SUPER Smackdown 30/08/11

[IANdrewDiceClay]

That wasnt a compliment Meltzer was giving him. Was saying you stand out more in a stale product, though. There's been plenty of hot stars came along over the last few years that didnt do anything for business. I remember saying it months ago, Austin vs Triple H, The Undertaker, John Cena and the likes of them would draw huge for me. Its such a compelling return, you need the right opponent to exploit his value as a returning star. If I hadnt seen wrestling in years and I drive past the city centre and a billboard with Steve Austin's bald head next to the Undertaker or John Cena or Triple H or even someone like Batista was up there, I'd stop the car to see the ordering information. The night after Punk won the belt and was at that baseball game with the belt, the commentators took the piss out of him. The lead announcer said "He's the heavyweight champion?" Punk's got Jericho syndrome. He's good a good look, but not a special look. He's not a midget, but he's not got the Bret Hart/Shawn Michaels athletic body to hide the fact. The size of Triple H compared to him is staggering. If his match with Triple H bombs, how many people in Titan Towers are going to put the blame on Triple H?

 

Austin's opponent is Austin's shout.

Of course it isnt. Austin's opponent is who they want to see him draw the most money with. He's not desperate to come back. They'd approach him with an idea for a match and if they offered him a match with his best friend the Undertaker, I'm sure he wouldnt complain.

 

Matters little, because I cant see them wasting Austin's return on the night the Rock comes back. It would be like giving it away for free, because chances are, the ones paying for it are the ones who'd like to buy Austin's return on a seperate show.

[ColinBollocks]

But again, if Austin wants to return he'll decide who he's facing (it may or may not be Punk). Like you say, he doesn't need the money and if they have him fight somebody he doesn't want too, he'll tell them no (like he has for years now). Austin has said he'll only return if it's on his terms etc.

 

For me this whole Punk thing is odd, he hasn't done great numbers (he shifted some merch) but who does in 2011? The Rock is the only guy that has meant a thing to WWEs overall business. Cena has his strong points but numbers have declined with him as the number one face. WWE had Hart v McMahon and that didn't do great.

 

Also there is an interesting theory knocking about Triple H too. I think it's a bit daft, but people think he's having a match v Punk at a 'B' show, instead of a strong Survivor Series card (which will feature the return of The Rock) so he can use the inevitably shit number as proof Punk isn't worth his push.

[sivy]

to me punk is still the person i want to see the most but he's not pg friendly at the moment. so where crowds are full of kids then he aint going to get much of an reaction but in a smart marks crowd he'll get his reaction. at the moment he aint a face because there is no symphony for him as he insults people's wife. what pg crowd going to cheer for that.

[PowerButchi]

to me punk is still the person i want to see the most but he's not pg friendly at the moment. so where crowds are full of kids then he aint going to get much of an reaction but in a smart marks crowd he'll get his reaction. at the moment he aint a face because there is no symphony for him as he insults people's wife. what pg crowd going to cheer for that.

 

And when are you going to see a "Smart Marks" crowd (*shudder* Hopefully never)? Mania? The occasional show in the North East? And even then it won't be like the Hammerstein Ballroom at ONS 06 baying for blood. You have to play to the crowd you have, and if that's Wichita, Kansas, then you tone down the complete and utter dickheadedness of it. I wouldn't see myself cheering for a character the way Punk acts in promos be it PG, TV-14, or M.

[Joey Joe Joe Jr]

to me punk is still the person i want to see the most but he's not pg friendly at the moment. so where crowds are full of kids then he aint going to get much of an reaction but in a smart marks crowd he'll get his reaction. at the moment he aint a face because there is no symphony for him as he insults people's wife. what pg crowd going to cheer for that.

 

and jericho was more tuneful?

[JohnnyChimpo]

and jericho was more tuneful?

When Jericho was mocking Triple H and his wife, they were both on-screen, mega heel characters. People wanted to see them get their comeuppance in whatever way possible, be it Triple H getting beaten up, or Steph getting called a slut. Its completely different now. Triple H and Steph (whenever she has been onscreen) have been face characters for ages now. Triple H is one of the most over people on the roster, probably only behind Cena and Orton. He is way, way more over than Punk. And he has been carrying himself with dignity the whole time. Punk had no reason to initially slag his wife, and he has had even less reason to keep doing it. But Triple H has kept his cool and stayed professional. Which is what is leading to people wanting to see Triple H kick the fuck out of Punk.

 

Its nothing like the Jericho situation.

[sivy]

y2j did it joking and to her face while punk does to triple h knowing he can get away with it therefore coming across more hateful.

[brmanuk]

I really don't understand why everyone is loving Punk at the minute. He comes across as a whiny little bitch most of the time. He's not doing anything new or exciting; he's just complaining about the state of the company. He's pretty much doing exactly what Sting is doing in TNA. I don't really get the appeal. I thought the contract signing was too drawn out and only got interesting when Nash came out. He's the only interesting and exciting element in the storyline due to his unpredictability and the fact that he looks like a big nasty bastard.

