Mr. Seven
Mar 2 2010, 22:19
http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/feedarticle/8970918 QUOTE
One of the killers of toddler James Bulger is back behind bars after breaching the conditions of his release from prison.
Jon Venables, 27, who with Robert Thompson abducted and murdered James in February 1993, was released from custody in 2001, but he has been recalled following the breach, a Ministry of Justice spokeswoman said.
She added: "We can confirm that Jon Venables has been recalled to custody following a breach of licence conditions.
"Offenders on licence are subject to strict conditions; if they breach those conditions they are subject to immediate recall.
"There is a worldwide injunction in place that prohibits any reporting including reporting on the internet, that could identify him or his location."
Details of the nature of the breach were not released.
Venables and Thompson were aged 10 when they embarked on a crime that stunned the world.
On February 13, 1993, they abducted James from a shopping centre and killed him on a railway line.
The toddler's battered body was found by children playing on a freight railway line 200 yards from Walton Lane police station, Liverpool, and more than two miles from the Strand shopping centre.
Days later Venables and Thompson were arrested in connection with the murder of James, and later charged. They were the youngest to be charged with murder in the 20th century.
Copyright © Press Association Ltd. 2010, All Rights Reserved.
Anyone care to guess what The Daily Mail's headline will be?
Astro Hollywood
Mar 2 2010, 22:22
Whatever it is, I bet it uses the word 'tot', a word that you never see anywhere else but in shit newspapers talking about kids that are dead or molested. 'Tragic tot'
Yoghurt
Mar 2 2010, 22:28
JON VENABLES IN MUSLIM BENEFIT LINK
QUOTE (Woyzeck @ Mar 2 2010, 22:22)

Whatever it is, I bet it uses the word 'tot', a word that you never see anywhere else but in shit newspapers talking about kids that are dead or molested. 'Tragic tot'
I'll take your "Tot" and raise you a BBC with a Ross kicker. Double or quits on a "Broken Britain". Ever played Daily Mail bingo?
Mr. Seven
Mar 2 2010, 22:46
Nothing will beat the British Times last year when there was talk of scrapping the Pound. A photograph of Big Ben with flames photoshopped over it and the headline "BRITAIN: THE END".
Quentin
Mar 2 2010, 22:49
Speaking of predictable headlines, when the John Terry story was on the front page of The Sun and I bet my manager that the three paragraphs under his picture would contain the words "love rat" and "romped".
I won the bet.
The Sun is also the only place you will ever see the word "Lag".
Anyway, on-topic... Yoghurt wins.
The Sun's more likely to come up with "What's the difference between Terry and John Venables? one was at Selhurst Park, the other's in a Parkhurst cell. Arf."
mick foley
Mar 3 2010, 0:25
Current whispers are that Jon Venables recall to prison may be related to drugs
also led to believe he was returned to prison last week but it's only just come to light in the form of an official press release as one of the tabloids were about to break the story
L_E_T_H_A_L
Mar 3 2010, 0:33
Well, I hope he gets the boiling-kettle-with-sugar-in-it treatment, the evil fucking bastard.
bAzTNM#1 Fan
Mar 3 2010, 0:34
QUOTE (mick foley @ Mar 3 2010, 0:25)

Current whispers are that Jon Venables recall to prison may be related to drugs
There were rumours a couple of years ago that he was being prescribed methodone, which if true, means that a breach of his licence wasn't followed up.
nfc90210
Mar 3 2010, 0:59
QUOTE (L_E_T_H_A_L @ Mar 3 2010, 0:33)

Well, I hope he gets the boiling-kettle-with-sugar-in-it treatment, the evil fucking bastard.
Would you have wished the same treatment on him when he first committed the crime as a ten-year-old?
L_E_T_H_A_L
Mar 3 2010, 3:10
QUOTE (nfc90210 @ Mar 3 2010, 0:59)

QUOTE (L_E_T_H_A_L @ Mar 3 2010, 0:33)

Well, I hope he gets the boiling-kettle-with-sugar-in-it treatment, the evil fucking bastard.
Would you have wished the same treatment on him when he first committed the crime as a ten-year-old?
No. But I would have liked him to live in fear of the fact that it might happen as a ten-year-old. And I would have liked him to be unshadowed by the cloak of anonymity when he was released from prison.
PowerButchi
Mar 3 2010, 3:18
"TRIUMPH FOR COMMON SENSE OVER TAKER OF TRAGIC TOT"
Wendell Cooley
Mar 3 2010, 4:41
QUOTE (L_E_T_H_A_L @ Mar 3 2010, 3:10)

