MMA: Past Fight Discussion

[straightarmbar]

Some Elvis look-alike called Nakano in a Bushido (UWFI) match on Sky. Totally covered in blood his opponent just kept slipping each time he tried to grip.. Elvis went on to win with a knee in the head.

 

+ anything with Gary Albright or Dan Severn

[Egg Shen]

mentioned this in the General MMA friend but Steve Austin has posted the 2nd part of his Ken Shamrock interview (http://podcastone.com/Steve-Austin-Show-Clean), the first part is basically the story of Shamrock's upbringing but the 2nd part Ken focuses on his fighting career and the early days in the worked shoot organisations...considering there's been some discussion about worked shoots recently it's worth listening to get Ken's view on it all, some great stuff about UFC 1 and his later fights.

 

It's probably stories he's told before but it's worth listening too, Ken's refreshingly honest about his short comings as a fighter later in his career.

 

[Dzeko10]

I've been rewatching Ultimate Fighter Bisping vs Mayhem recently. I've forgot how good a season it actually is with the pranks, fights and what not. Bisping steals the show though he always gets one over Mayhem and his coaching staff. I forgot how many current UFC fighters are on it doing really well also, Dodson, TJ, Caraway, Akira, Bermudez. One of the funniest things watching it back is seeing how much of a bitch Bryan Caraway is, from complaining that he doesn't think hes good enough to having Akira shave his head, great TV!

[Egg Shen]

yeh some top fighters came off that season.

 

oh, and this happened:

 

[wandshogun09]

Haha I forgot all about Bisping stacking it.

 

Yeah, TUF 14 was good. One of the better TUFs in recent years. Bisping is ideal for TUF, which I guess is why he's probably spent more time on TUF than any other fighter, between his time on TUF 3 and his two stints as coach. And Mayhem was the perfect foil for him.

 

Good fights as well from the guys mentioned. You had Diego Brandao in there as well, and he looked like a killer on that show. Akira was a cock but I did love that bit where he buzzed a bit of Mr Miesha Tate's hair off while he was asleep. The look on his face was priceless.

 

Also, if you've got the DVD set, it's uncensored. And I remember Akira saying something like "I'll make you my wife, cunt" to one of the other fighters. Only time I remember hearing the word 'cunt' on a UFC show

[Dzeko10]

Haha I forgot all about Bisping stacking it.

 

Yeah, TUF 14 was good. One of the better TUFs in recent years. Bisping is ideal for TUF, which I guess is why he's probably spent more time on TUF than any other fighter, between his time on TUF 3 and his two stints as coach. And Mayhem was the perfect foil for him.

 

Good fights as well from the guys mentioned. You had Diego Brandao in there as well, and he looked like a killer on that show. Akira was a cock but I did love that bit where he buzzed a bit of Mr Miesha Tate's hair off while he was asleep. The look on his face was priceless.

 

Also, if you've got the DVD set, it's uncensored. And I remember Akira saying something like "I'll make you my wife, cunt" to one of the other fighters. Only time I remember hearing the word 'cunt' on a UFC show

 

Akira was a massive cock but he was hilarious shaving Caraway, starting the stuff with Dustin Neace which started that pull apart brawl and of course him celebrating right infront of Neace after getting the controversial win.

 

Come to think of it I'd rank this season the fourth best one.

 

Season 1

Season 3

Rashad vs Rampage

Mayhem Miller

 

Akira was a massive cock but he was hilarious shaving Caraway, starting the stuff with Dustin Neace which started that pull apart brawl and of course him celebrating right infront of Neace after getting the controversial win.

 

Come to think of it I'd rank this season the fourth best one.

 

Season 1

Season 3

Rashad vs Rampage

Mayhem Miller

Edited August 25, 2014 by Dzeko10

[jimufctna24]

 

 

Come to think of it I'd rank this season the fourth best one.

 

Season 1

Season 3

Rashad vs Rampage

Mayhem Miller

 

Good list 

 

The Mir vs Nog season was pretty slick. Season 5 with the Lightweights was strong. I also enjoyed The Smashes.

