The new MMA general news, events and thoughts thread

[ColinBollocks]

Look at the timing. He's clearly stepped on the scales this morning, for the post-Christmas weigh-in, and realised he's got no chance of losing that much by March. 

 

[David]

Bottom line is, Cormier could have defended the strap against Jones if he'd really wanted to. We all know the UFC aren't knocking back that fight.

He didn't want it though, for obvious reasons. I don't blame him either. He's been a decent placeholder, but there comes a time when you need to know your limits.

[ColinBollocks]

All that gold must be a pain in the arse to carry too.

[David]

Just now, ColinBollocks said:

All that gold must be a pain in the arse to carry too.

It must be, but being the competitor that we all know DC to be be, he'll know deep down that he didn't actually win that light-heavy strap. He can say whatever he likes in public, but you can tell that he knows deep down he's always going to be second best to a guy who's not even really fought to his potential yet.

That must fucking kill him, someone as competitive as that. I'd hate to see what he'll be like as he gets older. It'll be like Frazier was with Ali.

[ColinBollocks]

He's the greatest heavyweight of all time. The hell are you on about?

Seriously, the money fight is Jones v DC at HW. I have no doubts that at LHW Jones probably beats DC always, but at HW DC has that power he's carrying plus weight cutting (Rogan.gif). Jones maybe wins there too, like, but at least there are more factors involved at that weight that may help DC. I mean he cleanly sparked out the former best heavyweight ever.

[David]

In all seriousness, I think Jones is just too elite. The only person who's ever going to beat Jones is Jones. 

At heavyweight I think Jones would be even better. He's a fucking machine when he's switched on and can be arsed, drugs or no drugs. The only question that has to be asked is at what point all of his shenanigans and inactivity starts to play a part? Could it be this fight coming up? Possibly.

As for DC, that guy needs to defend the heavyweight title a few times before he's even in the running as possibly the greatest in that division. A knock out of Stipe after a deft eye-poke doesn't quite cut the mustard really.

And a "title defence" against a 41 year old pro wrestler who's not been in a cage for over two years or a chump like Derrick Lewis doesn't really count. I can understand that he wants the money, but by avoiding the rematch with Stipe or facing another credible challenge he can't really be considered the greatest heavy of all time.

It's one of those rare occasions when the fat man can't have his cake, and eat it too.

[Egg Shen]

1 hour ago, David said:

 

As for DC, that guy needs to defend the heavyweight title a few times before he's even in the running as possibly the greatest in that division. 

possibly but DC's resume at before the return to heavyweight is pretty impressive. Dominant wins over Barnett, Mir, Bigfoot & Big Country are solid and are the types of names the other 'GOATs' have on their record. He may be 2 or 3 wins away from cementing the position but i dont think hes far off, especially when you consider hes dominated every heavyweight fight he's ever been in.

 

[wandshogun09]

1 hour ago, David said:

The only person who's ever going to beat Jones is Jones. 

But I thought he was innocent? If he’s always doing nothing wrong and it’s the system out to get the poor little lamb, how can Jones beat Jones? 🤔

Nah, seriously, you’re probably right but I wouldn’t say ‘ever’. Like anyone else, if Jon Jones hangs around long enough he’ll lose eventually like everyone else does. He’s a fucking ridiculously good fighter, and I can’t see him losing anytime soon to anyone who’s around right now (maybe a HW can do something...maybe) but if he sticks around long enough someone will come along and beat him. Nobody’s prime lasts forever. But in the end, I think you’re going to be correct because I don’t think we’ll get to find out. Sadly I think he’ll keep fucking up to the point that even the UFC, Dana, Novitsky, whoever can no longer defend him and sweep it under the rug and his career will end in a courtroom or worse. I honestly believe that. I’ve watched countless documentaries on murderers and sociopaths (my mrs is obsessed with these things, bit worrying) and Jones’ attitude isn’t too dissimilar to the wackjobs you see on those things. Not saying he’s going to go out and OJ someone (although...) but he has this thing where he keeps doing shit and finding ways and weird logic to justify it to himself and everyone around him keeps enabling it. It’s a recipe for something really bad, IMO. He’s definitely got a real nasty side as we saw with that reporter at the presser and the way he seamlessly went from calm and soft spoken to that, then back to laughing and being smarmy again is quite odd. He’s a weird fucker. 