QUOTE (nfc90210 @ Mar 3 2010, 0:59)

QUOTE (L_E_T_H_A_L @ Mar 3 2010, 0:33)

Well, I hope he gets the boiling-kettle-with-sugar-in-it treatment, the evil fucking bastard.
Would you have wished the same treatment on him when he first committed the crime as a ten-year-old?
No. But I would have liked him to live in fear of the fact that it might happen as a ten-year-old. And I would have liked him to be unshadowed by the cloak of anonymity when he was released from prison.
Why? So someone could attack him? Would that make the world a better place or something?
L_E_T_H_A_L
Mar 3 2010, 6:20
From today's copy of The Sun:
QUOTE
ONE of the killers of toddler James Bulger was back in prison last night after breaching the conditions of his release.
Jon Venables, now 27, broke strict rules which include a ban on him contacting his fellow murderer Robert Thompson or the Bulger family.
Venables and Thompson - given new identities when freed in 2001 - killed two-year-old James on Merseyside in 1993.
The mother of murdered James said last night that Venables' arrest was "justice" for her son.
Murdered ... James Bulger, twoDenise Fergus spoke out on her Twitter site: "Would like to let everyone know jon venables is where he belongs tonight behind bars this is my sons justice."
Her husband Stuart Fergus added that he was "thinking when will this all end for my wife!!!"
News of Venables' return to prison came two weeks before James would have celebrated his 19th birthday.
Venables and his killer pal Thompson were handed new identities when they were freed in 2001 - along with a list of conditions, banning them from contacting each other or the Bulger family.
CCTV film ... James is led awayVenables was also ordered not to return to Merseyside - where he and Thompson committed their terrible crime when they were ten - without the written consent of his probation officer.
A spokesman for Denise, 42, said: "She has always said she did not believe it was safe to parole Venables and Thompson at the age of 18 before they had ever spent a day in an adult prison.
"She believes this breach of parole shows she was right.
Worry ... mum Denise"The Probation Service has promised to keep Denise informed about progress in the case and has assured her she was not in danger at any time.
"But she believes she and the public have a right to know what Venables has done and what is to be done with him now he is an adult offender."
Venables was locked up again after being subject to "immediate recall". He will remain behind bars INDEFINITELY until the Parole Board decides if and when he can be re-released.
In theory, he could be kept inside for the rest of his life.
It was not clear if he had re-offended or broken other terms of his parole.
A Ministry of Justice spokeswoman said last night: "We can confirm Jon Venables has been recalled to custody following a breach of licence conditions.
"Offenders on licence are subject to strict conditions. If they breach those conditions they are subject to immediate recall."
Hunt ... cops gather evidence where body was found in 1993Criminal law expert Michael Wolkind QC said there was a "significant chance" the breach had been serious after all the trouble taken by the authorities to arrange Venables' new life.
The torture and murder of James after he was snatched from a Bootle shopping mall shocked the world.
The pals threw modelling paint in the tot's face, kicked him and beat him with bricks, stones and a 22lb iron bar. Then they stuffed batteries in his mouth.
James' mutilated body was found on a railway line in nearby Walton two days later. His injuries were so severe medics were unable to determine how he died.
Freed ... Robert Thompson
Venables and Thompson - the youngest children to be convicted of murder in English history - were freed amid controversy over how long they should have served.
And in an unprecedented move, they were granted anonymity for the rest of their days.
Advertisement
Even the jail where Venables is being held cannot be disclosed because of a legal injunction.
He is there under his assumed name, but other lags may soon cotton on to his true identity.
It is not even possible to tell how Venables has changed from the last picture of him when he was a boy.
He is entitled to launch an appeal in a bid to regain his freedom.
Laurence Lee, his solicitor at the time of the 1993 murder, said last night he was "shocked" by the dramatic development.
quote the raven
Mar 3 2010, 7:06
To all you do gooders, that are saying he should not be harmed, and they where only 10
I do hope you never ever have kids. These two should have rotted for natural life for what they did. Being 10 is no defence. With any luck the father will find out where they are and do what he said on tv.
If the man gets found out and fucked up, so what maybe just maybe he might feel a tiny bit of the terror that baby did when they killed him on the railway tracks by chucking rocks at his head while he screamed for his mummy.
How on earth people can feel sorry for them is madness.
L_E_T_H_A_L
Mar 3 2010, 7:10
QUOTE (quote the raven @ Mar 3 2010, 7:06)

