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Raw discussion. 15/10/12 ***Spoilers***


IANdrewDiceClay

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If they could keep Rybacks streak going and strong, what are people's opinion on a Streak vs Streak match at 'Mania with Undertaker? Not saying that it will happen or thats what they should do, I just wondered what the thoughts would be on it.

 

20 years of history steak vs 5 mins of squash victories steak. Not buying it.

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I think you build your stars up for times where they can put over a new star and make them seem a big deal. Having Triple H/Brock is fine and they did good business, but these matches are short-term solutions. Somewhere along the line, the established stars need to put the new guy on the cusp of stardom over. Saying that, I think this year's Wrestlemania might possibly be too soon. They need to make absolutely certain they want to put their faith in him. Whereas Brock was very gifted but had his attention turned to NFL, Ryback has been with them for 7 years. I would say he's more likely to stick around so that's less of a risk.

 

Ryback would need to lose to Taker at Mania. He can still be credible after that loss and no one would think less of him as no one has beat him at Mania, so it'd be a good for his first loss. He couldn't win as he's not been on TV long enough. Personally, I think he'd need a hell of a big push to face Taker. If Triple H faces Brock, there's a spot open to face Taker. It feels like Taker's opponents need to be the absolute elite at the moment. Either Ryback would be elevated by association or it'd be a let down where everyone knows Taker will win. That's all in the quality of the booking.

 

Sorry, writing this on a phone and it's a stream of consciousness. Gladstone Small might have ammunition for me being a terrible poster/tosser.

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from everyone's favourite magazine editor on twitter

 

It's C.M. Punk vs. Ryback at HIAC because John Cena has not been medically cleared to do whatever it is he does in the ring . . .

 

Jesus Christ

 

I'm afraid I have to agree with him. It definitely does feel too rushed to feel like a proper push for Ryback, he's went from beating total jobbers to main eventing in 3 weeks, missing out the usual beating of established midcarders etc. What's even more surprising is that they've taken John Cena out of the equation altogether and by his own doing apparently(very un-Cena like), rather than making it a triple threat, I think it all points to Cena either not being medically cleared or him not being comfortable wrestling so soon after surgery. It seems that after they found out Cena couldn't wrestle at HIAC they needed to find someone else on the Raw roster that could look like a threat to Punk's reign and the only person that could do that is Ryback.

 

I'm going to side with those that think Punk will retain due to a Lesnar interference, it's timed well enough for him to be relevant to a story leading up to Survivor Series and it won't harm Ryback as much as a lot of the other ideas being flung around. Personally, I'm not happy with it because it will inevitably damage Ryback to an extent

and I can't see what they could do with him afterwards to make him seem as big a deal.

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I think the 'Jesus Christ' was aimed at the dig at Cena (whatever he does in the ring).

 

yeah it was.

 

The amount of stick he gives Cena is daft at the best of my times and i'm not cena's biggest fan but he's fantastic and his body of work backs it up and the insinuation that Cena "can't" wrestle is pathetic now

 

i would have put it in the usual thread where we take the piss out of him but for spoilers i put it here instead

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I think the 'Jesus Christ' was aimed at the dig at Cena (whatever he does in the ring).

 

yeah it was.

 

The amount of stick he gives Cena is daft at the best of my times and i'm not cena's biggest fan but he's fantastic and his body of work backs it up

 

i would have put it in the usual thread where we take the piss out of him but for spoilers i put it here instead

 

True, I can't think of the last match I saw Cena in that I didn't enjoy which is why I'm a bit gutted he won't be at HIAC, him and Punk bring out the best in each other. I think this Ryback thing is about to fall flat on it's face.

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Sorry, writing this on a phone and it's a stream of consciousness. Gladstone Small might have ammunition for me being a terrible poster/tosser.

 

No more ammunition needed. How's your girlfriend, by the way?

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I don't mind Ryback facing Punk for the WWE title. He's over like Rover, looks great and intimidating, and Punk does a great job of selling that intimidation. It's not a long standing feud that requires the gimmick of HIAC, but that's cool too, as the PPV is called Hell In A Cell, it's only fitting. However, if Ryback beats Punk for the WWE title, I'm going to be super pissed. Ryback hasn't shown an ability to do anything of substance, and the natural course of action is to have Punk continue his mega long title reign until the Rumble, where he faces his toughest challenge ever in The Rock.

