Whats your opinion on British Wrestling?

[Dunny]

I agree with a lot said here but there is far too many sweeping statements and generalisations that are not fair to the people involved in the industry who work hard at it and deserve more.

 

TBut the shows seem indie like and to pantomine. The exceptions are FWA, IPW and 1pw. When these promotions get things right they look the real deal, however sometimes they just fall by the wayside.

 

You need to look further afield then. NGW, DPW, XWA, GPW, just to name a few of the top companies just in the North of England don't fit that criteria.

 

The storylines all seem either very basic and ineffective (a necessity when you're basically just running a little show once a month and any new punters won't be familiar with them) or a load of bollocks

 

Again you need to look further afield eg. NGW, DPW, XWA, GPW. I won't talk about the NGW product much so I don't sound like I'm blowing our own horn but we're damn proud of emotional and connecting storylines and we work bloody hard at them too. A perfect example is XWA who pulled off one of my favourite storylines I've ever seen. I only saw the final pay off for it but had followed it online and in videos and such before that (the Tom Lambert angle). Such long term commitment to a storyline has to be commended in any entertainment field.

 

It does seem like anyone who pays their subs for training every week will get a match on the card after a bit. But I suppose that's fair enough, as is people going "Oh, they're never gonna give me the (replica WWE) belt here, I'm gonna go and set up my own promotion." It's laughable and small-time as fuck, but it is basically just a hobby, so as long as they're having fun doing it and nobody gets too hurt, I don't have a problem with it. It's just not the sort of thing I'm going to be interested in as a fan.

 

They're not proper wrestling companies or proper shows, are they? They're just amateurs messing about, occasionally with enough money to bring in Billy Gunn or Val Venis or someone. It's unfair to compare this sort of stuff to WWE and TNA, really, but I can't help but make the comparison. And the comparison can't help but make me not watch British wrestling.

 

I, and I'm sure 100% of the 'good' side of British wrestling, pretty much agree with this (except it doing no harm bit). But the bolded bit is too much of a sweeping statement, and generally not true. In NGW, it's taken us a while to build up our training school (3 years to be exact) but we've got some real potential coming out of there now. We've had people training for nearly two years and only now have we started a brand of 'academy' Proving Ground style shows for them to start getting a bit of experience. And even then they we had 2-3 in six man tag matches with pros the likes of El Ligero, Stixx & Cameron Kraze to protect them, and a few of others in a rumble with many other pros. Like many other schools we have great working relationships with (such as House of Pain), we'd never put anyone in who was not ready, unsafe or didn't show the desire or commitment needed.

[Zebra Kid Mark]

The main things that put me off are the small rings/terrible production values and the fact that most shows are aimed at kids. Also it doesn't help that most of the wrestlers ... are wrestling as if they are in Butlins, that's what puts me off. When ever I go to a wrestling event I feel as if I have to dumb myself down to enjoy it, I never had to do that when I would watch american indy shows on DVD/TWC.

That's the core audience though - anyone wrestling with the bigger audience in mind is surely doing the right thing. Teenage/twenty-something fans than watch American independent wrestling are inevitably, and perennially, the niche crowd - as demonstrated by all these American indy feds that have guys flying around in front of 80 people. Good characters draw, that template has never changed. But what the kids think are good characters is often vastly different to what the older crowd do.

Yea agreed, I'm giving my opinion on British Wrestling, not the opinion of a 10 year old boy. Besides even if they are aimed at kids and the promoters are milking it in, I still think the wrestling is sometimes a bit rubbish.

 

Your point about the indy guys flying around in front of 80 people is an interesting one, I think the british kids would much rather see those high flying indy wrestlers that you speak of compared to the rubbish Butlin-like wrestlers I speak of. Just a theory. I could be wrong.

[AshC]

Having been at a stack of Butlin-like shows and a stack of high flying indy ones, I find that the kids and their parents almost always enjoy the 'Butlins' ones more. Just from my experience. I've also seen some guys on the 'high flying' shows look down their noses at the 'Butlins' guys, and then wonder why their own shows aren't drawing. Ultimately I've found that what I think is entertaining is worth about 1% of what the kids and parents think, as they're your bread and butter crowd and always will be.

[Tommy!]

I love it because more often than not they keep it simple and put on a good show. Most shows I go to see have a mix of established good names and solid young names to keep things fresh, they put on an enjoyable show that works to the audience and doesn't try to be something it's not, and more often that not give a little bit of everything.

I watch them and enjoy the show, the wrestling good and it has enough panto to make me care, and most do little basic stories linking shows which keeps the interest up.

As a result I go home happy, which is all I want. I don't think I've been to a show and though the production or ring looks a bit wank, because they aren't. Perhaps I'm just lucky, perhaps I just have the sense to not go watch crappy shows.

