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Posts posted by Reznor

  1. As horrible as it is in its own right, Starrcade '91 feels even worse when you consider the house show lineups they were running every other night that week, and how much better if it would've been if they'd just went with a similar card to those.

    Compare and contrast with the Christmas day Omni card for example; Sting vs Rude, Dragon/Dustin vs Double A/Beautiful Bobby (2 out of 3 falls), Flyin' Brian vs Liger, and the Steiners vs Luger and Austin in singles matches.

    With a lineup like that, on PPV, and with so many title matches, the show would've been a surefire success with the minimum of creative effort - all they'd need to do was put in a bit of thought for an angle to set up Sting/Luger at Superbrawl

    To be fair, I guess they needed a gimmick to sell the event due to a lack of any real money match at the time, but if they had to do Battlebowl, just have a plain old battle royal at the end without all the convoluted, overelaborate bollocks or the lethal lottery tournament that preceded it (although I do agree somewhat with the earlier post - that part's not necessarily a bad idea in theory for a Clash or something). If they needed to differentiate it from a bog-standard battle royal, have it  over two rings - that would create a pretty neat spectacle and you could still follow the action unlike World War III.


  2. 1 hour ago, Merzbow said:

    Here's a house show match but I'm not sure where it took place.

    From the French announcing, Molson adverts and the camera/lighting looking similar to the highlights I once saw from Jacques v Pierre, i'm pretty sure that's from the Jacques Rougeau retirement show in Montreal. I remember reading it was a pretty big crowd too, not far off 20,000 iirc.

  3. Everything points to it being deliberate imo. The set up; the look of the 'slam'; the camera widening; the skirting around that panel prior to the spot; the fact that they went back up a second time and that it was built as a big spot when it wasn't (relative to what had just gone before it). If the planned finish was in the ring, how was Foley supposed to get back down?


    In addition, if it was supposed to hold, where was the lawsuit? In that country, with that negligence and with the obvious injury, it would have been inevitable. As would Foley being more than a bit angry at the fuck-up.


    Jacque Rougeau was always a cunt to jobbers. Whether it was in the Fabulous Rougeaus or with the Quebecers, he was just a prick. I dont think it was anything personal either, he was just that way. Always ragging people about by the hair, slapping them when in submission holds, just nasty annoying stuff. Then when he had Pierre Oulette with him, they stiff the fuck out of those poor sods. The Cannonball always looked rough. And always great to watch as well. The Quebecers were always the best squash matches.

    In relation, I watched The Rougeaus Vs Rockers from the WWF London 1989 show, and Jacques Rougeau is a fucking treat in that match. His heeling up in that match is superb.


    Absolutely. Because he was brilliant. And the Fabuous Rougeaus were brilliant. Arguably the benchmark for comical, chickenshit heels. .They could get more entertainment, more value, and more reaction out of 10 minutes of stalling and generally just pissing about without even coming into contact with their opponents than most wrestlers today can get from the onslaught of incessant highspots, choreographed reversals and sequences which typify their matches. Underrated babyfaces too from what I can tell from seeing a limited amount of their earlier Montreal stuff.


    Their hour long matches with the Rockers have always been a bit of a holy grail for me. None of them probably exist on film but at least there’s loads of Rougeau matches from those type of shows that Richard Land uploads which capture them in their element and is probably the next best thing. From those shows, the Genius is another guy who was great at that sort of hammy schtick too. It’s a simple act really. Mince around, be a prick, cheat like feck and piss the fans off, make them want to see you get your arse handed to you, then duly give them what they want in the most overblown, exaggerated way. It should be easy in theory, but only relatively few heels had the character, attitude, timing and instincts to actually do it well.


    Sadly, it's a part of American wrestling that's now practically extinct. You look at the insipid, soulless wrestling landscape today and see modern fans more influenced by wrestling from other countries. They're entirely fixated by the moves, workrate and snowflakes at the expense of all the dramatics and pantomine which was such an important part of what made wrestling what it was before the Attitude era came along.


    Why would a non-contracted job guy be ripping one of the oldest heads in there? He must have been an idiot.

    Probably because he'd done so many jobs for the fed he thought he was familiar enough to do it. So yeah, he's thick as fuck.


    Also, they mention if you ever see Fatu doing the big splash to the outside on a jobber, that means that jobber had done something before hand and the Headshrikers wanted to hurt him. As you'd imagine, that belly splash with no support under you is stiff as fuck.