 

Last one I watched was Jones vs Sonnen, and I gave up on that halfway through.

[Magnum Milano]

 

Good list 

 

The Mir vs Nog season was pretty slick. Season 5 with the Lightweights was strong. I also enjoyed The Smashes.

 

Last one I watched was Jones vs Sonnen, and I gave up on that halfway through.

 

I'm pretty sure I'd have Mir vs Nog top 3, though come to think about it there really wasn't a complete dud season in the first 8 (though nothing stands out much from season 7 bar JT Money losing it after filming had finished, kicking out windows of a limousine and harrassing hotel staff, plus it also had Matt Brown as this silent assassin type).

 

Whilst TUF 4 has this which automatically makes the season worth watching and may be my favourite thing ever from the show.

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BCKW3rT9Wng

[Egg Shen]

yeh the Mir/Nog season has to be up there.

 

...Junie Browning.

[wandshogun09]

I'm pretty sure I'd have Mir vs Nog top 3, though come to think about it there really wasn't a complete dud season in the first 8

I wasn't a big fan of TUF 2. The heavyweight fights were quite poor, although some of the welterweight fights made up for that (Jorge Gurgel vs Jason Von Flue was really good). Plus the coaches, Matt Hughes and Rich Franklin, weren't going to even fight. That could work with the right guys if there's a grudge or they're big personalities. But not only were Hughes and Franklin not going to fight, they were friends and training partners. The UFC must've realised their mistake there though, when the next TUF featured Tito Ortiz and Ken Shamrock as coaches.

 

TUF 2 had its moments. Luke Cummo was great, Rashad is good in there, there was that 'scarecrow' challenge with Mike Whitehead and Joe Stevenson which was fun. But it was probably my least favourite TUF of the first 10.

 

My top 5 would probably be something like;

 

1. TUF 5: Penn vs Pulver

2. TUF 8: Nogueira vs Mir

3. TUF 3: Ortiz vs Shamrock

4. TUF 10: Rashad vs Rampage

5. TUF 1: Liddell vs Couture

 

But then I'm leaving out others which I love like TUF 4: The Comeback, TUF 6: Hughes vs Serra, The Smashes and I enjoyed the Ronda vs Miesha one as well. So that Top 5 would probably change daily with me.

 

TUF 4 probably should be in my Top 5 actually. I loved that. Serra was awesome, Shonie was awesome, Din Thomas, Mikey Burnette, Pete Sell. The Serra vs 'Marc Lemon' argument posted above, Serra's impressions of Ken Shamrock on TUF 3, Cote dubbing Charles McCarthy 'Captain Miserable' with the cartoons, Shonie's bottle raft and blinging up of household items, Jeremy Jackson getting kicked off for sneaking out for a blowjob of a female lifeguard, Serra's taking the piss out of Franklin's crap advice. I could go on. Just a great mix of characters.

 

Plus it was really interesting to see the beginnings of the GSP-Hughes-Serra triangle rivalry. This was really the birth of that with Hughes being a cock to GSP at the restaurant (GSP: You can teach me something, Hughes: The defence to the armbar?), Serra starting to dislike Hughes, Serra's interaction with GSP.

 

A great TUF. A lot of people act like it was a poor season but I strongly disagree. It's one of the more entertaining TUFs ever for me.

[Dzeko10]

I've not watched in years but was the Team UK vs USA one any good?

[Egg Shen]

i've personally enjoyed all the country vs. country based shows, i even thought the Canada/Australia show was better than most people gave it credit for (though i think thats more to people being so burnt out on the concept they didnt give it a chance).

 

but to answer you're question, yeh i'd recommend it.

[wandshogun09]

The TUF: Canada vs Australia season just didn't seem worth it to me. I didn't watch a second of that or TUF: China, I don't think. With the Canada vs Australia one, the fact they had Patrick Cote and Kyle Noke coaching really didn't appeal to me. Good fighters but some guys just aren't cut out for providing entertainment as a TUF coach. Neither guy is very interesting.