All that aside, I do agree that DC never beats Jones. At any weight. And I agree Jones would likely wreck shop at heavyweight as well. 

But this ‘only Jones can beat Jones’ thing, I get it but it seems like a lot of people are getting that ready as an excuse in case he loses. How will we know? If Gustafsson somehow knocks him the fuck out tonight, Jones fans can then say ‘Jones beat himself. Too many distractions’. There might be merit to that but it’s weird how he’s had shit like this going on for ages and still looked spectacular in the cage. If he loses tonight though, I’m sure that’s the way it’ll be spun and Gus still won’t quite get the credit he deserves. It’ll all be about Jones and his issues. 

[David]

1 hour ago, wandshogun09 said:

But I thought he was innocent? If he’s always doing nothing wrong and it’s the system out to get the poor little lamb, how can Jones beat Jones? 🤔

Oh, he's far from innocent in the grand scheme of things. In this particular instance I think he isn't at fault, but he's there in the first place because of what he's done previously.

1 hour ago, wandshogun09 said:

Nah, seriously, you’re probably right but I wouldn’t say ‘ever’. Like anyone else, if Jon Jones hangs around long enough he’ll lose eventually like everyone else does. He’s a fucking ridiculously good fighter, and I can’t see him losing anytime soon to anyone who’s around right now (maybe a HW can do something...maybe) but if he sticks around long enough someone will come along and beat him. Nobody’s prime lasts forever. But in the end, I think you’re going to be correct because I don’t think we’ll get to find out. Sadly I think he’ll keep fucking up to the point that even the UFC, Dana, Novitsky, whoever can no longer defend him and sweep it under the rug and his career will end in a courtroom or worse. I honestly believe that. I’ve watched countless documentaries on murderers and sociopaths (my mrs is obsessed with these things, bit worrying) and Jones’ attitude isn’t too dissimilar to the wackjobs you see on those things. Not saying he’s going to go out and OJ someone (although...) but he has this thing where he keeps doing shit and finding ways and weird logic to justify it to himself and everyone around him keeps enabling it. It’s a recipe for something really bad, IMO. He’s definitely got a real nasty side as we saw with that reporter at the presser and the way he seamlessly went from calm and soft spoken to that, then back to laughing and being smarmy again is quite odd. He’s a weird fucker.

Thing is, non-MMA fans wouldn't be surprised to find that Jones is how he is. Again, as I've said elsewhere, he punches and kicks people in the face for a living. 

I know we get the whole "this is a sport" line trotted out every now & then, but as someone who's done my fair share of grappling over the years I simply could never fathom the notion of balling up my fist and throwing it at someone's face. I don't have it in me, and neither does most of the population.

I've been in close quarters with guys who fight MMA on the local circuit and in the UFC, and if I'm honest the vast majority have something missing between the ears, even if most of them could be considered a "good guy."

It takes a certain type of person to intentionally try to hurt another person, so it should come as no surprise when we see the darker side of these guys characters come to the fore. 

1 hour ago, wandshogun09 said:

But this ‘only Jones can beat Jones’ thing, I get it but it seems like a lot of people are getting that ready as an excuse in case he loses. How will we know? If Gustafsson somehow knocks him the fuck out tonight, Jones fans can then say ‘Jones beat himself. Too many distractions’. There might be merit to that but it’s weird how he’s had shit like this going on for ages and still looked spectacular in the cage. If he loses tonight though, I’m sure that’s the way it’ll be spun and Gus still won’t quite get the credit he deserves. It’ll all be about Jones and his issues. 