 

What I don't like is all the shit that seems to swirl around it at times, trying way to hard to be or do something your not, I've mentioned it a lot after FWA as it's gone on. Hotwired was amazing because it put on a great show, with high production and nice quick video explanations on why I should care about what was coming up and enough to tease me to go back. What happened to that simple formula I don't know, but what it became put me off because it wasn't fun to watch. Its not just FWA who do this, but its a prime example but it feels like some people forget at time its wrestling in a town hall. I recall 1PW having what seemed like more photographers than fans at one show and personally apart from the flashes giving me a blinding head ache it felt like they were trying to create the impression of being something huge when it was obvious they really aren't. I'm not singling them out, but that's two examples that are always at the for front of my mind. I've no objection to ambition but there's a difference between that and making you product look daft.

 

I like British wrestling being that half sport half panto thing which you don't get on TV, that live light hearted 3 ring circus.

 

Some of the people involved on here do also taint my opinion of certain promotions, just as some give it a good light that encourages me to go. Its swings and roundabouts.

 

As someone else said, there really are too many promotions knocking about, and too many poorly run/promoted ones as well. I know that there are at least 4 promotions that run within a 25mile radius of where I live, and theres only one that I attend regularly. Serious overkill.

 

Now I agree there are loads, and at times it seems mad how many there are, but I sort of like that I can drive for an hour in any direction and chances are there will be a good show on at some time in the month. As I said above I don't think I've been to a show and though "they shouldn't be running". I may be lucky, I may just avoid them subconsciously.

 

Additionally, whilst there are a few standout wrestlers, there are way too many shitty ones. The sort that don't care about their look in the slightest, and wrestle like a complete shitarse.

If people are going to wrestle, then they really should LOOK like they belong in a ring.

 

Again I can't think of many people who look drastically out of place. Not every one has that amazing look or anything, but for the most part I can buy in to it or its quite clear they are new and working on it and capable for where they are.

I can think of one name who I've seen who quite clearly wasn't ready for the position he was put in month after month, from an ability not a look perspective, I've not seen a show with him on for a while now so I can't say what he's like now, but one name in so many shows isn't a bad batting average.

[Rosler28]

Todays British wrestling will never be as big as todays American wrestling. To the average person in the sreet American wrestling is pro wrestling and British wrestling is just a knock off.

 

Even with tv it wont take off again. People just arent that interested anymore. Time to realise wrestling in this country will never reach the same heights as it did back on the glory days.

 

Even though thats a depressing thought it means its not the stop of the awesome talent we have coming through the ranks though. The wrestlers are great, the promotions however are small time compared to whats on tv everyday of the week thanks to WWE. And theres the other problem, WWE has pretty much made anyone who watches a WWE show think that this is what wrestling is and anything else is a poor mans version.

 

So either get rid of WWE on British tv or offer a alternative. However the alternative is out there already, its called UFC.

[Toga]

I think one thing to consider when compairing the current British Wrestling Scene with the top 2 companies is that they too started out just like any other indy fed (Admittadly TNA less so) and built via whatever manner to what they are today.

 

People forget this and many seem to want British Wrestling Promotions to be instantly like the big two in America. This is going to take many years of hard work for ANY promotion in this country to achieve, regardless of how good they are compaired to anyone else.

 

Like Dunny said there are many promotions out there that put on good wrestling that mixes up various styles.

[Southside crew]

First and foremost I realise that I am new on the scene and have not had enough shows to feel like my opinion is one that is particulary important however I do believe there are many great companies in the uk.

 

Before I set up Southside I spent 18 months going to many shows all over the country seeing the best to the worst and every show that I went to showed me some good and bad things. The amount of work that you have to put in is untrue if you want to be a success for example my second show was rammed and I made a great profit however if I was paid a wage it would have been tiny as I must have spent at least 50 hours flyering alone ! My only hope on a personnal level is that if I can keep putting on great shows then the leg work won't have to be quite so excessive later on as the reputation alone will sell tickets.

 

I am also a firm believer that the wrestling / storytelling is the most important thing that will get fans coming back and although having an amazing set looks brilliant it is worthless if the wrestling is awful however I am in the process of spending more and more visually.

 

I'd like to say companies like IPW , WAW , NGW , EVE , GPW , DPW , FUTURESHOCK to name a few never seem to disapoint and have a very loyal fanbase which is key.

 

I also think that imports on a small scale can work as IPW show but it has to be done right.

[silvera2006]

Heres my 2 pence.

 

One of the major things that is ruining wrestling in this country is the abundence of shite schools, run by nobody " wrestlers", who teach suicide dives before they teach a lockup.

 

I experienced this firsthand a few years back when i attended a " school", and i use that term loosely.

 

THere was no warm up for the trainees. The " head trainer" just sat about, whilst his wife ( a hideous looking 40 something who reeked of chip fat) triend to teach me how to do an armdrag. With the wrong arm.