To all you do gooders, that are saying he should not be harmed, and they where only 10
I do hope you never ever have kids. These two should have rotted for natural life for what they did. Being 10 is no defence. With any luck the father will find out where they are and do what he said on tv.
If the man gets found out and fucked up, so what maybe just maybe he might feel a tiny bit of the terror that baby did when they killed him on the railway tracks by chucking rocks at his head while he screamed for his mummy.
Here, here. Post of the fucking day right there.
SpursRiot2012
Mar 3 2010, 7:54
I like how The Sun keeps pointing out that his licence condition included not contacting the other dude involved in the murder or the Bulger family, when theres no suggestion that he tried to do that at all.
L_E_T_H_A_L
Mar 3 2010, 7:56
QUOTE (SmokeSoapBar @ Mar 3 2010, 7:54)

I like how The Sun keeps pointing out that his licence condition included not contacting the other dude involved in the murder or the Bulger family, when theres no suggestion that he tried to do that at all.
I think it's The Sun themselves that are making that suggestion, Soap.
quote the raven
Mar 3 2010, 7:59
QUOTE (L_E_T_H_A_L @ Mar 3 2010, 7:56)

QUOTE (SmokeSoapBar @ Mar 3 2010, 7:54)

I like how The Sun keeps pointing out that his licence condition included not contacting the other dude involved in the murder or the Bulger family, when theres no suggestion that he tried to do that at all.
I think it's The Sun themselves that are making that suggestion, Soap.
Yeah i figured that. As they are not allowed to say what he did they simply said a few things hes not allowed to do. If he was trying to contact the Bulger family maybe its guilt. Which in turn would make him suffer which is a good thing.
tiger_rick
Mar 3 2010, 8:40
QUOTE (quote the raven @ Mar 3 2010, 7:06)

To all you do gooders, that are saying he should not be harmed, and they where only 10
I do hope you never ever have kids. These two should have rotted for natural life for what they did. Being 10 is no defence. With any luck the father will find out where they are and do what he said on tv.
If the man gets found out and fucked up, so what maybe just maybe he might feel a tiny bit of the terror that baby did when they killed him on the railway tracks by chucking rocks at his head while he screamed for his mummy.
How on earth people can feel sorry for them is madness.
Do you know any 10 year olds? They were fucking kids for crying out loud. They shouldn't have been in prison, we should have locked up the bastards who bred them and allowed them to turn out as they did at 10 years old. It's about time we started making an example of the people who plop kids out of their fannies for the fun of it and then leave them to their own devices.
I agree that they shouldn't have been let out because if you take a 10 year old who's fucked up and lock them up for 15 years, you don't create a reasonable member of society. All do you do is completely alienate that person. That combined with the public outrage and you might aswell have had them put down back then.
"I do hope you never ever have kids."
I have a kid. She's a pretty well adjusted 5 year old. What's your point? Are you trying to suggest that I'd feel differently if someone killed her, whatever their age? If so, then yes, I would, of course I would. I love that little girl more than anything on this earth and woe betide anyone who harmed her. So yeah, my ability to be rational would be seriously skewed if I was in that boat. That doesn't change my opinion now I am able to be rational. It's a similar story to those kids in Sheffield last year.
I was brought up on a council estate by a single mother. She did a bloody good job with me and my brothers. A lot of the kids on the estate where in a similar situation but with parents who didn't give a toss. A lot of them ended up getting involved in thieving and drugs. That's not guaranteed to happen but nor is it completely coincidental.
So no, I don't feel sorry for them, they've got to live with it. My anger is reserved for the people who let them turn out like that. It's ridiculously abnormal for a 10 year old and doesn't just happen.
ReturnOfTheMack
Mar 3 2010, 9:00
QUOTE (tiger_rick @ Mar 3 2010, 8:40)