 

It's just a tired format and the guys getting on there aren't that entertaining or likeable on the whole. Even if the fights are good, so what? There's 50 UFC shows a year now, there's Bellator, WSOF, OneFC. Fights alone aren't enough to make a TUF season good.

 

I watched TUF 19 with Penn and Edgar and regretted it as well. By the end of that season I wished I hadn't bothered. And they're two of my favourite fighters. There'll still be the odd fun TUF when they get the perfect storm of - right coaches and a few interesting contestants. But for the most part, TUF is dead. It's at the point for me where I'd actually much rather rewatch old TUFs than most of these new ones. Seeing Serra having a go at Lemon or Shamrock call Tito a "bitch monkey" for the 50th time is still more entertaining than the majority of today's TUF output.

 

Saying that, I'll give TUF 20 and TUF Latin America a go. The title being on the line for TUF 20, plus the fact there's fighters I'm familiar with going in gives me high hopes for that one. Plus I'm kind of interested to see how Pettis and Melendez interact. And TUF Mexico just because it's something new, new market that could provide some much needed talent to the lighter weight classes down the line.

 

So I'll give them a chance. How long I'll stick with them depends. But stuff like the Cote vs Noke and Carwin vs Nelson seasons, I don't blame people for not being arsed or giving them a chance.

 

As for TUF 9, I liked it. Nice contrast between Bisping being a loudmouth and Hendo quietly taking note for his revenge later. The USA vs UK dynamic was fun. Some decent fights. And an awesome finale with Sanchez vs Guida, Wilks vs Johnson, Lytle vs Burns and Diaz vs Stevenson all delivering. Especially Sanchez vs Guida.

[jimufctna24]

 

 

TUF 4 probably should be in my Top 5 actually. I loved that. Serra was awesome, Shonie was awesome, Din Thomas, Mikey Burnette, Pete Sell. The Serra vs 'Marc Lemon' argument posted above, Serra's impressions of Ken Shamrock on TUF 3, Cote dubbing Charles McCarthy 'Captain Miserable' with the cartoons, Shonie's bottle raft and blinging up of household items, Jeremy Jackson getting kicked off for sneaking out for a blowjob of a female lifeguard, Serra's taking the piss out of Franklin's crap advice. I could go on. Just a great mix of characters.

 

Plus it was really interesting to see the beginnings of the GSP-Hughes-Serra triangle rivalry. This was really the birth of that with Hughes being a cock to GSP at the restaurant (GSP: You can teach me something, Hughes: The defence to the armbar?), Serra starting to dislike Hughes, Serra's interaction with GSP.

 

A great TUF. A lot of people act like it was a poor season but I strongly disagree. It's one of the more entertaining TUFs ever for me.

 

It bombed commercially, as it was part of a cooling off period for TUF, after the critically and commercially acclaimed 3rd season, and a good few years before they reached a commercial peak with the 10th season (which is probably my favorite)

 

TUF 4 was probably great on a artistic level, but it had 3 key flaws in my opinion

 

1. At the time due to TUF 3, it was accepted that TUF acted best as a tool to promote a big-time fight. With no coaches battle, TUF 4 did not attempt this.

 

2. UFC was still a young sport in terms of its boom. They had no nostalgia base to really form a proper "comeback" season, if you catch my drift. It was more of a "my career is not going so well season", rather than an outright "comeback" season. It depended on what route they were going with the term "comeback", I was expecting a lot of old-school fighters to be in. If they did it now, they could draw from fighters who had some name value years ago, like Luke Cummo or Houston Alexander. Enough time has passed for a nostalgia boom to kick in. Back then it was a bunch of guys who the casual viewer had not heard of, due to the sport being so young commercially, TUF 1 had only boomed 18 months beforehand.

 

Early casting rumors suggested they might bring in Keith Hackney, which would have given it a real nostalgia feel. Instead we got a bunch of fighters who has been beaten a few times on UFC cards in the years previous. Given the standard of the time, the cast was rich in talent though. Far beyond the talent we would have to deal with in subsequent seasons.