 

I left and never returned, but if i had, i probably would have gotten onto a show within a month, where fans expecting to see wrestling would see a catastrophe of dangerous stunts and poor psychology, and would generally leave with a bad view of wrestling in this country.

 

Sadly, these schools and promotions exist all over the UK, by " wrestlers" who claim to have " 15 years in the business" yet no one i know has ever heard of them....

 

I think ic oudl honestly say that if I were a trainee again, with what i know now, I could probably only list 10 people in this country who I would trust to turn me into a competant worker. They would be...

 

Charlie Rage

Stuart Allen

Kerry Cabrero

Mark Sloan

Robbie Brookside

Ricky and Saraya Knight

Doug Williams

Justin Richards

 

Damn, couldnt even get 10. This sint to say there are not lots of stellar workers in this country, but those listed are specialists in training others and know what to teach in regards to psychology etc, bot just " MOVEZ!".

[IANdrewDiceClay]

I think ic oudl honestly say that if I were a trainee again, with what i know now, I could probably only list 10 people in this country who I would trust to turn me into a competant worker. They would be...

 

Charlie Rage

Stuart Allen

Kerry Cabrero

Mark Sloan

Robbie Brookside

Ricky and Saraya Knight

Doug Williams

Justin Richards

Most of them are technically "nobody wrestlers", and I'm sure they'd admit it. Who's Stuart Allen? Who's Kerry Cabrero? They arent name wrestlers, so to use the "name wrestlers" thing against them is a bit harsh. There's hundreds of no name wrestlers who are quite capable of training wrestlers, I'd say. You just listed a load of them. Also, is Doug Williams even "in this country". I heard he's relocated to Florida and doesnt accept bookings over here anymore.

 

Also, what about Alex Shane? He's seems like he has a good track record. Or the Zebra Kid? He's very good and his Dad might agree that he's capable of showing a student the merits of psychology.

[Deaq]

I think ic oudl honestly say that if I were a trainee again, with what i know now, I could probably only list 10 people in this country who I would trust to turn me into a competant worker. They would be...

 

Charlie Rage

Stuart Allen

Kerry Cabrero

Mark Sloan

Robbie Brookside

Ricky and Saraya Knight

Doug Williams

Justin Richards

 

Damn, couldnt even get 10. This sint to say there are not lots of stellar workers in this country, but those listed are specialists in training others and know what to teach in regards to psychology etc, bot just " MOVEZ!".

 

What about Chris Curtis? He has trained loads of the guys on all-star and more, Also Kev O'Neils school has produced some good talent. I would also add BCW's school, Colin Mckay is the head trainer but he has LOADS of other guest trainers and BCW talent helping out.

[silvera2006]

I think ic oudl honestly say that if I were a trainee again, with what i know now, I could probably only list 10 people in this country who I would trust to turn me into a competant worker. They would be...

 

Charlie Rage

Stuart Allen

Kerry Cabrero

Mark Sloan

Robbie Brookside

Ricky and Saraya Knight

Doug Williams

Justin Richards

Most of them are technically "nobody wrestlers", and I'm sure they'd admit it. Who's Stuart Allen? Who's Kerry Cabrero? They arent name wrestlers, so to use the "name wrestlers" thing against them is a bit harsh. There's hundreds of no name wrestlers who are quite capable of training wrestlers, I'd say. You just listed a load of them. Also, is Doug Williams even "in this country". I heard he's relocated to Florida and doesnt accept bookings over here anymore.

 

Also, what about Alex Shane? He's seems like he has a good track record. Or the Zebra Kid? He's very good and his Dad might agree that he's capable of showing a student the merits of psychology.

 

By " no name", i meant people that 99% of respected british workers havnt even heard of. These are old school guys with a decent, old school training mentality, not people who are more interested in recreating the latest japanese match they saw. Casual fans dont want to see 760 degree flips and 100 yakuza kicks, done to impress a tiny minority of smart marks on an internet forum.

 

In retrospect, the names recently mentioned ( chris curtis, kevin o'neil and zebra) would/do all make excellent trainers. Alex, for me, seems to have his own agenda ( no pun intended) a tad too much, therefore i wouldnt PERSONALLY pick him above the others i have listed.

 

BTW, Stuart Allen ( The Dominator) and Kerry Cabrero have ben around a long time and have wrestled all over the world. If you care.

[AJS269]

Heres my 2 pence.

 

One of the major things that is ruining wrestling in this country is the abundence of shite schools, run by nobody " wrestlers", who teach suicide dives before they teach a lockup.

 

I experienced this firsthand a few years back when i attended a " school", and i use that term loosely.

 

THere was no warm up for the trainees. The " head trainer" just sat about, whilst his wife ( a hideous looking 40 something who reeked of chip fat) triend to teach me how to do an armdrag. With the wrong arm.