QUOTE (quote the raven @ Mar 3 2010, 7:06)

To all you do gooders, that are saying he should not be harmed, and they where only 10
I do hope you never ever have kids. These two should have rotted for natural life for what they did. Being 10 is no defence. With any luck the father will find out where they are and do what he said on tv.
If the man gets found out and fucked up, so what maybe just maybe he might feel a tiny bit of the terror that baby did when they killed him on the railway tracks by chucking rocks at his head while he screamed for his mummy.
How on earth people can feel sorry for them is madness.
Do you know any 10 year olds? They were fucking kids for crying out loud.
I know/knew 10 year olds who were fully aware of the world and were still evil little fuckwits. Oh sure its because of how they were brought up (usually, though I have known people brought up well turn out to be dicks), but it doesnt stop them being evil.
That said, I agree that it would be more important to try to rehabilitate them from the shitty upbringing, at least give them the chance to change the direction they are taking. I feel the same about the 2 kids here in doncaster, what they did was evil, but they didnt have much of a chance with how their mum and dad treat them.
QUOTE (Quentin @ Mar 2 2010, 22:49)

Speaking of predictable headlines, when the John Terry story was on the front page of The Sun and I bet my manager that the three paragraphs under his picture would contain the words "love rat" and "romped".
I won the bet.
The Sun is also the only place you will ever see the word "Lag".
Anyway, on-topic... Yoghurt wins.
I love some of the Sun's words, some of my favourite examples:
Roly Poly : a fat person
Sozzled: Drunk
Pint sized : A small person
Mystery blonde : A unfamous female seen with a famous male
Puffing : smoking
So the sentance would read:
EXCLUSIVERoly Poly Funnyman James Corden was sozzled after he guzzled
4 pints of lager. Corden, 27, was then seen puffing on a
cigarette whilst chatting to a pint sized mystery blonde.
quote the raven
Mar 3 2010, 10:05
QUOTE (tiger_rick @ Mar 3 2010, 8:40)

QUOTE (quote the raven @ Mar 3 2010, 7:06)

To all you do gooders, that are saying he should not be harmed, and they where only 10
I do hope you never ever have kids. These two should have rotted for natural life for what they did. Being 10 is no defence. With any luck the father will find out where they are and do what he said on tv.
If the man gets found out and fucked up, so what maybe just maybe he might feel a tiny bit of the terror that baby did when they killed him on the railway tracks by chucking rocks at his head while he screamed for his mummy.
How on earth people can feel sorry for them is madness.
Do you know any 10 year olds? They were fucking kids for crying out loud. They shouldn't have been in prison, we should have locked up the bastards who bred them and allowed them to turn out as they did at 10 years old. It's about time we started making an example of the people who plop kids out of their fannies for the fun of it and then leave them to their own devices.
I was brought up on a council estate by a single mother. She did a bloody good job with me and my brothers. A lot of the kids on the estate where in a similar situation but with parents who didn't give a toss. A lot of them ended up getting involved in thieving and drugs. That's not guaranteed to happen but nor is it completely coincidental.
I know lots of 10 year olds my nephew is around that age. So your saying they should never have been locked away? they tried twice to take a child. They even stuck his dead body on the railway track to try and make it look like he was killed by a train. That is evil no if buts or maybe. I wasnt a game that went wrong it was murder planned murder. A 10 year old knows better than to take a small child and cave its head in with a iron bar.
As for your upbringing. How many of the kids on your estate turned into kid killers? Drugs and thieving is one thing killing babys is another. Quite right the parents should also have been locked up. But to allow them to murder freely and then to blame the whole lot on the mum is stupid at best.
tiger_rick
Mar 3 2010, 10:21
QUOTE (quote the raven @ Mar 3 2010, 10:05)

They even stuck his dead body on the railway track to try and make it look like he was killed by a train. That is evil no if buts or maybe.
How the fuck does a 10 year old get a mind like that? What were they allowed to see or read that let them develop that level of "evil"? Blaming a parent is "stupid"? You're having a laugh. If you know lots of 10 year olds, you should know how simple their life is and how honest their minds are.
I totally agree with you that theiving and drugs is a long way from killing a baby. So that just shows how fucking diabolical the upbringing of those children was.
quote the raven
Mar 3 2010, 10:26
QUOTE (tiger_rick @ Mar 3 2010, 10:21)