[PowerButchi]

I really don't understand why everyone is loving Punk at the minute. He comes across as a whiny little bitch most of the time. He's not doing anything new or exciting; he's just complaining about the state of the company. He's pretty much doing exactly what Sting is doing in TNA. I don't really get the appeal. I thought the contract signing was too drawn out and only got interesting when Nash came out. He's the only interesting and exciting element in the storyline due to his unpredictability and the fact that he looks like a big nasty bastard.

 

Not many here do at the second. More are inclined to agree with your rest of the post. If Punk is indeed doing his own promos he's an idiot.

[IANdrewDiceClay]

What I hate about the promos (apart from the delievery and the over acting) is the hollier than thou way his character comes across. He isnt likable in the slightest from where I'm sitting. He's a prick to Triple H, a bully to Stephanie McMahon (if it was Jerry Lawler saying that type of stuff about Mickie James, I'm sure people wouldnt class it as endearing) and his persona isnt clear whether he's a heel or face. And his character is such an oxymoron. The microphone is apparently a pipe bomb in his hand, yet his promos arent edgy in the slightest and Triple H (the man in a suit remember) is the one breaking from the norm and delivering the threats like a true rebel. Punk is supposed to be the "Voice of the voiceless", yet depending on the city he's in, he isnt as over as Randy Orton, John Cena or Triple H and to the audience they are playing to in arenas and on television probably is as over as The Miz and Alberto Del Rio. And he's been saying he's bringing change and keeps banging on about it for months now, yet not a single thing has changed due to him since his return to television. Nash is back, but thats not his doing. Del Rio is champions, but that was in spite of him. Cena is challenging for the belt again. "Dwayne" is returning very soon to blow all the angles away and knock the likes of Punk, Nash, Del Rio, The Miz and R-Truth further down the card. WWE has changed a lot in the last few months, but I remember when CM Punk was at his hottest just after MITB. WWE did a reset where they changed the champion, changed the authority figure, changed the heels and babyfaces around and did a few more things to make Raw more interesting. And the shows have been better for it. Even both brands are wrestling each other on the same show now, which is all down to the big man in the suit who occassionally carries a sledgehammer. The only person thats suffered since this has been CM Punk. His stock has fallen badly, RVD-esque. You cant blame WWE to much, because they gave him SO much freedom on the microphone. Gave him a shitload of time to get his matches and angles over. Its unprecedented how much freedom and leeway they've given him. I dont know what the fucks happened. Whatever he's selling the audience arent buying.

[PowerButchi]

Doing a promo in somewhere like Kansas which has a crowd full of kids going on about how WWE sucks now isn't a good start. They don't like being told what they are watching in the arena is shit, I don't like being told what I'm watching (and what I enjoy) is shit.

[IANdrewDiceClay]

The Observer was saying merchandise is way down as well from last year. He's selling merch, but its nothing significant. If it were Zack Ryder would have been World Champion in May. WWE's having a really bad period at the minute. It would be worry, if not for the Rock coming back soon. Say what you want about the Rock, but he's got an appeal to casual fans. People that dont usually watch, actually watch the show when he's on it. That takes some doing in the current era.

 

What do you reckon? Do you think the reason HHH and Punk (the supposed Survivor Series/Royal Rumble/WrestleMania match) are having the match now is because they are going to rearrange the chess pieces again, and blow this storyline off? It showed with Nexus last year, if WWE see's the numbers not coming in they arent scared to fuck an angle off.

[PowerButchi]

I honestly think that Sheamus has more upside as a face as it stands. CM Punk has the internet crowd, but out of the Northeast they aren't at the arenas, whereas Sheamus is an Irishman. The Americans love to pretend they're Irish. Sheamus is in a better position to make dollar than Punk. Sheamus seems very organic as a face, also he's fucking Media savvy.

[LaGoosh]

Yeah I don't think anyone can deny that Shaemus should be and is probably on course to be the next top babyface and one of the main figureheads of the company. And rightly so, in ring he's probably the best guy on the roster at the moment (or at least in the top 3), he's over, has the attitude, he looks the part and seems to be exactly what WWE want in their top guys.

[ColinBollocks]

The Observer was saying merchandise is way down as well from last year. He's selling merch, but its nothing significant. If it were Zack Ryder would have been World Champion in May. WWE's having a really bad period at the minute. It would be worry, if not for the Rock coming back soon. Say what you want about the Rock, but he's got an appeal to casual fans. People that dont usually watch, actually watch the show when he's on it. That takes some doing in the current era.

 

What do you reckon? Do you think the reason HHH and Punk (the supposed Survivor Series/Royal Rumble/WrestleMania match) are having the match now is because they are going to rearrange the chess pieces again, and blow this storyline off? It showed with Nexus last year, if WWE see's the numbers not coming in they arent scared to fuck an angle off.

Given the way WWE did business on Raw. I think they've shat it.

 

No wonder Vince went overboard with The Rocks birthday celebration. He must be kissing a framed picture of The Rock right now, as without him can you imagine just how shitty WWEs business would have been this year. Imagine if John Cena v The Miz was the 'Mania main event (with no Rock involved), scary.

 

I honestly think WWE could have a Goldberg-esque green guy but he wouldn't do anything after they gave him a big push.

 

I remember Meltzer saying that WWE have fucked with the fans so much, with pushing and then de-pushing guys. that it's now harder for fans to get behind somebody because they know they'll be back in the midcard in a few months.