 

I left and never returned, but if i had, i probably would have gotten onto a show within a month, where fans expecting to see wrestling would see a catastrophe of dangerous stunts and poor psychology, and would generally leave with a bad view of wrestling in this country.

 

Sadly, these schools and promotions exist all over the UK, by " wrestlers" who claim to have " 15 years in the business" yet no one i know has ever heard of them....

 

I think ic oudl honestly say that if I were a trainee again, with what i know now, I could probably only list 10 people in this country who I would trust to turn me into a competant worker. They would be...

 

Charlie Rage

Stuart Allen

Kerry Cabrero

Mark Sloan

Robbie Brookside

Ricky and Saraya Knight

Doug Williams

Justin Richards

 

Damn, couldnt even get 10. This sint to say there are not lots of stellar workers in this country, but those listed are specialists in training others and know what to teach in regards to psychology etc, bot just " MOVEZ!".

 

I have never heard a bad word said about Colin McKay as a trainer (his reputation as a wrestler is a different matter) along with Ross Watson, and when you look at some of the talents they have trained, I think they should be added to that list.

[Da Wrestler`s Wrestler DKJ]

I think ic oudl honestly say that if I were a trainee again, with what i know now, I could probably only list 10 people in this country who I would trust to turn me into a competant worker. They would be...

 

Charlie Rage

Stuart Allen

Kerry Cabrero

Mark Sloan

Robbie Brookside

Ricky and Saraya Knight

Doug Williams

Justin Richards

Most of them are technically "nobody wrestlers", and I'm sure they'd admit it. Who's Stuart Allen? Who's Kerry Cabrero? They arent name wrestlers, so to use the "name wrestlers" thing against them is a bit harsh. There's hundreds of no name wrestlers who are quite capable of training wrestlers, I'd say. You just listed a load of them. Also, is Doug Williams even "in this country". I heard he's relocated to Florida and doesnt accept bookings over here anymore.

 

Also, what about Alex Shane? He's seems like he has a good track record. Or the Zebra Kid? He's very good and his Dad might agree that he's capable of showing a student the merits of psychology.

 

Zebra Kid's dad IS Ricky Knight. Saraya Knight aka Sweet Saraya IS the number 1 female wrestler in this country (Some may say that her daughter Britani Knight is but everyone has their own opinion) And to say that Mark Sloan, Justin Richards and Robbie Brookside are "nobody wrestlers" is like saying in the car world nobody has heard of Porsche, Rolls royce and Aston Martin.

 

And if you haven't heard of Charlie Rage then checkout Thunderslamwrestling.co.uk

[King Pitcos]

And to say that Mark Sloan, Justin Richards and Robbie Brookside are "nobody wrestlers" is like saying in the car world nobody has heard of Porsche, Rolls royce and Aston Martin.

Are you just trying to get in their good books or do you seriously think those wrestlers are household names on par with three car brands that absolutely everyone knows? Mark Sloan I know of because he's a poster here, I've never heard of Justin Richards, and Robbie Brookside's biggest match was getting battered in a squash by Vince McMahon or Umaga or someone. They're all well-respected within the industry here, I'm sure, and I know lads like Chris Jericho and William Regal think highly of Robbie, but your list of three are by no means well known outside of the most hardcore wrestling fans and wrestlers.

[IANdrewDiceClay]

Zebra Kid's dad IS Ricky Knight.

Did you read any of what I said? I said that one of the people he has listed (HIS DAD) might agree that someone he hasnt got listed (HIS SON) might be just as capable of teaching people how to wrestle.

 

Saraya Knight aka Sweet Saraya IS the number 1 female wrestler in this country (Some may say that her daughter Britani Knight is but everyone has their own opinion) And to say that Mark Sloan, Justin Richards and Robbie Brookside are "nobody wrestlers" is like saying in the car world nobody has heard of Porsche, Rolls royce and Aston Martin.

Dont be daft. If a young lad decided to become a wrestle tomorrow after watching Raw and he reads about Robbie Brookside, do you think he's going to say " THEEEE Robbie Brookside!". Of course he wont. I was pointing out the flaws in his "nobody wrestlers" analogy. Not everyone knows who Mark Sloan, Robbie Brookside or Justin Richards are and dont pretend they do. But that doesnt make them any less capable as trainers. I've never seen Justin Roberts wrestle ever, but I'd trust him to train me based on what people have said. I'm talking about name value, not talent. Like when Jake Roberts was over here running a wrestling school and he was charging people 500 quid to watch SuperTape 91 with him. Thats name value for you. Or Alex Shane charging the same amount of money that Shawn Michaels charged to train wrestlers. Daniel Bryan and Brian Kendrick have both even said Michaels wasnt usually there at his own training school and allowed local nobodies to show them how its done. You dont need to be a name to train wrestlers.