QUOTE (quote the raven @ Mar 3 2010, 10:05)

They even stuck his dead body on the railway track to try and make it look like he was killed by a train. That is evil no if buts or maybe.
How the fuck does a 10 year old get a mind like that? What were they allowed to see or read that let them develop that level of "evil"? Blaming a parent is "stupid"? You're having a laugh. If you know lots of 10 year olds, you should know how simple their life is and how honest their minds are.
I totally agree with you that theiving and drugs is a long way from killing a baby. So that just shows how fucking diabolical the upbringing of those children was.
I did not say blaming the parents was stupid i was making the point that you said they should never have been locked up, that the parents should.
Re read what i put. I agree with you that the mum/dad are to blame just as much.
"Quite right the parents should also have been locked up. But to allow them to murder freely and then to blame the whole lot on the mum is stupid at best"
Placing 100% of the blame on the mum is stupid.
Just found this in another thread
I'm happy for every case to be judged on it's merits. Anyone who's particularly evil, either a serial killer, a sexual killer or someone who plots to kill a random stanger in cold blood or that sort of thing shouldn't be let out. I don't think people like that can be "cured".
They plotted to kill, so the whole defence is they where 10? what if they where 13? 14?
QUOTE (ReturnOfTheMack @ Mar 3 2010, 9:00)

I know/knew 10 year olds who were fully aware of the world and were still evil little fuckwits. Oh sure its because of how they were brought up (usually, though I have known people brought up well turn out to be dicks), but it doesnt stop them being evil.
That said, I agree that it would be more important to try to rehabilitate them from the shitty upbringing, at least give them the chance to change the direction they are taking. I feel the same about the 2 kids here in doncaster, what they did was evil, but they didnt have much of a chance with how their mum and dad treat them.
It's a difficult issue; of course the parents in both cases are contemptible cunts who should be strung up, but IMO some people, kids or not, are just wired wrong - the capability to do something as evil as that has to be there in the first place, because there are plenty of people who've had shitty upbringings and yet don't murder or torture small children.
For that reason, there has to be an element of punishment as well as rehabilitation in these sentences - like it or not, they are culpable for their actions and need to know that they'll have consequences. Allowing both of those men to live their entire adult lives as free men is no punishment at all, in my opinion. The fact that Venables has apparently gone on to re-offend seems to show that he's not yet been effectively taught that his actions will have consequences.
The Icon
Mar 3 2010, 13:18
QUOTE (L_E_T_H_A_L @ Mar 3 2010, 6:20)

Her husband Stuart Fergus added that he was "thinking when will this all end for my wife!!!"
And you can tell he was serious, because he's used
three exclaimation marks.
The rumours were that he was placed on Teesside, and whispers from back home are that someone had found out who he was, and informed Denise Bulger.
Of course, these are very very tenuous rumours, so take it for what it is.
GalaxyV.2
Mar 3 2010, 15:33
Back where he belongs. End Of
As anyone who has read my opinions on the death penalty/life sentencing will know, i'm usually pretty harsh when it comes to things like this.
I have to say though, these guys were ten years old when they committed that crime.
In my opinion, they should have been placed in care initially to observe their behavior, and their parents should have been the ones to face prison time.
Stylin_and_Profilin
Mar 3 2010, 15:42
Why would the justice office bother with a press release though ?
They've spent hundreds of thousands, i would imagine, giving him a new life and identity. The press have a lifetime banning order on them discussing the identity or whereabouts so technically Jon Venbales doesn't exist anymore except to a close circle of people within the legal system and the social departments.
This will just start off all this crazy stuff from a few years ago when there were people claiming they were served by him in McDonalds or were playing 5 a sides against him. All we need is a News Of The World "WHAT MONSTER MAY LOOK LIKE NOW" headline with a 'artists impression' resembling someone from the Guess Who? board game.
Apparently Bulgers mum tracked down the other lad after some tip-offs a few years ago and managed to located him but couldn't bring herself to confront him face-to-face and planned to do the same with Venables. I remember reading on release that they apparently detested each other when they were locked up so i would be surprised if he's tried to get back in touch with Thomson.
Dr.PeterVenkman
Mar 3 2010, 15:49
A girl from round where I live always used to say she got off with a lad years ago and he ended up cutting himself on some glass by accident at his flat, so they went to hospital and on his chart it said "Child A" where his name should be, it's almost certainly bollocks but it never stopped us singing "shagged a psycho" to the tune of Rock the Casbah everytime she walked in the pub
Speaking of "Boy A", has anyone seen the movie of the same name?
The storyline is quite similar.
Glen Quagmire
Mar 3 2010, 20:43
Those who are saying that Venables is back where he belongs are stupid.
He and Thompson should have been hung after being found guilty.
Dead Mike
Mar 3 2010, 21:35
QUOTE
He and Thompson should have been hung after being found guilty.
When they were fucking 10 years old?? Are you really Gary Bushell?
Glen Quagmire
Mar 3 2010, 23:01
QUOTE (Dead Mike @ Mar 3 2010, 21:35)