    They done that more than once? Nice visual, but not exactly the most soundly thought out idea if that was the reason.


    Another Headshrinker example was a squash I saw a few years back where Samu murdered a ham'negger with a ghostbuster and he just lay unconscious on the apron for the rest of the match (after being manhandled into that position). You'd assume his lights were out legit if he never moved, yet he appeared to just get left there as the match continued - no bugger even bothered to attend to him. Looked a bit odd.


    The full listing for the Hidden Gems collection that goes up this week:

    * Lou Thez vs. Ray Gunkel - 2 out of 3 Falls 30/5/51

    * Dave Ruhl vs. Gino 'Gorilla Monsoon' Morella 16/3/61

    * Gagne-Metrics 23/9/64

    * NWA World Title Match: Dory Funk Jr. © Vs. Gene Kiniski 11/2/69

    * Andre's Feat of Strength 12/1/76

    * Vince McMahon interviews Muhammed Ali 12/6/76

    * NWA Champion vs. WWF Champion: Harley Race vs. Bob Backlund 22/9/80

    * Mid-Atlantic Championship: Roddy Piper vs. Jack Briscoe © 7/7/82

    * The Last Battle of Atlanta Steel Cage Match: Buzz Sawyer vs. Tommy Rich 23/10/83

    * NWA Title Match: Ric Flair © vs. Barry Windham 20/1/87

    * Smokey Mountain Wrestling, Unabomb vs. The Undertaker 19/8/95

    * Steve Austin vs. Bret Hart, Sun City South Africa 14/9/96

    * Terry Funk's Retirement Match: Terry Funk vs. Bret Hart, ECW 11/9/97

    * William Regal vs. Samoa Joe, Universal Pro Wrestling 11/10/2000

    * FCW Title Match: Seth Rollins © vs. Kassius Ohno 29/4/12


    Oh god thats a day gone! I am intrigued about Taker in SMW.



    That would have been from their huge Superbowl of Wrestling show, which took place a few weeks before that date. 19/08 would have been the TV airdate of the highlights


    Despite never airing, the full show is out there on the streaming sites if you can put up with the low res and annoying video counter plastered across the front of the screen. Fantastic show, must be one of, if not the best event in the US outwith the big two during the '90s. Shawn Michaels was on it too.

  7. Man, a lot of fun tag teams being shit on here....


    For stables, it has to be the No Limit Soldiers. The absolute worst and pitiful on every level;


    1) Obviously they were dreadful to watch for wrestling fans.

    2) They were probably the most cringeworthy act ever -  basically a rabble of illiterate halfwits squealing 'hooty-hoo'. There couldn't possibly have been any appeal for fans of any age, far less southern hillbilly ones.

    3) They had to have been utterly disastrous for business as that arsehole who led them had about two appearances in which he (along with Bischoff) rambled a power of nonsense and was probably paid more for it than most of their wrestlers were for their whole years work. 


    I can barely even remember the members apart from them wasting Rey (although Bischoff had been doing his best at that even before their inception) and to a lesser extent BA. There was a tall one, a fat one, and a musclehead white one - all of whom i'm sure were untrained. Konnan was in amongst them too but he fitted in perfectly. The roided guy used to be all over Worldwide and was only memorable to me for having a dropkick that made even Virgil seem like Jim Brunzell.


    If you ever wanted an example to highlight just how insane the gulf was at that time and how doomed WCW were, you only had to look at the no limit soldiers. How can you explain why they were ever a thing? The only non-negative thing I can say about them is that at least when they came on, chances were that the West Texas Rednecks wouldn't be far away so there would at least be some fun in the segment, however embarrassing those dribbling idiots were.


    I guess you could point to the fact that they were short-lived therefore insignifcant in the grand scheme of things compared to teams and factions who stunk up our TVs for years on end, but they were that bad and It really must be stressed that their 'hooty-hoo' bullshit genuinely is about the lamest, most excruciating thing I've ever came across in the world of wrestling.

  8. This has probably been posted before but I've never seen it.


    Backstage footage from the WCW Great American Bash in 1988;



    Well I haven't and it was great, so nice find. Absolute mentalists.


    Coke or not, Hawk sounds like a complete roaster though. I can imagine loads of folk just tried to dodge him backstage.




