper stars left.

 

I'd also argue that Raw is badly needing some changes to its format, rather than some fancy new set. Ever since they pinched Bischoff's ideas they've made little change in 15 years (well, they have gone back to old habits and ripped off the voice-over re-cap TNA do). Anything will come across as stale, when the show is a bit of a fossil.

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Team Hell No vs. Rey/Sin Cara was a fun tag match, horrible commentary aside, and they didn't give away too much for a future encounter.

 

Eh? The commentary in that match was fantastic. Titus O'Neil was on fire.

 

Funnily, I've just finished watching Raw and came into the thread to say that IMO, the absolute highlight of what was for me quite a lengthy, dull show was the seemingly genuinely good natured banter between Lawler and O'Neil dressed up as pro wrestling arguing. Great fun. Each to their own, I suppose.

 

Also, WWE have really missed a trick by not having Punk in a

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I really want to see Titus go on his own in a singles run. He's been great, whereas Darren Young has been a bumbling idiot in the majority of speaking opportunities. Plus hes gash in the ring. Titus carrying Sin Cara by one hand on the PPV was great, like he was carrying a toddler.

 

The guys got the look, he can put on a good match and can clearly improv when given the chance. He is the real deal.

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Three hours is just too long for a weekly wrestling show on tv. They simply cannot keep people tuned in throughout the entire show, when the show is that long.

 

Back when the show was 2 hours in length, the 2nd hour very rarely did lower average rating than the 1st hour. Personally, the decline can be pinpointed as beginning back in 2011, when they had Michael Cole as a heel play by play announcer, burying all of the talent and making it incredibly hard to get anyone over, or any storylines or concepts over. Then they had the charisma-free John Laurinaitis as G.M., a poor performer by usual WWE on-air-talent standards, who was another big turn off.

 

The practice of fans tuning out during the 2nd hour started happening before the permanent 3 hour Raws started, although it wasn't a consistent thing.

 

The introduction of weekly 3 hour Raws simply exacerbated a growing problem.

 

In the first 8 months of this year, only 5 RAWs did below a 3.0 rating - Jan 9, May 14, May 28, Jun 4 and Aug 13.

 

Since August 27th (12 RAWs since that date), not one single RAW has done a rating higher than 2.95.

 

That illustrates how the viewership has declined since 3 hour RAWs came into place.

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I think it's mad not to factor in Monday Night Football in Raw's ratings drops. Especially since Gary Neville started doing it. He's a fucking draw.

 

:laugh:

 

I'm still amazed by how palatable he is as a pundit. There was no-one in football I hated more about 12 years ago.

 

I rewatched the tag team with the PTP on commentary, Titus O'Neill was brilliant. If they got him on the mic every week speaking in that exact same style, he'd be a solid gold superstar in 6 months.

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The thing is, wrestling is just (from every which angle) anachronistic in 2012. It doesn't tick any of the boxes for what the mass market looks for in an entertainment product.

 

Every medium is chasing 'gritty', 'realism' an 'edgy' and there is a reaction against feeling lied to or 'worked' and a clamour to have stars brought to the level of punter through TV and social media. WWE have tried half-heartedly to acknowledge the latter, but still throw out gimmicked tweets (Cena asking for tips on how to beat Ryback for example). In terms of the former wrestling is still a slab of eighties camp with oiled up geezers nobbing about in sparkly pants.

 

When the product is wrong, and the people feel like they are being worked, you're fucked. Wrestling is the X Factor.

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