QUOTE
He and Thompson should have been hung after being found guilty.
When they were fucking 10 years old?? Are you really Gary Bushell?
Yes, I would have had no problem with them being executed as 11 year olds. If that was too much to stomach, then they could have been imprisoned until they were 16 or 18 and then hung. When I was 10 years old I knew that killing another person was one of the worst things you could ever do so I don't buy the argument that these evil boys did not know of the consequences for what they did. They even tried to cover it up FFS! If you deliberately go out to kill some one and take their life, you must be ready to lose yours.
However seeing that this country has come to this state, the minimum that must happen to Jon Venables is that if he is ever released from prison again, he no longer should have anonymity rights. Since he broke this release licence and betrayed the protection given to him by the state, he should not expect the state's protection any more.
QUOTE (Glen Quagmire @ Mar 3 2010, 20:43)

Those who are saying that Venables is back where he belongs are stupid.
He and Thompson should have been hung after being found guilty.
Hanging 10 year old boys is just as fucked up.
CracktonMoj
Mar 4 2010, 0:28
Hold on a fucking minute here.
These were children. Ten year old children. They weren't even old enough for secondary school. No child of ten has a full understanding of what he or she is doing, because they're so easily impressed. There are ten year old children who still believe in Santa Claus. Why should you expect ten year olds to have any more sophisticated a grasp of reality in other areas?
Never mind though, let's HANG THEM because the SUN says to.
Two ten year olds killing a two year old = String 'em up.
Someone (probably) in their early to mid twenties executing two ten year olds = Justice
Delightful hypocrisy.
Wendell Cooley
Mar 4 2010, 5:20
QUOTE (Magnum @ Mar 3 2010, 12:38)

QUOTE (ReturnOfTheMack @ Mar 3 2010, 9:00)

I know/knew 10 year olds who were fully aware of the world and were still evil little fuckwits. Oh sure its because of how they were brought up (usually, though I have known people brought up well turn out to be dicks), but it doesnt stop them being evil.
That said, I agree that it would be more important to try to rehabilitate them from the shitty upbringing, at least give them the chance to change the direction they are taking. I feel the same about the 2 kids here in doncaster, what they did was evil, but they didnt have much of a chance with how their mum and dad treat them.
It's a difficult issue; of course the parents in both cases are contemptible cunts who should be strung up, but IMO some people, kids or not, are just wired wrong - the capability to do something as evil as that has to be there in the first place, because there are plenty of people who've had shitty upbringings and yet don't murder or torture small children.
For that reason, there has to be an element of punishment as well as rehabilitation in these sentences - like it or not, they are culpable for their actions and need to know that they'll have consequences. Allowing both of those men to live their entire adult lives as free men is no punishment at all, in my opinion. The fact that Venables has apparently gone on to re-offend seems to show that he's not yet been effectively taught that his actions will have consequences.
Erm, they were punished. They were sentenced and served their time. They'll have to live with the guilt for the rest of their lives. Do you really think Thomson and Venebles are living the high life now, chuckling about their youthful indiscretion? You say 're-offend', like he's gone out and killed another kid. He could have just failed to report back to the prison on time or something, y'know.
quote the raven
Mar 4 2010, 7:15
QUOTE (CracktonMoj @ Mar 4 2010, 0:28)

