Moderators Chest Rockwell Posted April 4, 2012 Moderators Share Posted April 4, 2012 He's also one of the first names mentioned if I ever ask people which wrestlers they've heard of or remember. Â Â Definitely this. I was chatting to this girl at work the other day aftwer watching 'Mania and she hasn't watched since she was a kid and that was the first name she asked about. Needless to say she was pretty shocked to learn he was still wrestling (and then really shocked when I told her Hogan was still knocking about). Â Anyway, whilst he may not have reached the peak of that 'top tier', for longevity and self-reinvention he is the Madonna of this wrestling shit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A Screen Up Posted April 4, 2012 Share Posted April 4, 2012 What are these 'tiers' based on? Are Hogan, Rock and Austin all in that top tier based on drawing ability? Â Pretty much. Â Those three were more over than any other wrestler ever, and by a rather substantial margin. The three were white hot stars and household names who all headlined peak periods in wrestling. Â On that basis, I think that King Pitcos' idea of placing John Cena on the same level as those three is incorrect. True, he's no doubt the fourth biggest wrestling star ever but he has never seen the same success as Hogan, Rock and Austin did. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThePhenom Posted April 4, 2012 Share Posted April 4, 2012 I guess you'd have a third tier of: Brock Lesnar, Bill Goldberg, Sting, Kevin Nash, Batista, Rowdy Roddy Piper, Mick Foley, Randy Orton, Kurt Angle? Â I would put The Ultimate Warrior in there as well, probably in place of either Piper or Orton. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheBigBoot Posted April 4, 2012 Share Posted April 4, 2012 Firstly, I'm sure we will all agree on one thing, formulating a list of the greatest of all time is exceptionally tough. Do you look at technical in-ring ability?  In ring ability, yes. Technical skills, not really.  Promo work?  Yes... Unless it is someone's gimmick that they didn't speak (Abby, Sabu, etc.) or they worked somewhere where promos weren't emphasised/important (like the UK scene). It's a bit unfair to compare guys who never got the chance to speak to a Lawler, Rhodes or Flair and say they sucked because of it.  Standard of matches?  Definitely.  Titles held?  Perhaps.  Tough one, since its not a real sport and noone actually wins anything. That said I think things have gone the other way and a lot of people look at it as worked accomplishments as being totally irrelevant which doesn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members Bellenda Carlisle Posted April 4, 2012 Paid Members Share Posted April 4, 2012 People often mention the "second tier" but who would really fit in there? I'd go with: Undertaker, John Cena, Triple H, Bret Hart, HBK, Ric Flair, Macho Man Randy Savage, Andre The Giant  I don't know if you'd put Bill Goldberg in there, he was a huge star but not for a paticularly long time and in terms of long term impact on professional wrestling I don't think he really did too much. Similiar with Brock Lesnar.  I guess you'd have a third tier of: Brock Lesnar, Bill Goldberg, Sting, Kevin Nash, Batista, Rowdy Roddy Piper, Mick Foley, Randy Orton, Kurt Angle?  I'd definitely have Sting in that second tier, he's on the same level as HBK and Bret Hart.  If the top tier had 5 people in it as opposed to the 3 people keep mentioning 'taker would be there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HeavyT Posted April 4, 2012 Share Posted April 4, 2012 I'd have the Big 3, then Undertaker, Sting, Hart, HBK, Flair, Cena in the next tier, Angle, Warrior, Piper, Foley, HHH, then you have guys like Nash, Goldberg, Brock Lesnar Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EdgarTheSlouch Posted April 4, 2012 Share Posted April 4, 2012 For me, it'll be interesing when he does actually retire to see if WWE will start to acknowledge his pre-Survivor Series90 gimmicks - Mean Mark Callous, Punisher. I know that theyve never included any on a previous DVD,but AFAIK they never even put any on 24/7/On Demand Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IronSheik Posted April 4, 2012 Share Posted April 4, 2012 Fuck this tier bullshit bandwagon, he's top five in the history of the profession which ever way you look at it. Fuckin legend. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members Teedy Kay Posted April 4, 2012 Author Paid Members Share Posted April 4, 2012 TheBigBoot, I wasn't reeling off a definitive list, I was just mentioning possibles that people may look at, my point with what I listed was that different people have differing ideals of what makes a fantastic talent in pro wrestling. Â It's like with me, I'd say if there was such tier system in place, that I'd put Flair in with Hogan/Austin/Rock, as that was a man that at times carried a company, had oodles of charisma, was at the forefront of the greatest stable in wrestling (except maybe The Oddities) put on resoundingly awesome matches, looked phenomenal, cut promos that would sell an event, made a stack of cash. Â But that's my opinion. Â What I was getting at, and asking, was where individually in each posters ideology of what makes a upper echelon wrestler would Taker sit in a list. Â I mean, it has to be fair to say that he is the greatest gimmick of all time without a shadow of a doubt, which is always weird in my eyes as if you were to hear the lines 'We're going to make the tall lanky ginger new guy into an old western style Undertaker' you'd laugh till you pissed. It could have gone the way of Papa Shango, it didn't, he embodied the gimmick, decided to no sell fucking everything, and from that an unparalleled story has ensued over 21 years ... quite staggering Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members Fox Piss Posted April 4, 2012 Paid Members Share Posted April 4, 2012 I wouldn't dream of putting Flair up with "The 3." Â Did he every carry a company on his own? I ain't up on Flairs career but even if he did look at where the company was. Â I wouldn't call the Horsemen the greatest stable of all time either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loki Posted April 4, 2012 Share Posted April 4, 2012 For me, it really comes down to how much a wrestler has permeated into popular culture. Outside of the wrestling bubble, Taker is certainly one of those guys whose fame has made him a household name. Â Hogan, Austin and the Rock are clearly the biggest names with Cena well on his way to joining them. You go anywhere in the world, and ask them to name famous wrestlers, those are the names you'll get. Â For me, Taker joins the list just below that - Flair, Sting, Andr Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members PunkStep Posted April 4, 2012 Paid Members Share Posted April 4, 2012 Does Triple H's movie career not bump him up into the 2nd tier? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BenPG7 Posted April 5, 2012 Share Posted April 5, 2012 Probably have to agree with this "2nd tier" idea for 'Taker. While hes had a simply amazing career, put on some classic matches and been involved in some great feuds, he just has never come across as WWE's main attraction at any significant point really. Correct me if I am wrong please! Â As far as Cena goes, is it not fair to say he DOES deserve to be in that top tier?? I mean, he sure hasnt been able to create as much of a fuss as the Hogans and Austins did, but he cant solely be blamed for wrestling's demise as such, can he?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
patiirc Posted April 5, 2012 Share Posted April 5, 2012 Tiers? Interesting Concept  Top Tier: The Rock, Austin, Hogan, Cena  Undertaker Tier ( A sub tier for those that dont really fit. Mass recognition, from fans and non fans alike, though not necessarily great in terms of drawing championships etc but a brand in its own right) : Undertaker (possibly HBK/Bret Hart as well)  2nd Tier: HHH, Flair, Sting, Warrior, Randy Savage, Andre, Piper  3rd Tier: Nash, Foley, Angle, Lesnar, Goldberg.  How does that look? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members Bellenda Carlisle Posted April 5, 2012 Paid Members Share Posted April 5, 2012 Tiers? Interesting Concept Top Tier: The Rock, Austin, Hogan, Cena  Undertaker Tier ( A sub tier for those that dont really fit. Mass recognition, from fans and non fans alike, though not necessarily great in terms of drawing championships etc but a brand in its own right) : Undertaker (possibly HBK/Bret Hart as well)  2nd Tier: HHH, Flair, Sting, Warrior, Randy Savage, Andre, Piper  How does that look?  On those criteria Andre definitely belongs in your "Undertaker tier" more than anyone, more than taker even. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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