 

3. In this country, there were serious commercial issues. TUF 3 used to air the night after it happened in America. TUF if I recall aired 3 days after. Bravo did not get behind it like TUF 3, as there was no UK involvement.

 

The main problem for me was, I knew who was in the final. Josh Gross leaked the results on Sherdog radio. It was all over Sherdog forums which was on the main page of the site. 

 

TUF 4 for its time was underwhelming. Looking back at your description, it is probably  much better than the standard of today in terms of entertaining TV. But commercially in never stood a chance.

[wandshogun09]

All great points on why it wasn't a successful season in terms of ratings and stuff, but I'm talking about it purely from an entertainment point of view. When I say people act like it was poor, I mean that it's underrated as a fun season to watch. It's only really on here where I see any love for TUF 4.

 

I think the Serra-Lytle final being a total and unexpected dud obviously didn't help, especially because that was the last thing people saw of TUF 4.

 

1. At the time due to TUF 3, it was accepted that TUF acted best as a tool to promote a big-time fight. With no coaches battle, TUF 4 did not attempt this.

This is right. Like I said about TUF 2, having a season where there's no coaches fight at the end takes away from TUF. But what TUF 4 at least had that was unique to that season was the ongoing storyline of the winner getting an immediate title shot. That was enhanced even more by having the champion at the time Matt Hughes and his next opponent GSP around as assistant coaches. I think that really added to the show. Not only did we get some Hughes and GSP interaction ahead of their second fight at UFC 65, but they'd be coaching a bunch of guys from their weight class, one of who would be their next challenger. And look how that worked out with Serra. The GSP, Hughes, Serra thing played out for the next 2-3 years and it all was born from TUF 4, or at least heated up then.

 

 

2. UFC was still a young sport in terms of its boom. They had no nostalgia base to really form a proper "comeback" season, if you catch my drift. It was more of a "my career is not going so well season", rather than an outright "comeback" season. It depended on what route they were going with the term "comeback", I was expecting a lot of old-school fighters to be in. If they did it now, they could draw from fighters who had some name value years ago, like Luke Cummo or Houston Alexander. Enough time has passed for a nostalgia boom to kick in. Back then it was a bunch of guys who the casual viewer had not heard of, due to the sport being so young commercially, TUF 1 had only boomed 18 months beforehand.

True but it was easy enough to get into. I'd only been watching MMA regularly for less than two years when TUF 4 aired. I was only vaguely familiar with the likes of Serra, Shonie, Cote etc. And I don't think I'd ever seen Mikey Burnette or Jeremy Jackson. But each episode before the fight they'd show clips of the guys' UFC fights with all the ups and downs. So say when it was Matt Serra's turn to fight, they played him running BJ Penn close, knocking down Parisyan but losing on points, the backfist KO from Shonie in a fight he was winning. So you could easily get to know the guys story and their road to the house. I know I didn't really know the backstory of the Serra vs Shonie fight but that was another story brewing throughout the show that kept me hooked. The fact Serra not only had to live with the guy who KO'd him, but also had to be on his team and corner him, was great telly. Then we finally got to see them fight in the semis.

 

I don't think nostalgia was a thing really in MMA back then. The UFC had only been going 13 years and most of the guys from the SEG days like Shamrock, Kimo, Tank etc had fought fairly recently in the UFC anyway.

 

Early casting rumors suggested they might bring in Keith Hackney, which would have given it a real nostalgia feel.

And Nick Diaz. The UFC wanted Diaz on TUF 4 but he turned them down. Shame. I'd have loved to have seen Diaz interact with Shonie Carter. Would've been interesting seeing him living with Jeremy Jackson as well given their history.

 

The main problem for me was, I knew who was in the final. Josh Gross leaked the results on Sherdog radio. It was all over Sherdog forums which was on the main page of the site.

Ah I missed the spoilers. I wasn't a big internet user back then. I was working ungodly shifts for my uncle's construction company, doing Muay Thai every week and drinking heavily. Then I'd roll in all pissed and bruised and watch TUF 4, which I'd set to record off Bravo on a shitty VCR. Seems like a fucking age ago.