Hold on a fucking minute here.
These were children. Ten year old children. They weren't even old enough for secondary school. No child of ten has a full understanding of what he or she is doing, because they're so easily impressed. There are ten year old children who still believe in Santa Claus. Why should you expect ten year olds to have any more sophisticated a grasp of reality in other areas?
Never mind though, let's HANG THEM because the SUN says to.
On the other hand lets give them short jail time, let them go spend a load of tax money and set them up with new lives.
I still fail to see what part of the planned murder you dont see? It wasnt a accident they planned it they even tried to take another little boy hours before they took james. 10 or not that is a plan they worked on it for a while then made it happen.
They knew what they where doing even down to as i said chucking his body on the tracks in a vain effort to hide what they had done. If as you claim they have no understanding of what they did why did they try and hide it?
If it makes you feel any better hang them now beacuse they arnt 10?
So what your saying is if a 10 yearold kills someone he/she should be left to get away with it because they are 10? wheres the line drawn? 13? 14?
Hanging children eh? How very civilised we are.
Dead Mike
Mar 4 2010, 8:17
You don't know the circumstances in which these children were raised. Just because you were taught the difference between right & wrong & had consciences parents that cared & took an interest in your upbringing doesn't mean they did. Can you remember being 10 years old? Fair enough we're talking about possibly the most extreme circumstances imaginable but to treat an (obviously highly troubled) 10 year old as an adult of sound mind is ridiculous.
tiger_rick
Mar 4 2010, 8:43
QUOTE (quote the raven @ Mar 4 2010, 7:15)

I still fail to see what part of the planned murder you dont see?
No-one misunderstands the circumstances. No-one has tried to justify the crime one bit. It's fucking horrendous, it was then and it is now. I had to look away from the news on TV last night because that CCTV footage still haunts me.
The fact still remains that they were children. As Moj points out, 10 year olds believe in Santa Clause so it's not difficult to see how such a shallow mind could be corrupted enough to perform such a hideous crime. My question is still "How the hell were they allowed to develop into such animals?". I haven't read one single good response to that yet.
Heard on the radio this morning that there was a similar crime in Norway not long after. A 5 year old girl was battered to death by three boys even younger than these two and they tried to bury the body in the Snow. They were back at school within the month. I wonder where they are now?
quote the raven
Mar 4 2010, 9:10
QUOTE (tiger_rick @ Mar 4 2010, 8:43)

QUOTE (quote the raven @ Mar 4 2010, 7:15)

I still fail to see what part of the planned murder you dont see?
No-one misunderstands the circumstances. No-one has tried to justify the crime one bit. It's fucking horrendous, it was then and it is now. I had to look away from the news on TV last night because that CCTV footage still haunts me.
The fact still remains that they were children. As Moj points out, 10 year olds believe in Santa Clause so it's not difficult to see how such a shallow mind could be corrupted enough to perform such a hideous crime. My question is still "How the hell were they allowed to develop into such animals?". I haven't read one single good response to that yet.
Heard on the radio this morning that there was a similar crime in Norway not long after. A 5 year old girl was battered to death by three boys even younger than these two and they tried to bury the body in the Snow. They were back at school within the month. I wonder where they are now?
Much better response than Kiffys. Kif, read what i wrote? At what age do they stop being children?
Rick your quite right that they must have been corrupted and you can only point at the people that looked after them. However once they have set down that path IMO there is no way back for them. Do i feel sorry for them? In part for the people that failed to spot the problems that where growing in the boys. As adults they have been given a life they took and for that i dont agree. Should they have been hanged? probably the murder was about as brutal as it could get and was clearly planned. However that rases the issue of killing a child. Which in turn makes another point. Keep them locked up until 20? then kill them?
Shady area. One thing is clear justice was not carried out in the 8 years they spent playing games all day. As adults they should atleast be forced to explain the actions they carried out and live with the names they where born with not least so people can know whos living next to them, dating their daughter, or worse still baby sitting the kids.
As for Norway i have not read or seen any of report so i cant judge.
Im sure lots of people have had worse upbringing than these two and have not turned into baby killers.
Interesting point brought up by Martin Brunt.
About 1,000 people go to prison in a week - how hard would it be to find any Scousers in their late twenties with a shit attitude? His anonymity's at serious risk now.
Dead Mike
Mar 4 2010, 9:30
Surely the only difference bewteen waiting til' they're 20 & hanging them & hanging them when they're 10 years old is that it's a little easier for the masses to stomach? If you believe that at aged 10 there should be a degree of diminished responsibility, that the parents should be held partially accountable (both boys were obviously troubled, should've been school at the time etc etc) then nothing changes in the decade between the offence & the execution. You're still executing a 10 year old but giving him a long wait?
QUOTE
Shady area. One thing is clear justice was not carried out in the 8 years they spent playing games all day. As adults they should atleast be forced to explain the actions they carried out and live with the names they where born with not least so people can know whos living next to them, dating their daughter, or worse still baby sitting the kids.
The problem with this is that the British public can't be trusted with such information. We've seen paediatrician's cars get torched with a little help from the News of the World. Also, who knows tha they spent 8 years playing games all day? Bit of a tabloid assumption.
As Rick pointed out, no-one's looked at the root-cause, the upbringing & most importantly IMO the fucking parents. Why is this? Because no-one wants to think that they're kids could turn out the same way. There's plenty of scumbag parents in this country who don't give two shits about their kids, don't care if they attend school or not & would probably fit the parenting profile of these two children. These people are also a good chunk of the tabloids readership, hence why when something horrific like this, Columbine or any serious crime innvolving kids happens a scapegoat must be found quickly. Childs Play 3, Marilyn Manson records etc. People need something to point a finger at instead of actually looking at the real causes ,which might bring up a much more unpopular answer.
Stylin_and_Profilin
Mar 4 2010, 9:42
QUOTE (freaky @ Mar 4 2010, 9:28)

