Paid Members quote the raven Posted February 9, 2012 Paid Members Share Posted February 9, 2012 I know this is probably in the Impact thread already but i felt i needed to given its own thread  I dont watch alot of wrestling anymore, TNA and Raw are on my planner and i watch if the spoilers the day before look worthwhile. Well to cut along story short i had a day off work and flicked on TNA impact, I soon saw it was the UK taping.  What a huge difference the crowd made to the show!!!!! I enjoyed the whole dam program (aside from the interviews with fans) It just goes to show how badly they need to move from the impact zone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members IANdrewDiceClay Posted February 9, 2012 Paid Members Share Posted February 9, 2012 I know this is probably in the Impact thread already but i felt i needed to given its own thread Its already got its own thread http://ukff.com/index.php?showtopic=127279 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members quote the raven Posted February 9, 2012 Author Paid Members Share Posted February 9, 2012 I saw the impact 40 page thread Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MyNameIs... Posted February 9, 2012 Share Posted February 9, 2012 UK Impact Thread  It got it's own thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A Screen Up Posted February 9, 2012 Share Posted February 9, 2012 Any chance we can have a thread save and turn it into a discussion about wrestling crowds in general as they're not talked about very much considering just how important they are to a match, show, company or era and I don't think I've seen a thread solely dedicated to crowds in a while on here? I could do a quick list, like. Â People are quick to say that a solid announce team can make a mediocre match good, and turn a good match into a classic. I think the same should be said of crowds as well. Â The original ECW would never have made it as far as it did without its live crowds; John Cena versus RVD at One Night Stand wouldn't have been what it was by any means and there are countless others that I've forgotten about. Â Anybody who tries to knock Joe/Kobashi can fuck off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PW-AJ Posted February 9, 2012 Share Posted February 9, 2012 I think an obvious one has to be the Rock-Hogan Wrestlemania match. Wrestling-wise it was a horrible match... but with the insane crowd reactions it seemed like a fantastic match. Â The fans can definitely make or break a match. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members air_raid Posted February 9, 2012 Paid Members Share Posted February 9, 2012 Anybody who tries to knock Joe/Kobashi can fuck off. Â You won't get that out of me, and I'll tell you why. What PW-AJ says about Rock vs Hogan is a reasonable comparison, this match was the ROHbots equivalent, where two worlds meet, and the mere spectacle is enough to prompt a collective multigasm among the assemble throng. Â It's perfectly understandable for THAT crowd in THAT building to be frothing at the gash as they were on the night. You build up someone like Joe in your own minds as your indominitable legend/hero, a man who essentially has formed the cornerstone of what your promotion is built on. It's not entirely unfair to say that Joe (& Punk) played a big part in keeping interest in ROH post-Feinstein and the pulling of TNA talent, and after the epic title reign there can be no over-estimating what Samoa Joe meant to THAT fanbase, hard as it may be to understand in 2012. Â Conversely you have a major name in a major Japanese fed with the combined factor of being an iconic figure and also having delivered some of the best matches in the world - if you care for the Noah style and THAT fanbase most certainly did/do - in the preceding few years, with a incredible Joe-like title reign under his belt too and a near "unbeatable" aura to him. Â To those fans, you basically create a dream match which in football terms must seem something akin to the Barcelona of 2012 vs Brazil of 1982, and for most of the life of ROH must have seen about as likely to take place. How could they not be buzzing off their tits at the prospect? Â In terms of those who criticize - rightly or wrongly - the actual action and the fans response to it, it's worth baring in mind the above build up. Much as why someone does something means more than what they're doing in a pro wrestling match, who is doing it means as much. This is why Shawn Michaels performing a superkick means so much more than when Lance Storm, Kenny Kickpads or Matt Max Jackson Buck Morton Tyler Jericho does it. Yes they went molten for the relatively simple, but I don't blame them for it. When you're as over as those two men were to THOSE fans, a slap or a glare or applying a Stretch Plum can provoke that kind of reaction. Â I generally consider the match itself to be a very enjoyable battle, heightened intensely by the live crowd (which, I believe, is the point of the thread) overrated by some but unfairly savaged by an equal number. It's largely about knowing your audience, the people who paid to get in that night or paid for the DVD, satisfying your paying customers. If you didnt think the match was great, chances are you probably weren't/aren't in that particular market. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members IANdrewDiceClay Posted February 9, 2012 Paid Members Share Posted February 9, 2012 Wrestling-wise it was a horrible match... but with the insane crowd reactions it seemed like a fantastic match. The fans can definitely make or break a match. If they just stood there doing nothing, it wouldnt have mattered if Jesus had returned riding a unicycle. It makes me piss my sides when people say "the match was horrible but the crowd made it". If it wasnt for Hogan picking each move in the right order to make the crowd lift with each thing he did, there wouldnt have been any crowd reaction. The reason there was crowd reaction for the full 15 minutes, was because they knew what to do and when the do it. If Hogan would have done a side Russian leg sweep, followed by a 450 splash, what would the point have been, when a double bicep and a shoulder charge was just what the crowd wanted.  Crowds dont make a match. The wrestlers playing with the crowds emotions make a match. Its why Jeff Hardy vs Jeff Jarrett a few months back would have been super over in a real building, but came off flat infront of 900 holiday makers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members air_raid Posted February 9, 2012 Paid Members Share Posted February 9, 2012 Crowds dont make a match. The wrestlers playing with the crowds emotions make a match. Its why Jeff Hardy vs Jeff Jarrett a few months back would have been super over in a real building, but came off flat infront of 900 holiday makers. Â Doesn't that prove the point rather than disprove it? Flat crowd = flat match? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members IANdrewDiceClay Posted February 9, 2012 Paid Members Share Posted February 9, 2012 Doesn't that prove the point rather than disprove it? Flat crowd = flat match? My point was that, saying the Rock vs Hogan match was horrible wrestling wise, when it wasn't. The wrestling was perfectly put together for what that audience wanted. Thats what the match demanded. The crowd didn't make the match good. The two people in the match made good by making the crowd enhance the atmosphere of the match. Otherwise, Regal vs RVD wouldn't have been so flat. The crowd was mostly dead all night until that match. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PW-AJ Posted February 9, 2012 Share Posted February 9, 2012 I agree completely that Rock and especially Hogan had complete control of the fans. At that aspect of wrestling they are superb. My point was that the match *looked* pretty horrible. But because of the atmosphere and crowd reactions, nobody really took much notice of that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A Screen Up Posted February 9, 2012 Share Posted February 9, 2012 Crowds dont make a match. The wrestlers playing with the crowds emotions make a match. Â That's not a fair statement to make. Obviously, the crowds' reactions to a match is ultimately in relation to what they see in the ring but a different crowd on a different night in another venue could have been completely different. Â A crowd's reaction to a match absolutely can make all the difference. If RVD and Cena had been held at a venue elsewhere then it could have been an entirely different match without the heat in the audience. Â I praise air raid too much on here but that really was a terrific post regarding Joe/Kobashi and I've never seen it explained so well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members IANdrewDiceClay Posted February 9, 2012 Paid Members Share Posted February 9, 2012 A crowd's reaction to a match absolutely can make all the difference. If RVD and Cena had been held at a venue elsewhere then it could have been an entirely different match without the heat in the audience. What would have happened, if RVD got Cena in a headlock or Cena started doing his trademark offence and RVD lost? Would that crowd have stayed hot all the way though the match? What you are saying is absolutely not the point I was making at all. RVD and Cena had to do everything right to keep the crowd. An initial pop at the start of a match doesn't mean they will be still with it at the end of the night. Its why Goldberg would only have 6 minute matches, because you cant expose how over your talent is. RVD and Cena, and in the case of Rock and Hogan they gave the fans what they wanted. The fans wanted a face Hogan. They got it. The fans wanted ECW RVD, doing all his chairbased shite. They got it. If they'd have worked the match how the fans didn't want it, both matches would have died on their arse. Â Wrestling is a con. They are pretend fighters, and the crowd has to invest in the characters. Its give and take. Wrestling is ALL about playing with the crowds emotions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A Screen Up Posted February 9, 2012 Share Posted February 9, 2012 That's irrelevant as the fans were already going nuts over the entrances. Look at the back-and-forth between Cena's shirt, the utter hatred when Cena's music hit and the pop that RVD got. What they did in the ring was completely enhanced by the crowd's reaction, much like Rock and Hogan's matches. Â My point isn't that the crowd automatically wanks over nothing; it's that having a top crowd really does accentuate a match. Not every crowd would have reacted to certain matches in the way that one city did, much like a dead crowd can be a hindrance to a solid match. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members Vipes Posted February 9, 2012 Paid Members Share Posted February 9, 2012 Andre/Hogan springs to mind as a match that was pretty basic wrestling wise but thats all they needed to do as the crowd was insane for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.