Smegma Cake Posted January 12, 2011 Share Posted January 12, 2011 No argument here! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesTyler Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 I've heard Punk say (think it was on Art of Wrestling podcast) that he gets told what points he needs to get over and then left to fill in the rest himself. Â While far removed from the world of WWE, I've seen guys locally who have similar tastes. Some are better at getting bullet points, or even just a line or purpose. They can work around the rest themselves and it feels natural. Others (one in particular who is a great wrestler) but not a great talker or writer, have done their best promo when given the words. Â People need to be catered to their needs. If you need a writer, you have one in WWE. If it feels right to use your own words, do it. The content may not be the problem, but how it's controlled may effect the outcome. But then, I don't know how much testing they do in FCW when it comes to the promo work. So Imay just be filling space and making little sense Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
simonworden Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 The problem with Promos is the outletts wrestlers have these days. proper unscripted promo time is a lot less now than it was 10 or 20 years ago.  Fans firstly expect a lot more from the product and secondly live houses are less important to the big two than they were. Back in the 1990s and before there would be promos on localised shows about the next local event, who would be facing who and promos by the wrestlers to hype the event. As these were local promos they didnt matter so much and could be a great place to train your mic skills  Chris Jericho talks about it in his book how he learnt to be a good promo guy by always going to those shoots as they were voluntary so he could just get 5-10 mins to practice in a TV enviroment. I suppose the fans who saw them and went to the shows may react better to the guys who gave a good promo and made them want to come. If you look at his stuff from Mexico and SMW his mic work is awful.  If they havent got proper outlets like that which they can practice and only drills or small croweds in FCW they will never learn. They have a chance in my opinion even if it takes years if there is practice.  Although some guys will never be great promo guys, Billy Gunn standard should be a minimum in that they can talk for 2 mins without boring everybody Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dirty Eddie Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 The problem with Promos is the outletts wrestlers have these days. proper unscripted promo time is a lot less now than it was 10 or 20 years ago. Fans firstly expect a lot more from the product and secondly live houses are less important to the big two than they were. Back in the 1990s and before there would be promos on localised shows about the next local event, who would be facing who and promos by the wrestlers to hype the event. As these were local promos they didnt matter so much and could be a great place to train your mic skills  Chris Jericho talks about it in his book how he learnt to be a good promo guy by always going to those shoots as they were voluntary so he could just get 5-10 mins to practice in a TV enviroment. I suppose the fans who saw them and went to the shows may react better to the guys who gave a good promo and made them want to come. If you look at his stuff from Mexico and SMW his mic work is awful.  If they havent got proper outlets like that which they can practice and only drills or small croweds in FCW they will never learn. They have a chance in my opinion even if it takes years if there is practice.  Although some guys will never be great promo guys, Billy Gunn standard should be a minimum in that they can talk for 2 mins without boring everybody  This is a very good post, I agree with everything other than the Billy Gunn line. Anything past the "...and if you're not down with that..." line, and I started getting sleepy.  While I completely agree with people getting better by practicing in front of TV cameras for local promo spots, they should also consider in-ring promos to be important. By only signing guys in their 20s, they haven't probably had more than a few years on the indys. The more time you spend in front of crowds the better, and lots of small shows give ample promo time to whoever wants it, so ther more time you spend practicing the better you'll get. It can take years for someone to just get confident enough in front of crowds to start improving and getting really good. Bret and Jericho are great examples of guys who struggled for years, then got fantastic later on. If a young Hart or Jericho was put into the scripted WWE skits we get now, both would have really sucked and that sort of thing turns a crowd off a wrestler in a hurry.  This current season of NXT is really showing up how awful a lot of the WWE development talent is on the mic. Especially when they are given god-awful lines to deliver.  They should be locking their young talent in a room with Roddy Piper, Arn Anderson and HBK, schooling then on how to draw real emotion in promos. They shouldn't be just sticking them on TV to be laughed at by the commentators for having to deliver rubbish pre-scripted lines. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Pitcos Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 Bret and Jericho are great examples of guys who struggled for years, then got fantastic later on. Bret who, Hart? I can't imagine anyone thinking he was fantastic at talking unless the only other wrestler they'd seen promos from was John Morrison. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teq Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 Bret and Jericho are great examples of guys who struggled for years, then got fantastic later on. Bret who, Hart? I can't imagine anyone thinking he was fantastic at talking unless the only other wrestler they'd seen promos from was John Morrison. Â When he was on he cut some of the best and most memorable promos around. The post-Wrestlemania promo he did where he slowly went from looking like he was going to apologise, to going full blown heel and blasting America was brilliant. He was tremendous in 1997 and WCW especially the Goldberg promo in Toronto. Â As for the topic. It does seem the case if you look at FCW and their most recent signings, but if there's somebody older who's an Austin-level star in the making they'll do something about it. I can't see them ever setting it in stone to hire only guys in their 20's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dirty Eddie Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 Bret and Jericho are great examples of guys who struggled for years, then got fantastic later on. Bret who, Hart? I can't imagine anyone thinking he was fantastic at talking unless the only other wrestler they'd seen promos from was John Morrison. Â Yeah, I'm talking about 1997 onwards. His anti-America, Hart Foundation stuff was top notch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members tiger_rick Posted January 13, 2011 Paid Members Share Posted January 13, 2011 Bret and Jericho are great examples of guys who struggled for years, then got fantastic later on. Bret who, Hart? I can't imagine anyone thinking he was fantastic at talking unless the only other wrestler they'd seen promos from was John Morrison. His promo's in 1997 are some of the best ever. Anyone who can't see that doesn't know a thing about pro-wrestling. Even earlier than that he was generally decent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loki Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 Anyone who can't see that doesn't know a thing about pro-wrestling. Â You've really not taken PITCOS' nomination very well, have you? Â Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snitsky's back acne Posted January 13, 2011 Author Share Posted January 13, 2011 Bret and Jericho are great examples of guys who struggled for years, then got fantastic later on. Bret who, Hart? I can't imagine anyone thinking he was fantastic at talking unless the only other wrestler they'd seen promos from was John Morrison. His promo's in 1997 are some of the best ever. Anyone who can't see that doesn't know a thing about pro-wrestling. Even earlier than that he was generally decent. Â Have to agree. Hart's heel promos in 97 were outstanding. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Pitcos Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 His promo's in 1997 are some of the best ever. Even if that were true (which it's probably not, depending on whether you include anything in the top million as "best ever" but that's a matter of taste anyway), he'd been a top star for about five or six years at that point. For years he gave interviews with all the confidence, charisma and creativity of a footballer being interviewed on match of the day (pro: made him seem more realistic and stuff; con: unengaging enough that it opened the door for WCW to take over). Those were different times, of course. Does anyone now have the patience to spend six years watching DH Smith, Tyson Kidd or Justin Gabriel pushed as a top star who can't get above "passable" on the mic in the hope that he'll start saying Americans don't have family values at the end of it? Â Your mam doesn't know anything about wrestling! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members IANdrewDiceClay Posted January 13, 2011 Paid Members Share Posted January 13, 2011 Bret Hart's character was meant to perform the type of promos he was doing from 1991-1996. There was no other way his character would get away with cutting anything other than what he was doing at the time, and fans loved him for it. Diesel is a prime example of how a WWF babyface had to act during that era. He was spoon-fed and boring when talking in 1995, which is completely the opposite of what he was in early 1996 when a change in character opened him up a bit. Your role as a pre-attitude era babyface in the WWF was basically going "this Sunday, your in for it matey". Over night you dont turn into one of the best promos in the business (which Hart was in 1997). He was top class during that period. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Pitcos Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 That's the thing, though, Ian. The attitude era and Rock and Austin (and the Road Doggy Doggy Doggayyyyy) came along and ruined it for everyone who came after them. You can't have lads nervously doing "I'm gonna beat you next week" promos they've not properly thought through anymore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Van Dammer Posted January 14, 2011 Share Posted January 14, 2011 People shouldnt take notice of Harts promos in 2010, hed been out of the business for 11 years and not in that live TV environment and I suspect the nature in which promos were prepared had changed alot. Call it a mixture of rust, new methods and just being fucking nervous and unconfident. Â One guy that started really awful and became excellent was Brock Lesnar. He was so lucky he had Heyman at the start and even when he got rid of him he was so shit. Yet by 2003 he was stunning right up until he left. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paid Members IANdrewDiceClay Posted January 14, 2011 Paid Members Share Posted January 14, 2011 People shouldnt take notice of Harts promos in 2010, hed been out of the business for 11 years and not in that live TV environment and I suspect the nature in which promos were prepared had changed alot. Call it a mixture of rust, new methods and just being fucking nervous and unconfident. One guy that started really awful and became excellent was Brock Lesnar. He was so lucky he had Heyman at the start and even when he got rid of him he was so shit. Yet by 2003 he was stunning right up until he left. He said in an interview in 2009 that his speech has been damaged due to his stroke. He'll say words out of order during sentances and things like that. I remember him doing that a lot during the GM run. His voice is much quieter now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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