    I've been finished with all current day wrestling for a year or more now, so i'm always looking for stuff from the days when wrestling was good to keep me interested. Right now, if i'm on youtube, chances are i'm on Richard Land's page which is an absolute goldmine, not only of rare matches, but loads of full WWF cards from the mid 80s up to '90 from all the big arenas - with new ones seemingly uploaded on a daily basis.  I knew that MSG shows were taped and aired in full up until just after WM8, and that you got the odd match from some of the other big arenas - Boston/Maple Leaf Gardens, Copps, Philly Spectrum & LA Sports Arena... on Prime Time until 89/90, but I had no idea all these aired in full on local networks.


    They're very cool. Not exactly PPV level matches, but they're not normally phoned in house show non-efforts either. In some ways they're actually better than TV matches as they don't have the same restrictions, there's more crowd interaction etc. Especially when watching the likes of the Fabulous Rougeau Brothers and other such great arsehole heels.


    I just hope he's still got plenty more of them to put up!

  9. Jeff Hardy has hinted at wanting to top Shane's HIAC dive tonight at Slammiversary. He is going to kill himself, isn't he? The Swanton from the balcony on to Matt a few months ago was crazy enough!


    There's every chance. And if he doesn't then at best, he's already consigned himself to an excruciating middle age probably wishing he was dead.


    He's a moron. You could have had some sympathy for him back in the WWE when it could be argued that the self destruction and trauma he put himself through was a somewhat necessary, if risky, means to an end in terms of career advancement. But in TNA it's not even like there's any purpose to his stunts any more. He's already at the top of that small tree, nobody will see it, and he won't be any better off because of it tomorrow morning than he is this morning.

  10. 1991 was amazing, whatever needed to be done to make things succeed wouldn't have been half as much fun as what they did do!


    Yeah, it's my favourite year. I'm resisting the urge to just wax lyrical at all the stuff I loved and I guess if i'm going to stick my nose in, I should at least contribute something. So I'd have made sure that SNME's continued after the April one.


    I'd also have run a June PPV; not a KOTR but a Wrestlefest or something as there was loads going on with few outlets for scores to be settled or furthered between WM and Summerslam. The novel and excellent Desert storm match deserved a grander stage than a standard MSG show, Taker/Warrior needed to happen, and the undercard could have been filled with all sorts of cool shit like Dragon/Perfect, Hitman or Piper/Dibiase, Rockers/Nasties, Bossman/Mountie, Jake/Quake etc.


    I wouldn't change a thing with the main feuds, title reigns or with Rumble and Mania booking (except maybe dropping a couple like Tito/Mountie and Tornado/Bravo). I'd have tried to get Taker and/or Jake into the Summerslam main but otherwise that show is perfect (or at least near perfect - perfect would have required HBK to be fit for the Rockers to replace the Bushwhackers even though that match was fine for what it was). Survivor Series should have had Jake and Savage in to make a 4 v 4 as that 6 man was crap, and they didn't need to be completely kept apart to sell TTIT. I still liked the rest of the show though - even the one with the tag teams which bores the living shit out of everyone else.


    Jake's character was amazing after the heel turn but he virtually had no matches which was a big disappointment. The Dragon was criminally underused too and that was a big missed opportunity for me, so I'd have rectified things with regards to those two. When you think of all the missed opportunites like all the potential matches those two could have had on TV, I wish the WWF's weekly TV model was closer to WCW's. At the very least, Superstars and Challenge should have had a name v name main event per week.


    Last but by no means least, I'd have made sure the Coach never existed.


    Not much could've been done about the following but some random wishlists..... I wished the Bully had hung around longer. And Martel never disappeared after Mania. Would've been nice if Rude could've stayed to follow through with the Bossman feud in late '90 then onwards instead of doing nothing until WCW in October but I guess that was a legal thing. And I wish Andre would have been fit enough to have a real match or two, v Earthquake and maybe Perfect.

  11. The Shellshock looked super when he was smashing two jobbers a time with it, doing that funny little march round the ring. I think it's a decent finisher to he fair, it gives a good visual.


    The best one he ever done was the one he botched on Paul E. It was practically a fishermans jackhammer. He should totally have tweaked it to be like that all the time, it looked great

  12. The rest of the show was great. Sami Zayn and Kevin Owens in particular did an incredible job of getting the fans back into the show after Enzo left looking dead. I really enjoyed all the shenanigans that connected Sami and Kevin's match to Miz and Cesaro's too. Kevin Owens was a riot on commentary.