That's just how it is. He's been out for over a year again, and the build up to this fight has been anything but smooth for him, hasn't it? Not saying he doesn't deserve the grief he gets, but I do think that all of that kind of stuff probably poses him more issues than the actual fight itself.

[ColinBollocks]

The only reason Velasquez is considered the best heavyweight is because DC was nice enough not to fight him. 100% 1st round KO after Cain does a Stipe and tries to break DC's finger with his eyeball.

[wandshogun09]

1 hour ago, David said:

but as someone who's done my fair share of grappling over the years I simply could never fathom the notion of balling up my fist and throwing it at someone's face. I don't have it in me, and neither does most of the population.

It takes a certain type of person to intentionally try to hurt another person, so it should come as no surprise when we see the darker side of these guys characters come to the fore. 

I’m the same on the first bit. It’s a big part of the reason why I sacked off Boxing and Muay Thai as a teenager. That and just not being particularly good at either. Loved both but I just never had the killer instinct so what was the point? I think you’ve got to have something like that in you from an early age and I just didn’t. I’m lucky enough that I wasn’t bullied. I didn’t grow up with a lot of money but certainly didn’t suffer. My parents didn’t batter or molest me. I didn’t like to fight as a kid. The ingredients were never there. I think the vast majority of the top fighters we’ve ever seen in combat sports have something in their background that made them fight and have a hardnness the likes of us don’t understand. Muhammad Ali battled racism as a black man coming up in the American South in the fucking 50s and 60s, Johnny Tapia saw his mother murdered, guys like Roberto Duran and Manny Pacquiao grew up in poverty in Panama and the Philippines. Even a guy like GSP, he had that thing of being badly bullied as a kid that drove him to martial arts. The list goes on. The biggest struggle I had as a kid was having to wait until Christmas to see which SEGA Mega Drive games and WWF Hasbros I got. My dad never had to stack lettuces all day to make ends meet like Cain’s old man. 

Fighters definitely are a different breed and I’m not expecting impeccable behaviour from guys like that at all times. But with guys like Jones, and McGregor, it happens so often that it becomes something more than just ‘caveman fighter’ DNA or whatever. In life in general there are a ton of great people and also a staggeringly high percentage of cunts. And of course MMA is no different. So it’s not necessarily a surprise when some of these guys act like pricks, but it’s something that people are going to point out and rightly so. Nothing will change obviously, but the alternative is to not mention the dickhead behaviour at all and pretend it never happens. And that’s just weird. 

1 hour ago, David said:

That's just how it is. He's been out for over a year again, and the build up to this fight has been anything but smooth for him, hasn't it? Not saying he doesn't deserve the grief he gets, but I do think that all of that kind of stuff probably poses him more issues than the actual fight itself.

True but if we’re talking layoffs then Gustafsson has been out even longer. Jones last fought in July 2017. Gus fought May 2017. And the bulk of Gus’ layoff has been down to injuries so it’s not like he’s been able to train solidly for that 19 months or whatever it is. Whereas Jones wasn’t injured, he was suspended. He’s had 17 months to train and somehow get better, which is pretty fucking terrifying. Whether he’s actually done that fuck knows. Saw him saying he’s done a load of Boxing training in his time off in one of his interviews or pressers. Who knows? But aside from the mental shit surrounding all this USADA mess, I’d say his layoff probably wasn’t as disruptive as Gustafsson’s was. 

For what it’s worth, I think Jones wins tonight. And I think it’s going to be more clear cut than the first fight. As much as I can’t stand him, I have always believed that he didn’t take the first fight all that seriously. There were all kinds of rumours, at the time and since, that he’d slacked off training big time going into that one and was very overconfident and complacent. Gus still fought his arse off, that cant be taken away from him, but I definitely don’t think we saw the best version of Jones that night. And he still won. For all that was made about the decision, I really don’t think it was that controversial at all. Gus took 1 and 2, Jones took 4 and 5. It all hinged on the 3rd round and that really could’ve gone either way. Nobody got robbed. 