Interesting point brought up by Martin Brunt.
About 1,000 people go to prison in a week - how hard would it be to find any Scousers in their late twenties with a shit attitude? His anonymity's at serious risk now.
There was discussion on Radio5 last night about this when i was driving home and there was a few loose suggestions that his identity had been leaked, either through his own indiscretions or otherwise, and that he'd been brought back in on breach of license for his own safety.
quote the raven
Mar 4 2010, 9:44
QUOTE (Dead Mike @ Mar 4 2010, 9:30)

Surely the only difference bewteen waiting til' they're 20 & hanging them & hanging them when they're 10 years old is that it's a little easier for the masses to stomach? If you believe that at aged 10 there should be a degree of diminished responsibility, that the parents should be held partially accountable (both boys were obviously troubled, should've been school at the time etc etc) then nothing changes in the decade between the offence & the execution. You're still executing a 10 year old but giving him a long wait?
QUOTE
Shady area. One thing is clear justice was not carried out in the 8 years they spent playing games all day. As adults they should atleast be forced to explain the actions they carried out and live with the names they where born with not least so people can know whos living next to them, dating their daughter, or worse still baby sitting the kids.
The problem with this is that the British public can't be trusted with such information. We've seen paediatrician's cars get torched with a little help from the News of the World. Also, who knows tha they spent 8 years playing games all day? Bit of a tabloid assumption.
As Rick pointed out, no-one's looked at the root-cause, the upbringing & most importantly IMO the fucking parents. Why is this? Because no-one wants to think that they're kids could turn out the same way. There's plenty of scumbag parents in this country who don't give two shits about their kids, don't care if they attend school or not & would probably fit the parenting profile of these two children. These people are also a good chunk of the tabloids readership, hence why when something horrific like this, Columbine or any serious crime innvolving kids happens a scapegoat must be found quickly. Childs Play 3, Marilyn Manson records etc. People need something to point a finger at instead of actually looking at the real causes ,which might bring up a much more unpopular answer.
Top post that well thought out and posted.
I think it comes down to the same thing, no one knew what to do with them. So they let them go. Turns out if reports are to taken for what they are, he kicked off at work and got in a fight. It also says he has or had a bad drug habit. Maybe hes trying to block out what he did? If so then that would be worse than death.
Id like to be able to talk to these two, or for the reports to be released by the doctors that cared for them.
GalaxyV.2
Mar 4 2010, 10:20
The one thing I would say is they should have served longer in jail. Essentially they never really served for their crime as they were allowed out and the place they were held was hardly 'prison'. I think they should have served at least 5 years in prison.
Tbh I just feel sprry for the mother, she's had a pretty shit life ever since, and this will just bring it all back to her. I hope she finds some peace.
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