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There's no bastards left in WWE :(


IANdrewDiceClay

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For some reason, I imagine Big Show being the main man with the talent these days.

 

That'd make sense, as he has been around a very long time. His career was a blessed one as well though. Straight into a PPV main event with Hogan at the age of 23 or whatever after a few months in the Power Plant.

 

Actually, of the current roster who's actually done an "apprenticeship" and aren't really from the WWE production line, say done more than 5 years of pretty regular work (pretty much fulltime) elsewhere first before OVW/DSW/FCW if debuted since 2001? Off the top of my head...

 

RAW

 

Del Rio - Ten years in Lucha

Chris Jericho - Trained by Ed Langley 20 years ago at the Hart Camp, onto Canadian Indies, FMW, WAR, NJPW, Lucha, ECW, WCW

CM Punk - Several years on the Indies

Jerry Lawler - Shouldn't need to even go into that

Kane - WCW Job duty, Mempho, SMW

Rey Mysterio - Lucha from the age of about 2. Japan, ECW, WCW

R-Truth - K-Krush often mentioned in WOW magazine, NWA Wildside

HHH - Kowalski, North East indies, WCW

 

 

Smackdown

 

Big Show - As in main post.

Booker T - Global, WCW, Prison

Christian - Years on Canadian indies. Touted with Edge and Val Venis ages ago

Daniel Bryan - Probably the closest C21st example of the well travelled grizzled vet in my opinion. Been pretty much everywhere and learned it all.

Sin Cara - Lucha for a long time

Undertaker - Texas, USWA, WCW.

William Regal - Goes without saying.

 

 

I have no idea what that list even means and forgotten what I was trying to prove now I've typed it all out. But I have typed it all out, it looks nice and it's staying. Feel free to correct/add and work out what my point was.

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Out of those 15 you listed, Butch, 11 have held the WWE or WH title in the past 6 years. From outside of that group, who's held the belts? Edge would definitely be on that list were he still about, so we can ignore him. Not sure how Khali factors into things either. So from the WWE production line, there's Cena, Batista, Orton, Miz, Ziggler (although that reign can't really count), Swagger (ditto, I guess)... have I missed any? Does Sheamus count as a WWE product? I don't know how much stuff he did outside Ireland and GB before he was signed.

 

Out of those, Cena and Orton were always groomed for the top, as was Batista after a bit. Miz has had to work hard to get to the point he's at, and Ziggler seems to be on a not-too-dissimilar path (despite having started with a shitload more natural talent than Miz).

 

I'm not sure what my point is here either, but it's certainly interesting to look into the paths the top guys have taken.

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Counting Christian is a bit of a dodgy choice, I reckon. I think Sheamus spent longer on the indies than Christian did. McIntyre and Barrett wouldn't be that far off, either. Evan Bourne did the ROH stuff for a few years before getting his contract for the proper wrestling, didn't he? Justin Gabriel's been knocking about for years as well, according to Wikipedia.

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I wasn't sure on how long Sheamus had been treading the boards in the UK before heading to FCW, so I left him out.

 

Primo, Hunico and Epico have done an "apprenticeship" as well, I think. but I know fuck all about Puerto Rico so I deliberately left Primo and Epico out as well.

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Bourne was in ROH for an age (and was pretty dull - did all the flippy stuff as well as anyone, but was just bland, bland, bland), then had a decent stint in Dragon Gate (where he suddenly became quite a bit better). But he doesn't seem as seasoned as a guy like Bryan. Very much part of a new-school mentality, if such a thing exists as we're professing.

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Counting Christian is a bit of a dodgy choice, I reckon. I think Sheamus spent longer on the indies than Christian did. McIntyre and Barrett wouldn't be that far off, either. Evan Bourne did the ROH stuff for a few years before getting his contract for the proper wrestling, didn't he? Justin Gabriel's been knocking about for years as well, according to Wikipedia.

 

To be honest, I counted Christian because I always remembered reading about him in indie reports in Apter mags and went to WWF/E before OVW and developmental in general became the big production line that it ended up as. I think I used 2001 as the cut off.

 

Bourne was also on Wrestling Society X and looked great on it. Well, as great as you can get when each match lasts 3 minutes and they edit out everything that isnt a move.

 

Wrestling Society X was good fun. Colt Cabana's stuff as Matt Classic is the best stuff he's ever done.

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Lawler's still one of the World's best. Easily. I don't see why people get hung up about age and being too old in wrestling, many of the best in the game are the wrong side of 45. Wrong side of 50 even.

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They're not quite all gone. Vince is still the master. He knows how to fuck with his guys when required.

 

It is something i've thought before though. I've pondered numerous times that whether some of the top guys being too nice or more than happy to do as the company wishes can be detrimental to the product. Like, for example sometimes i wonder if John Cena is too nice and far too happy and willing to drop the WWE title to someone. It's great that everyone puts everyone over and that's obviously required to an extent...but it can also prevent anyone else REALLY breaking out. Michaels and Austin for example may have been slated in the past for their refusal to drop the WWE title to another talent a couple of times but in some ways their behavior sure did make the WWE title and its status seem much more of a big deal then it does now when it gets hot potatoed. And it would often force the company to find other methods and be creative to establish guys and make them ready to hold the belt, rather than how they just stick the belt on guys now and expect that to make them.

 

Back on the Vince point, i think a big part of the Michael Cole character direction over the past couple of years, being the voice of WWE and regularly slating talent is somewhat designed to keep some talent in check of their egos. He also certainly seems to adopt some of the bullying mindset if those youtube Tri.moon videos are anything to go by and his relationship with Tony Chimmel. I reckon JBL groomed him.

 

I hope MVP makes it back to WWE at some point and hits the main events proper. I think his journey would make him an ace locker room Don.

 

Regarding Butchis 'doing an apprenticeship' post, what about guys with amateur backgrounds? Ever since Kurt Angle, WWE seem to like to pick up a lot of guys with some genuine grappling skills under their belt, sometimes to great effect and success. I'm not sure what i'm asking or what point i'm making here though either.

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Lawler's still one of the World's best. Easily. I don't see why people get hung up about age and being too old in wrestling, many of the best in the game are the wrong side of 45. Wrong side of 50 even.

 

Lawlers one of those who just knows how to do "it" and seemingly always has. It's sad to think that to a generation out there he's just that guy who sits next to Cole.

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It's vital to have a guy who is keeping an eye over the flock to give advice, a lot of the young guys could do with some influence as there is definitely a common 'cookie cutter mould' for guys such as Mcgillicutty, Alex Riley and a large majority of NXT alumni. But it's obviously a good thing if the bully culture has gone, it's funny how guys like Bob Holly had a self serving agenda when he didn't contribute much match or character wise to the WWE during his entire time there.

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I have no idea what that list even means and forgotten what I was trying to prove now I've typed it all out.

I'm not sure what my point is here either

I'm not sure what i'm asking or what point i'm making here though either.

 

We rule.

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But it's obviously a good thing if the bully culture has gone, it's funny how guys like Bob Holly had a self serving agenda when he didn't contribute much match or character wise to the WWE during his entire time there.

Paul London and Brian Kendrick would disagree. Holly (and Benoit) would make sure the young wrestlers kept their diet and conditioning to a good standard. Jamie Noble would probably say the same thing. The reason Holly had such a rep as a miserable nutter was because he would insist on mentoring young wrestlers through his own unqiue approach. Like the time he slagged off Jillian Hall for having a gut. Probably the reason they put Cody Rhodes with him.

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