Whatever the case, it should be a great fight. I can’t pretend I’m not excited even with all this shite going on. 

[BigJag]

23 hours ago, wandshogun09 said:

But I thought he was innocent? If he’s always doing nothing wrong and it’s the system out to get the poor little lamb, how can Jones beat Jones? 🤔

Nah, seriously, you’re probably right but I wouldn’t say ‘ever’. Like anyone else, if Jon Jones hangs around long enough he’ll lose eventually like everyone else does. He’s a fucking ridiculously good fighter, and I can’t see him losing anytime soon to anyone who’s around right now (maybe a HW can do something...maybe) but if he sticks around long enough someone will come along and beat him. Nobody’s prime lasts forever. But in the end, I think you’re going to be correct because I don’t think we’ll get to find out. Sadly I think he’ll keep fucking up to the point that even the UFC, Dana, Novitsky, whoever can no longer defend him and sweep it under the rug and his career will end in a courtroom or worse. I honestly believe that. I’ve watched countless documentaries on murderers and sociopaths (my mrs is obsessed with these things, bit worrying) and Jones’ attitude isn’t too dissimilar to the wackjobs you see on those things. Not saying he’s going to go out and OJ someone (although...) but he has this thing where he keeps doing shit and finding ways and weird logic to justify it to himself and everyone around him keeps enabling it. It’s a recipe for something really bad, IMO. He’s definitely got a real nasty side as we saw with that reporter at the presser and the way he seamlessly went from calm and soft spoken to that, then back to laughing and being smarmy again is quite odd. He’s a weird fucker. 

All that aside, I do agree that DC never beats Jones. At any weight. And I agree Jones would likely wreck shop at heavyweight as well. 

But this ‘only Jones can beat Jones’ thing, I get it but it seems like a lot of people are getting that ready as an excuse in case he loses. How will we know? If Gustafsson somehow knocks him the fuck out tonight, Jones fans can then say ‘Jones beat himself. Too many distractions’. There might be merit to that but it’s weird how he’s had shit like this going on for ages and still looked spectacular in the cage. If he loses tonight though, I’m sure that’s the way it’ll be spun and Gus still won’t quite get the credit he deserves. It’ll all be about Jones and his issues. 

There was also something really strange about the way he was behaving in the toy store during the Embedded episode from this week. It's as if he's putting on a show for the camera. Comes across as very scummy.

[wandshogun09]

Read a few bits on Twitter that the UFC are trying to make Volkan Oezdemir vs Dominick Reyes for the London show in March. I like it. 

[WeeAl]

In the least surprising news of the year, Nick Diaz Vs Jorge Masvidal is confirmed as being off, according to Dana. UFC and the Diaz brothers are obviously very reluctant to do business together these days. It'd be great if another trade could be worked out where they could end up signed to Bellator instead, working for a promoter that they would be willing to step in the cage for.

It's hard to see a point in time where a Diaz brother will fight in the UFC again, and it'd be a shame if they never fought again at all, based on not being able to get out of their contracts but also not being able to work out their issues with Dana either. 

https://www.mmafighting.com/2019/1/1/18097700/nick-diaz-vs-jorge-masvidal-off-ufc-235

[David]

That's 4 years almost that Nick Diaz has been out of the cage. He's now 35 years old and has a record of 2-2-1 in his last five.

The dude isn't even relevant anymore if we're honest.

EDIT: What's this shit from Ali Abdelaziz on who Khabib will be fighting next? He beats Conor and all of a sudden he's the Dagestani Mayweather?

Quote

“The biggest money fight he can make. Boxing, MMA, whatever. I love Tony Ferguson— he’s not that, I can tell you that. One-hundred percent, Tony Ferguson is not the next fight, because Tony Ferguson — I need somebody who can sell pay-per-views."

Fuck that, get the fight with Ferguson rubber-stamped and let's get back to seeing the best facing the best, instead of all this bullshit where we've got dudes who can't draw a dime pretending they're businessmen and huge attractions.