    Any goodwill I had for that Zayn/Owens match (and there was a fair bit of it) was instantly wiped out with that spot. Stuff like that is bad enough under any circumstances, but it was made even worse and more incredible by the fact it was used it to make the heel look all brave and full of heart & fight! My face probably resembled Clint Eastwood in Gran Torino a bit when I witnessed that shit.


    I really want to like (dislike) Kevin Owens. From what I've seen, outside of the ring he's fantastic as a bad guy, but between the ropes, nonsense like that makes it difficult to take to him. Not that Zayn's blameless either as he either called it or went along with it, and he had a similar spot earlier in the match.


    It would be nice for a dinosaur like me if they could find a way of eliminating all traces of that indie mindset from these types of guys.

  13. The middle one in that island boys pic is The Tonga Kid (Rikishi's brother, one half of The Islanders with Haku) I think.

    It is. He was really good too. Surprising and disappointing that he appeared to do nothing after the 80s. I don't think I ever saw him again after leaving WCW in 1990.


    Cracking photo that btw. Can't be too often that you have the opportunity to snap half a dozen nationally recognised wrestlers just hanging around without necessarily any reason for them all being in the same place.

  14. Anyone else got zero interest in this?


    I've a token interest in reading about it as the whole cross promotion thing is quite intriguing and unusual, and maybe gives some hints as to who's on the WWE radar 


    That said, modern cruiserweight wrestling is just the absolute worst (generalisation intended) and you couldn't pay me to watch it.. A tournament full of sped-up, characterless, choreographed and overelaborate indie excess is my idea of wrestling hell. 

  15. The matches I remember most are the ones v Naked Mideon, Rikishi etc where we'd get those tremendously funny facials.


    Which is not to say I didn't like him doing all the brawling or technical stuff as that was always great too. He did have a unique way about him but to me that just differentiated him and was most definitely a positive. I do remember that the opinion posted on the last page of him being lumbering and shit tended to be the prevalent view among sections of the old internet workrate community.


    As great as many of his matches and runs have been, if all I could see was endless commisioner office skits and goodwill ambassador commentary of Al Snow matches, i'd still be as happy as a pig in shit. 


    He's a fine man. The world of American wrestling would have been a whole lot gloomier and less interesting over the past two decades without the presence of the bold William.

  16. Fuck yeah. His 2 out of 3 title match with Flair on the Clash is brilliant. And it's even with having it's time cut. Imagine how much better it would have been with more.


    Aye, that was one of the examples in my mind as I typed that, along with the other good big show matches that stand out like the ones vs Taylor, Double A and Bad Brad.


    But I don't just say that because of the high profile PPV/Clash stuff. With the tonnes of TV WCW had, it felt like he was involved in good stuff every week - there was so much of it, it's actually hard to remember. As much as PPVs went to shit after Superbrawl, week to week TV was still fun and Beautiful Bobby was a large part of that.

  17. How about the Scaffold match with Steve Austin and Terry Taylor vs Bobby Eaton & PN News from Great American Bash 1991? Scaffold matches tend to be tedious with only a few exceptions but this one didn't even have the payoff of someone taking the big bump at the end. The finish is absolutely awful, where Eaton captures the flag from the heel teams end but neither the fans nor the commentators realised the match had ended. The guys just pretty much stopped fighting and climbed down.


    The worst part thing about that one was that Austin had just arrived, Eaton was absolutely tearing it up as a babyface, and the two of them were in somewhat of a rivalry after Austin took Bobbys TV title. A title rematch was the natural option and it would be an understatement to say that show was absolutely crying out for a good ol’ wrasslin match which those two would have delivered in spades. Instead we got the scaffold nonsense as described above.


    Everybody loves Beautiful Bobby and with good cause, but it’s mostly for the tag stuff. That short spell post-Midnights and pre Alliance is such an overlooked and underappreciated period in his career imo. He was one of the best in the business in 1991. 

  18. Whilst I wholeheartedly agree with the calls for Zigglers inclusion, him being reprieved wasn't even the biggest travesty of the episode. That went to throwing the Nasty Boys in. Crazy stuff! Prior to their mid '90s babyface spell, the Nasties were great in every way. They were easily a 0.9 on the Fr. Larry Duff scale. 


    Throwing the Honky Tonk Man in wasn't much less of a crime, but he's probably suffering from the Raven effect with shoot interviews etc. Of course, that's no excuse for consigning him to the room of shit but at least gives some kind of explanation.