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I don't mind Ryback facing Punk for the WWE title. He's over like Rover, looks great and intimidating

 

But he won't be over like Rover or look great and intimidating if he loses to a bloke who looks like a smackhead. And unless he does lose to a bloke who looks like a smackhead, you won't be happy. So the only way you really don't mind Ryback being in this match is if WWE decides to kill his gimmick in it.

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I don't mind Ryback facing Punk for the WWE title. He's over like Rover, looks great and intimidating

 

But he won't be over like Rover or look great and intimidating if he loses to a bloke who looks like a smackhead. And unless he does lose to a bloke who looks like a smackhead, you won't be happy. So the only way you really don't mind Ryback being in this match is if WWE decides to kill his gimmick in it.

Not at all. It's HIAC, they can pull out every gimmick, trick, run-in and the kitchen sink to beat Ryback. Goldberg didn't look less intimidating because he got tasered (if I'm remembering that right, my WCW history is a little shaky). No way should Punk pin Ryback clean. I was thinking that Lesnar rips off the Cell door and batters Ryback with some weapon (F5 onto steel stairs? Something like that). But Ryback is not championship material, at least not now.

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I'm pretty gutted Cena can't compete. As has been mentioned here already the gammy arm, rubber match in the Cell, Punks long reign to gloat over with Punk going over and Ryback lurking in the shadows could have provided some great story leading over the next few months to the Rumble and Mania had Cena and Punk been able to knock something up in there.

 

I understand that WWE have been somewhat forced into this booking situation (partly by themselves) but there was other options and regardless of the situation it's frustrating WWEs lack of patience and long term thinking with current/new stars. They use it tremendously with the bona-fide big guns but when building someone new they have zero patience. Planting Ryback in this situation has got a positive response. If they played this out long term until Mania they could make him in a big way. Had Punk continued to dodge him and Ryback continued to smash through guys, gradually bigger names and big guys too (putting him in with Menry would bd fucking great) then Punk faces Rock at the Rumble leaving Ryback to have to enter the Rumble as an obvious favourite. Tearing shit up on the Rumble match in a big way with lots if eyes on it could go a long way to really establishing him, but then you could have him win and go on to take the belt at Mania itself. The timespan would be similar to the monster push of Batista, timed and paced right people could be gagging to see Ryback take the strap at Mania, especially if Punk is still holding if by then and sneaks a victory over The Rock too.

 

That could still happen I suppose and there may be shenanigans at Hell in a Cell. Which doesn't necessarily have to be as detrimental to Ryback as others suggest, depending on how it plays out. I think winning the belt would actually be the most detrimental thing for him in the long run. As someone else mentioned, Ryback appears to be the right guy at the wrong time. I could be wrong though, I thought it was too soon for Lesnar at SummerSlam 2002 and really wasn't ready for him to take the title and thought being thrust into it could be a bad thing. The match and his performances afterwards (suddenly having cracking matches with everyone) sold me completely and I was all over him. Ryback could do the same but fuck knows where that leaves the Punk/Cena/Rock situation.

 

There was other options though as I say, but theyre clearly looking to establish someone new. They could have had a triple threat with Punk v Kane v Bryan though. They're major over right now, WWE are loving them and are all over TV, Kane and Bryan have thier own little feud and they've been mingling with Punk and that a bit anyway. And it's the sort of match AJ would book. And Kanes got some nice history with the Cell and this month. The tag tourney final could go on the same show with Rhodes Scholars celebrating like they're already champions as they're future opponents are already dysfunctional but about to face each other in Hell in a Cell for the WWE title.

 

I can't see past shenanigans at the Cell at the moment. The Cell itself I could see playing some sort of part in that.

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If they could keep Rybacks streak going and strong, what are people's opinion on a Streak vs Streak match at 'Mania with Undertaker? Not saying that it will happen or thats what they should do, I just wondered what the thoughts would be on it.

 

20 years of history steak vs 5 mins of squash victories steak. Not buying it.

 

These were intentional, weren't they? I'd buy a 20 years of history steak...

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Punk wins at HIAC by Lesnar interference which Heyman has arranged without Punk's knowledge.

 

Ryback vs Lesnar at Survivor Series or the Rumble, Ryback wins due to 'accidental' Punk interference. Punk vs Rock at Rumble ends with Lesnar screwing Punk out of the title.

 

Heel Punk loses to face Lesnar at Mania.

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