    Also, Brutii only really deserves to be considered post-accident as there wasn't much wrong with him around 88-90. His popularity back then was no accident, and it wasn't due to Hogan either.


    EDIT: it just occurred to me that i'm going on a 2 or 3 week memory here so if any of those above were actually saved from the bin, then the point still remains for giving them credence and genuine discussion anyway! Likewise with Sid and Nash (whose discussion was at least funny if unwarranted for anything other than the booking!)

  19. I had some time to kill yesterday and ended up watching it against my better judgement. I never got a whole lot out of it, but I did enjoy the tag opener which was a lot of fun. It was a bit too modern for me to love it, but they got me into it despite having never heard of either team. It at least stuck to the traditional principles of American wrestling and for that it was a breath of fresh air. I particularly loved that creative hot tag cut off spot, which may be my favourite spot of the year so far.


    Also of note, Nakamura's entrance theme is pretty stunning, and Justin Credible being shunned was also amusing to the childish part of me. Oh, and Vinces old 80s jacket (minus badge) making a reappearance was kinda neat I guess.


    Kinda struggling for much more. Probably fair to say it's not a fed/brand i'm likely to become a fan of. 

  20. Yes! From what I've seen I've really enjoyed. In fact it was him who threw Lawler onto a table like a piece of paper breaking Lawler's leg leading to an awesome moment when he came back. And, of course, taking the "blood oat (sic)" that you mentioned.


    An absolutely spectacular visual and looked hurty as hell. And the best part of two decades before ECW invented all that sorta stuff! 


    His feuds with Lawler seem to be his most high profile in Memphis and is what I'm most keen to see more of, but I've got a suspicion that not a lot of it is out there on tape. That's the frustrating thing with some Territories which i'm finding out with Smoky Mountain in particular at the moment as I try to go through it from week to week. The TV shows are great for what they are, but ultimately the weekly TV was made for the locals. Their main purpose was to promote the arena/coliseum shows where the great in-ring stuff happens, and not much of that tended to be shown on TV. It's how it had to be and obviously it was never made for fans halfway across the world watching it retrospectively, but you can't help but think of the insane amount of great stuff that's no doubt been lost to time despite being taped (or at least being on shows where some taping was going on).


    I used to always have that disappointment with '90s/early '00s lucha libre when maybe 2 or 3 matches aired from 10-11 taped per week, but looking back to pre-90s US regional promotions, I imagine the the same will apply. Fortunately in LeDuc's case, at least his promos will survive!

  21. Is anybody familiar with Jos LeDuc? I’ve known the name for years but it wasn’t until a few weeks ago that I stumbled across some of his interviews and started to see what he was all about. I was instantly captivated and have since been through everything I can find of his on the streaming sites. Only a limited amount of footage seems to have been uploaded, but from the promos, angles and matches, it’s more than enough for me to say with certainty that he was pretty great!


    For anyone not familiar with him, he was a wild and rugged Canadian lumberjack strongman who exuded an incredible aura of legitimacy, menace and unpredictability. He had a great look with those eyes giving psychotic facial expressions to rival Waylon Mercy. He was entirely convincing on the mic with fantastic promos, and his ring work befitted the character perfectly. The strongman feats he regularly done for TV skits didn’t hurt in establishing his credentials and aura either, and in “The Canadian Freight Train” he also had one of the best and apt monikers around. And yet for all that scariness, it appears that he had a few decent babyface runs which he managed to pull off without watering down the character too much.


    It’s a shame he doesn’t seem to be very relevant today because I’d say he’s essential viewing for any fans of wild and unhinged brawling characters. He’ll probably be best remembered for slicing himself up with an axe on live morning TV and that act would encapsulate his character pretty well, but there was obviously so much more to him than the controversial shock stuff.


    They just don’t make them like that any more, and I need to see loads more of him. You should check him out if you can – just don’t call him crazy....

  22. PN News, Tracey Smothers, The Musketeer from ECW, Glacier, and Wrath/Bryan Clarke all probably fit this criteria pretty soundly for me also.

    That's nuts, why on earth would you consider Tracy Smothers untalented and be a bit ashamed to say you're a fan of him? He was an absolutely fantastic wrestler and one of the best around in the 90s.


    To be fair, there's loads of posts on here that seem to have overlooked that #3 part of the criteria


    In the wider picture, the whole concept of 'Guilty pleasures' is a bit of a cop out anyway. Folk should have a bit more conviction about them.

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